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Old 26th November 2010, 22:29   #16
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Originally Posted by shootsingh View Post
Sudarshan what is semi forward control setup?
Went over my head. And the pics u posted are tata but similar to man. I mean shaktiman, my idea of having the engine in front is safety, if im not wrong at this. I am actually artist (mainly photograper) n drvie scania articulate here in uk. Sitting right at front is ok on the dual carriage ways of uk but considering indian cruel drivers i am not confident driving right at the front of truck. Also when u make a motor home on these trucks we can have open access to the cabin from drivers cab, i will post a videolink soon. But leyland cab got to be tilted when doing the engine. Another reason for shaktiman may sound egoistic but i must admit... Its looks. It is an iconic figure in the truck world. Prctically it may or more likely be staying at mechanic than my house, but if manged and cared carefully it can go miles. For spares i think they were made 75000 in total, and are still availabe in disposal yards. But i cant think this military grade beast be breaking off very often.
Well , to my knowledge & as far as I know

A Semi forward controll model is what the Man/Shaktiman setup is or the 1210 sd/sa setup where engine is in front of driver cabin .In my opinion it is safe than the other one

A full forward controll means ,like the leyland Stalion .Where engine is inside driver cabin . ( where the driver is upfront at the vehicle )

I think the semi forward controll driver has better chances in case of impact . I personally have experianced that the semi forward controll truck is easier to drive then the other ( any one can have exactly opposite opinion here )

You seem to depend too much on the old/scrap marcket for spares .The disadvantages are

1) the shaktiman is dissappearing fast ,it is being very quickly fased out so getting parts after say 5 years will be difficult .

2) old trucks are ruled out of bigger cities & then towns so there are lesser chances of them being on road . The result of this is Less running vehicles > less demand for spares > so the chances are not much of the scrap dealers / breakers will be storing parts for such > so they will prefer to sell it to the furnace & make cash ,rather than to wait for you

3) Or the clever ones( old part dealers) who afford to wait & then sell it to you at a steep rate as they know that you have nowhere to go ( this ripping is happening with vintage & also classic cars )

This is not going to happen with a Tata or Leyland model ( Desi )

I also happen to have a 'Firang ' car ( Land Rover ) & getting spares or finding a match in local market is difficult ( at normal rates )

Man is a German model I doubt you will find a matching part from the Indian Girling or lucas range of products

In sum total ,you will be buying a Man for cheap & spending a lot on rebuilding it .

Now another issue is of service , how many mechs know about Man ( original not Jugad ) Its a big issue of getting such vehicles maintained here

Sudarshan
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Old 26th November 2010, 22:46   #17
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Originally Posted by BaCkSeAtDrIVeR View Post
Cities are classified into 3 groups, and emissions norms come into force in first place at the A class cities (metros + couple of other cities). One of 2 years, they are enforced in B class citeis, and rest of India in another one year. That is why you may be able to register old school technology vehicles in smaller towns. But, AFAIK, Euro 2 are in force all over India,. Hope somebody else will throw some light on this.
The country has two, not three divisions so far as emission norms go.

BS-IV is the prevalent standard in: National Capital Region (Delhi and surrounding areas including lesser cities like Alwar and Panipat) along with 10 other cities i.e. Mumbai, Kolkata, Chennai, Bangalore, Hyderabad, Ahmedabad, Pune, Surat, Kanpur and Agra.

The rest of India is BS-III.
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Originally Posted by Sudarshan View Post
Well , to my knowledge & as far as I know

A Semi forward controll model is what the Man/Shaktiman setup is or the 1210 sd/sa setup where engine is in front of driver cabin .In my opinion it is safe than the other one

A full forward controll means ,like the leyland Stalion .Where engine is inside driver cabin . ( where the driver is upfront at the vehicle )
MAN and Shaktiman are not semi-forward control trucks. They are known as normal control trucks in which the entire engine is outside the cabin. Tata-Mercedes-Benz trucks were also normal control. Early Tata trucks had the same design. They had a long bonnet and round headlights. Bonnet was lifted/opened from the sides. Then in 1975, Tata introduced the semi-forward control truck 1210S in which part of the engine was inside the driver cab and the bonnet length was shorter. The bonnet was opened/lifted from the front. This model offered increased cargo area and beame an instant hit in the market. The black and white pics of 1210 SD and SA in this thread are of the semi-forward control model. Tata 407 is also semi-forward control truck.

Last edited by directinjection : 26th November 2010 at 23:01.
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Old 27th November 2010, 04:25   #18
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Originally Posted by directinjection View Post
The country has two, not three divisions so far as emission norms go.

BS-IV is the prevalent standard in: National Capital Region (Delhi and surrounding areas including lesser cities like Alwar and Panipat) along with 10 other cities i.e. Mumbai, Kolkata, Chennai, Bangalore, Hyderabad, Ahmedabad, Pune, Surat, Kanpur and Agra.

The rest of India is BS-III.


MAN and Shaktiman are not semi-forward control trucks. They are known as normal control trucks in which the entire engine is outside the cabin. Tata-Mercedes-Benz trucks were also normal control. Early Tata trucks had the same design. They had a long bonnet and round headlights. Bonnet was lifted/opened from the sides. Then in 1975, Tata introduced the semi-forward control truck 1210S in which part of the engine was inside the driver cab and the bonnet length was shorter. The bonnet was opened/lifted from the front. This model offered increased cargo area and beame an instant hit in the market. The black and white pics of 1210 SD and SA in this thread are of the semi-forward control model. Tata 407 is also semi-forward control truck.
THANKS FOR the information.
regarding emissions is it still possible or do you know of any truck getting registered recently. this is my first crucial step choosing a vehicle. although life doesnt stop here incase i cant get it registered i will sell it off in the KABAR BAZAR.
AT present i have to consider choosing one that would come with a builtin cabin at rear. i am told shaktiman does comes with builtin van and is called officers cab in army. i wouldn't just go for a truck with just an open trailer, it will take months to build.
can someone give me any loophole for the registration, these ex army trucks wouldn't stand anywhere in emission tests, does it means no registration? or is it possible the other popular way??? the one i shouldn't be writing here
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Old 27th November 2010, 06:39   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by directinjection View Post


MAN and Shaktiman are not semi-forward control trucks. They are known as normal control trucks in which the entire engine is outside the cabin. Tata-Mercedes-Benz trucks were also normal control. Early Tata trucks had the same design. They had a long bonnet and round headlights. Bonnet was lifted/opened from the sides. Then in 1975, Tata introduced the semi-forward control truck 1210S in which part of the engine was inside the driver cab and the bonnet length was shorter. The bonnet was opened/lifted from the front. This model offered increased cargo area and beame an instant hit in the market. The black and white pics of 1210 SD and SA in this thread are of the semi-forward control model. Tata 407 is also semi-forward control truck.
Wow I didnt know thease thin lines ( a detail in class separation ) , I was wayward in naming it ( too much generalised it )

But what is called as full forward controll ? sometimes called as LP show ?

Anyways thanks for inputs , more of such explanations are welcome by me

Sudarshan
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Old 27th November 2010