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Old 11th May 2010, 16:56   #61
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Problems dont seem to end on my side!

after i thought everything was sorted out & i had finalized on the stag, i got the shocker from AL that the stag is not offered with company fitted power steering. only the lynx has that as option.

we had basically rejected the lynx as it was a tad too big for our requirements. sisira claimed that the lynx would be just our present viking bus minus one last window, so that means its not a mini bus. that also means such a huge bus would consume more fuel.

AL claims the stag would give 6kmpl. if that is true, the lynx would give no more than 4.5-5kmpl.

now the question is, if we are considering the stag in place of the lynx in interests of fuel economy & size-
1) will it make a big difference in mini bus if PS is not fitted? will we easily get drivers for the bus? will it be too hard to drive the bus?
2) AL says the PS unit can be fitted aftermarket for Rs. 70,000. how reliable will that be? should it be done?
3) Do all mini buses in kerela roads have PS?

Last edited by raj_5004 : 11th May 2010 at 16:57.
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Old 11th May 2010, 20:33   #62
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
Problems dont seem to end on my side!

after i thought everything was sorted out & i had finalized on the stag, i got the shocker from AL that the stag is not offered with company fitted power steering. only the lynx has that as option.

we had basically rejected the lynx as it was a tad too big for our requirements. sisira claimed that the lynx would be just our present viking bus minus one last window, so that means its not a mini bus. that also means such a huge bus would consume more fuel.

AL claims the stag would give 6kmpl. if that is true, the lynx would give no more than 4.5-5kmpl.

now the question is, if we are considering the stag in place of the lynx in interests of fuel economy & size-
1) will it make a big difference in mini bus if PS is not fitted? will we easily get drivers for the bus? will it be too hard to drive the bus?
2) AL says the PS unit can be fitted aftermarket for Rs. 70,000. how reliable will that be? should it be done?
3) Do all mini buses in kerela roads have PS?
The current vikings that you have, are they 10m,11m or 12m?
The stag what length are u planning to build it to? more than 8m or less than 8m.

To increase fuel efficiency the fuel pump settings can be tweaked,but then that would affect the time taken by the vehicle to accelerate to a speed of 70-80 with a soft leg on the gas pedal and the pick up while climbing ghat section.

Try and find out if you can source a complete power steering unit for a lynx and then fix it on a stag from TVS cochin. Make sure if the power steering is fitted then it is done by Authorised Service centre.

Power steering could deteriorate over a period of time, if it is an after market one just like the KOYO unit used on some of the jeeps. So sticking to the AL power steering unit would be wise.

Is the power steering worth 70000 if u are not going to keep the vehicle for more than five years of use? I know you haven't stipulated an intended time period of usage.

I dont think all the Mini buses in kerala would have PS.
From 2005 i think it is a requirement for all HCV and MCV to have PS though not sure about LCV.
Is the stag chassis an older one without a PS that the dealer is trying to push on to you? The ALL website says both stag and lynx comes with manual sterring.
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Old 11th May 2010, 20:34   #63
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
Problems dont seem to end on my side!

after i thought everything was sorted out & i had finalized on the stag, i got the shocker from AL that the stag is not offered with company fitted power steering. only the lynx has that as option.

we had basically rejected the lynx as it was a tad too big for our requirements. sisira claimed that the lynx would be just our present viking bus minus one last window, so that means its not a mini bus. that also means such a huge bus would consume more fuel.

AL claims the stag would give 6kmpl. if that is true, the lynx would give no more than 4.5-5kmpl.

now the question is, if we are considering the stag in place of the lynx in interests of fuel economy & size-
1) will it make a big difference in mini bus if PS is not fitted? will we easily get drivers for the bus? will it be too hard to drive the bus?
2) AL says the PS unit can be fitted aftermarket for Rs. 70,000. how reliable will that be? should it be done?
3) Do all mini buses in kerela roads have PS?
I say;

1. Its always wise to fit power steering on any CV, be it LCV or HCV.
2. TVS will retrofit the same power steering unit on your Viking buses on STAG also. (We had purchased a Stag in Dec2008 with PS fitted by TVS. The bus is running fine and we are getting 5.5 to 6KMPL). What you should care is to get back the OE fitted manual steering box on stag back from TVS, you may sell it in local market. This type of aftermarket fitment is reliable for sure, as the Stag engine has the options for the same. Please remember stag & Lynx share the same engine.
3. PS is offered as OE fitment only by Tata in its range of LCV. But now Eicher, Mazda & AL offer it as additional fittment.
4. If its an A/c bus with direct engine driven a/c, do not expect the mileage to be 6kmpl.

Go ahead for AL STAG with PS...for good reasons!
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Old 11th May 2010, 20:44   #64
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Originally Posted by conjon View Post

To increase fuel efficiency the fuel pump settings can be tweaked,but then that would affect the time taken by the vehicle to accelerate to a speed of 70-80 with a soft leg on the gas pedal and the pick up while climbing ghat section.

Try and find out if you can source a complete power steering unit for a lynx and then fix it on a stag from TVS cochin. Make sure if the power steering is fitted then it is done by Authorised Service centre.

I dont think all the Mini buses in kerala would have PS.
From 2005 i think it is a requirement for all HCV and MCV to have PS though not sure about LCV.
Is the stag chassis an older one without a PS that the dealer is trying to push on to you? The ALL website says both stag and lynx comes with manual sterring.
1. Changing the fuel pump setting was an old practice on vehicles with inline FIP. Todays Tata, Eicher & AL (AL - except few models) comes with RotaryFIP. The best way to improve fuel efficiency is to train the driver and do proper & timely maintenance of the vehicle.

2. The PS unit fitted on Lynx, Stag is the same as the one fitted on AL Viking...either Rane or ZF make.
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Old 11th May 2010, 20:51   #65
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firstly congrats for choosing stag as your option because i'll say its really a reliable product.
about power steering dont know if its true but have heard that AL Stag are easy in maneuverability without PS too..this was heard from one of the drivers of greenline travels thrissur. the chassis shared by the vehicle is of the same thickness as the one you see in your vikings. previously way back in 2004 and all stags showed gearbox complaints but after that AL replaced it with the same 5speed syncromesh GB that is found again in their HCV ranges(vikings,1612 etc). so in short ,AL stag is a rugged vehicle that has a 4 cylinder pot and smaller aggregates fitted into a HCV chassis and GB.
There is literally no change in power for lynx and stag since both share the same 120PS engine. dont feel there will be real difference in mileage for lynx and stag even though lynx may weigh a little more.

BTW heard one news that AL 12M bus supported by engine driven AC is pulling out a mileage of 4.5KMPL...is this true?? bus in the story is a full fixed glass ac bus of Badboy travels from thrissur.
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Old 11th May 2010, 23:00   #66
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[quote=raj_5004;1880245]Problems dont seem to end on my side!

after i thought everything was sorted out & i had finalized on the stag, i got the shocker from AL that the stag is not offered with company fitted power steering. only the lynx has that as option.

AL is preferred over Tata in the south more because of the steering . A manual steering is fine . I always liked the manual steering over the power steering of the vikings . I dont see any problems for the driver . But , again in Kerala I think most of the roads are winding , and there are lot of turns . So a power steering might be worth it .
You will be able to get the PS fitted after market and I am sure if it is done from TVS it will be good .

But , better still try to get the chaisis first , get the body built and if the need for a PS arises , then go for it .
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Old 11th May 2010, 23:14   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
1) will it make a big difference in mini bus if PS is not fitted? will we easily get drivers for the bus? will it be too hard to drive the bus?
I have driven a manual steering fitted stag and it will not be that hard for u to manure even in stand still condition.During running there will be no much differance between MS and PS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
2) AL says the PS unit can be fitted aftermarket for Rs. 70,000. how reliable will that be? should it be done?
Fitment of PS is an option given by AL and so its always reliable and safe to go with it. The aggregates are tested by AL and only after that its been recommended and not like a just after market fitment.
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
3) Do all mini buses in kerela roads have PS?
Guys in KL plz answer.
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Old 12th May 2010, 01:13   #68
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Originally Posted by Transsenger View Post
1. Changing the fuel pump setting was an old practice on vehicles with inline FIP. Todays Tata, Eicher & AL (AL - except few models) comes with RotaryFIP. The best way to improve fuel efficiency is to train the driver and do proper & timely maintenance of the vehicle.
Is it a Bosch VE type FIP, then again the quantity of fuel can be adjusted.
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Old 12th May 2010, 08:44   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conjon View Post
The current vikings that you have, are they 10m,11m or 12m?
12m.

Quote:
The stag what length are u planning to build it to? more than 8m or less than 8m.
more than 8m.

Quote:
Try and find out if you can source a complete power steering unit for a lynx and then fix it on a stag from TVS cochin. Make sure if the power steering is fitted then it is done by Authorised Service centre.

Power steering could deteriorate over a period of time, if it is an after market one just like the KOYO unit used on some of the jeeps. So sticking to the AL power steering unit would be wise.
i dont know what AL meant when they said it can be fitted aftermarket. it was not me who spoke to them.

for me, aftermarket means from local outside shop. thats the reason i was hesitant.

does TVS offer PS fitment on stag? if yes, i wont have a problem fitting it at all.

Quote:
I dont think all the Mini buses in kerala would have PS.
if a mini bus does not really need a PS, i would re-consider my decision.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Transsenger View Post
I say;

1. Its always wise to fit power steering on any CV, be it LCV or HCV.
point noted.

Quote:
2. TVS will retrofit the same power steering unit on your Viking buses on STAG also. (We had purchased a Stag in Dec2008 with PS fitted by TVS. The bus is running fine and we are getting 5.5 to 6KMPL). What you should care is to get back the OE fitted manual steering box on stag back from TVS, you may sell it in local market. This type of aftermarket fitment is reliable for sure, as the Stag engine has the options for the same. Please remember stag & Lynx share the same engine.
thats a good enough mileage.

so you mean PS can be retrofitted by TVS. i will enquire in TVS & i will make sure i get the OE fitment back. thanks.

Quote:
4. If its an A/c bus with direct engine driven a/c, do not expect the mileage to be 6kmpl.
its not an AC bus. its a 30 seater mini bus. we had a huge demand for a non AC, 25+ seater mini bus. if we buy a AC bus, that had to be with push back seats which would reduce it's seating capacity to 19. mostly, our next purchase would an AC mini bus or a force traveller.

Quote:
Originally Posted by urzdeepu View Post
firstly congrats for choosing stag as your option because i'll say its really a reliable product.
thanks buddy.

Quote:
about power steering dont know if its true but have heard that AL Stag are easy in maneuverability without PS too..this was heard from one of the drivers of greenline travels thrissur. the chassis shared by the vehicle is of the same thickness as the one you see in your vikings. previously way back in 2004 and all stags showed gearbox complaints but after that AL replaced it with the same 5speed syncromesh GB that is found again in their HCV ranges(vikings,1612 etc). so in short ,AL stag is a rugged vehicle that has a 4 cylinder pot and smaller aggregates fitted into a HCV chassis and GB.
thanks buddy. good to know that.

Quote:
There is literally no change in power for lynx and stag since both share the same 120PS engine. dont feel there will be real difference in mileage for lynx and stag even though lynx may weigh a little more.
yes, i feel since the lynx is wider & weighs more, it would give 0.5-1kmpl less than the stag.

Quote:
BTW heard one news that AL 12M bus supported by engine driven AC is pulling out a mileage of 4.5KMPL...is this true?? bus in the story is a full fixed glass ac bus of Badboy travels from thrissur.
seems quite unlikely. my non-AC bus gives 3.75kmpl!

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
AL is preferred over Tata in the south more because of the steering . A manual steering is fine . I always liked the manual steering over the power steering of the vikings . I dont see any problems for the driver . But , again in Kerala I think most of the roads are winding , and there are lot of turns . So a power steering might be worth it .
You will be able to get the PS fitted after market and I am sure if it is done from TVS it will be good .
in kerela, it is usually said that if a bus does not have PS, it is very difficult to get drivers for it. dont know if that is valid for the mini bus too.

Quote:
But , better still try to get the chaisis first , get the body built and if the need for a PS arises , then go for it .
yes, that is what i will do. if there is no need, no money would be spent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashley2 View Post
I have driven a manual steering fitted stag and it will not be that hard for u to manure even in stand still condition.During running there will be no much differance between MS and PS.

Fitment of PS is an option given by AL and so its always reliable and safe to go with it. The aggregates are tested by AL and only after that its been recommended and not like a just after market fitment.

Guys in KL plz answer.
i will have to talk to TVS guys to find out the exact cost of fitment.
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Old 15th May 2010, 20:32   #70
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hi Raj...some of my friends went for a tour last night in this bus. i thought about your plans and clicked 2 pics. its a lynx chassis fitted with a/c and 28 seat push back run by greenline travels of thrissur. i liked the body built by Ojes though at some area like the wheel arches felt a little wacky though...sorry for a lack in clarity as its a night pic..
Attached Thumbnails
Looking to buy a Minibus: EDIT- AL Stag bought. Pics on Pg. 8 & 9-dsc00772.jpg  

Looking to buy a Minibus: EDIT- AL Stag bought. Pics on Pg. 8 & 9-dsc00770.jpg  

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Old 15th May 2010, 20:39   #71
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thanks a ton buddy. now this gives me a proper idea on how a lynx mini bus would look.

anybody has an idea of what will be the fuel efficiency of a non-AC mini bus built on a stag chassis & a lynx chassis?
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Old 16th May 2010, 11:58   #72
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
i dont know what AL meant when they said it can be fitted aftermarket. it was not me who spoke to them. for me, aftermarket means from local outside shop. thats the reason i was hesitant.
does TVS offer PS fitment on stag? if yes, i wont have a problem fitting it at all.
Check the warranty details, some times after market modifications void the original factory warrantee.
If power steering is a must, you should consider LPO 918, Power Steering, Air Brake and Cummins engine. Proven model in india and export markets.
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Old 16th May 2010, 12:12   #73
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will the warranty be void even if the PS is fitted from the company dealer? i will check it out, thanks.
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Old 16th May 2010, 21:34   #74
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Dear Raj:

You might also want to consider Irizar-TVS (Madurai) and KMS (Bangalore), if nobody else has mentioned about them already.
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Old 7th June 2010, 11:42   #75
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Hey Raj, any progress out here? Have you placed the order? I saw the thread on the ICE for a mini bus, but didn't find anything about the mini bus...
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