Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Commercial Vehicles


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th November 2010, 16:04   #256
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Ashley2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: NH7
Posts: 2,089
Thanked: 1,432 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
......Stallion from eastern Europe which is one big chunk of sales. ...
Theres nothing like Stallion from Easter Europe.
Whats this?


Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
4. Most of the discussion here is focused around Kerala may be most debaters here are from that state but it is worth pondering why AL is not able to break in the markets outside south India in a big way ?
AL has given a tough competition in western India as well.
Ashley2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 16:20   #257
Senior - BHPian
 
binaiks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: KL-47 // KA-51
Posts: 1,726
Thanked: 822 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by silversteed View Post
There are Tata Hispano Globuses doing duty as AC Super Deluxe buses in KeSRTC, for a few Bangalore to Kerala trips.
The buses with KeSRTC are the first generation Globuses. These buses came before the Hispano acquisition was completed. As of now TATA Hispano is operated by a handful of operators in Punjab, SRS in Bangalore, Neeta in Mumbai, APSRTC and MSRTC (Not sure if MSRTC still has them).
binaiks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 16:40   #258
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Faridabad/Delhi
Posts: 1,591
Thanked: 434 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashley2 View Post
Theres nothing like Stallion from Easter Europe.
Whats this?
He was probably referring to AVIA, the Czech truck maker AL acquired in 2006.
directinjection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 17:01   #259
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,026
Thanked: 373 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashley2 View Post
Theres nothing like Stallion from Easter Europe.
Whats this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by directinjection View Post
He was probably referring to AVIA, the Czech truck maker AL acquired in 2006.
Yes it was AVIA sorry for the mistake , Stallion predates this by many years and I believe is based on IVICO design ( as per Janes defense ).

Point I wanted to make was that both companies are befitting in terms of technology from foreign acquisitions and JV.

For AL , land Rover layland and IVICO in past , AVIA for heavy segment and tieup with Nissan for LCV. For Tata it is Dawoo Commercial vehicles and other Europian acquisitions. AL has focused more on Medium , Heavy and Defence segment and TML focused more on Medium and LCV segment in the past , So if you see the latest acquisitions and tieups both companies are in position to complete the range.
amitk26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 17:48   #260
Senior - BHPian
 
binaiks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: KL-47 // KA-51
Posts: 1,726
Thanked: 822 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
Another thing AL needs to do is to have more dealers apart from the TVS network . I am sure AL is losing atleast 50% of its customers because of TVS .
Perhaps that is the reason why Ashok Leyland is adding new dealers for the LCV line-up. Kerala would have 5 new dealers, AFAIK.
binaiks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 19:00   #261
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Ashley2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: NH7
Posts: 2,089
Thanked: 1,432 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Yes it was AVIA sorry for the mistake , Stallion predates this by many years and I believe is based on IVICO design ( as per Janes defense ).
Just for Info..
AL has not benefited yet by acquiring AVIA.
There were plans to launch their cabs in India but they were not cost economical.
Ashley2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 20:38   #262
BHPian
 
Jomz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Detroit, MI,USA
Posts: 808
Thanked: 288 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Yes it was AVIA sorry for the mistake , Stallion predates this by many years and I believe is based on IVICO design ( as per Janes defense ).
Stalion is Not IVECO design!!!!, It just has an IVECO cab. the chassis, engines and axles are different from IVECO.
Take a closer look in this thread, And the stallion in thread was in the US for ABS and SNOW testing.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/commer...us-market.html

Last edited by Jomz : 11th November 2010 at 20:39.
Jomz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th November 2010, 21:26   #263
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Bhubaneswar
Posts: 1,762
Thanked: 532 Times
Default

Why hasnt ALL been able to make successful inroads into the tipper market, where Tata sells so many trucks, in so many ranges. We rarely see the fully built tippers from ALL, whereas Tata offers so many tippers, including now 4018 and 4923 tip-trailers, bulkers and transit-mixers.

Similarly, why dont we see too many fully built buses from ALL?? A large percentage of TML bus sales are in the fully built bus sector, especially with the roaring success of the Tata Starbus, and then with the tie-up with Marco-Polo giving a huge sales in the city bus segment, with a whole new plant coming on line in Dharwad just to build Tata Marco Polo buses. So now Tata already has 3 plants running for just building buses, at Lucknow, Dharwad and body-building facilities with ACGL in Goa. Overall there is much more profit to be made in the fully built segment than in the non-fully built segment. And now Tata is looking to repeat its strategy of providing fully built solutions in the truck sector as well.
julupani is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 00:20   #264
BHPian
 
Jomz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Detroit, MI,USA
Posts: 808
Thanked: 288 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
Why hasnt ALL been able to make successful inroads into the tipper market, where Tata sells so many trucks, in so many ranges. We rarely see the fully built tippers from ALL, whereas Tata offers so many tippers, including now 4018 and 4923 tip-trailers, bulkers and transit-mixers.

there are fully built tippers and trucks by AL. There are more products than TML for fully built tippers and trailers by AL with engines ranging from ~1000 Nm torque to ~350Nm torque. (12litres to 4l engines)

Tip trailers were tried out in the 1980's by AL. I don't know whether they made it to market.

In south India (KL and TN) the enire tipper market (construction sector) is dominated by ALL. I'm sorry, I never needed to venture north of Bangalore- So I don't know what is there (esp in hills).
Jomz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 09:03   #265
BHPian
 
sumitkalindi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 374
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

^^^ BOTH The ABOVE Posts^^^

This is exactly what I have been telling. In eastern /Northern India AL is virtually non existence similarly it is exactly opposite in south. Where Tata is rare.

Now I want to understand why??????
sumitkalindi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 09:42   #266
Senior - BHPian
 
silversteed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PGT//BLR//STR
Posts: 1,977
Thanked: 1,384 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jomz View Post
Tip trailers were tried out in the 1980's by AL. I don't know whether they made it to market.
I've seen something like that in Chennai, last year. There were 3 of them, waiting for registration at the RTO. The drivers had parked the trucks at midnight. I had posted a few pics somewhere in the forum, can't find them now.
silversteed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 11:28   #267
Senior - BHPian
 
CARDEEP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: NCR
Posts: 2,699
Thanked: 1,483 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by directinjection View Post
Even Tata Marcopolo buses had problems. The reason DTC relented was to meet the Commonwealth Games deadline. The induction of these modern buses had to take place before the Games. Your merit versus money argument isn't quite true.
Yes, some problems are everywhere, but, the cases of fires have reduced dramatically (not drastically) after AL fleet was introduced, there have been more than couple of cases of DTC buses on fire (AL make) that did not make to prime time news, unlike the 5-6 Tata buses which had fires in almost same number of different parts (one it was the engine, then the tyres, etc).

I agree with your argument that either of the manufacturers' incapacity to meet the CWG'10 demand.

What I want to emphasise is that there aren't much difference in either of the manufacturers' offerings, especially when the engines are the same.
CARDEEP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 14:36   #268
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: chennai
Posts: 703
Thanked: 54 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sumitkalindi View Post
^^^ BOTH The ABOVE Posts^^^

This is exactly what I have been telling. In eastern /Northern India AL is virtually non existence similarly it is exactly opposite in south. Where Tata is rare.

Now I want to understand why??????
The answer to that lies in the site (team-bhp.com ) itself . When someone thinks some particular brand is good .. then others echo the same . Whoever thought that the brand was good or bad might not even have an iota of knowledge about the product .
Classic case is the skoda threads and the volkswagon threads . Most of them seem to have an adverse feeling about skoda , but are very positive about the Volkswagon brand . The truth is at the end of the day , platforms , engines , gearboxes are the same , come from the same group .

Tata got it name for gradeability and tyre life in the north . The mercedes engined Tata vehicles were very effective , shorter in length and could be used in hilly regions . The AL trucks , buses are known for reliability , better braking , stability and so they used AL .
The biggest breakthrough for AL is with APSRTC . It is supposed to be one of the biggest RTC services in India . they used to have only Tata buses for Tirupathi hills , but now they have switched over to AL . AL hino engines seem to have the grunt to conquer the hilly territory as well . The cummins was left out due to mileage and maintenance issues .
greatmana2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 16:27   #269
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Faridabad/Delhi
Posts: 1,591
Thanked: 434 Times
Default

Contrary to what is being said, AL has enjoyed very good market penetration in North India in so far as the bus segment is concerned.
In Haryana Roadways, the state road transport undertaking of Haryana, the ratio between AL and TML has been roughly 50:50 for the last four decades. I'd say the same about Punjab Roadways, Delhi Transport Corporation and other STUs of North India. So who says AL's penetration is not good? In the bus segment, even on an all-India basis, AL has traditionally enjoyed a slight edge over Tata. However, in trucks, the story has been different with Tata enjoying a big lead.
directinjection is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th November 2010, 17:39   #270
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Ashley2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: NH7
Posts: 2,089
Thanked: 1,432 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
Why hasnt ALL been able to make successful inroads into the tipper market, where Tata sells so many trucks, in so many ranges.
AL have a equivalent range offered in all segment in Tipper.
If you go by spec sheet.. there are parallel models from both manufactureres.
In recent past AL has lagged in Tipper segment as Tata was pushing its fully build factory fitted cab aganist the AL's fully built fabricated cab ( built by Prabha Engineers). But now AL wanted to give back with its U - Truck range pitted directly aganist the volume segment in Tipper, say 1618,1616,2518 with greater features compared to TML's standard cab. SO this is a wait and watch game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
We rarely see the fully built tippers from ALL, whereas Tata offers so many tippers, including now 4018 and 4923 tip-trailers, bulkers and transit-mixers.
In this tip-trailor segment theres only application difference between using a standard trailor and using a tip-trailor. AL have launched these products way 2005.

Quote:
Originally Posted by julupani View Post
Similarly, why dont we see too many fully built buses from ALL?? A large percentage of TML bus sales are in the fully built bus sector, especially with the roaring success of the Tata Starbus,
Roaring success is too much to quote for its sales.
Kindly do not include LCV's here. Tata literally struggled to sell their Star bus range as their built quality was so poor.
Ashley2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mahindra Truck & Bus division rolls out 15,000th HCV from Chakan plant Aditya Commercial Vehicles 1 27th August 2015 21:55
NGT issues notices to DTC, Tata & Ashok Leyland for plying empty buses embee Commercial Vehicles 14 27th August 2015 17:52
How Bajaj Auto, Tata Motors, M&M and Ashok Leyland gave birth to auto MNCs darklord The Indian Car Scene 0 17th October 2013 13:06
Tata Marco Polo vs Ashok Leyland Rear Engine on DTC Fleet MileCruncher Commercial Vehicles 28 4th December 2011 09:51
Ashok Leyland to be renamed as Hinduja Leyland? Ashley2 Commercial Vehicles 8 15th April 2011 13:14


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 11:39.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks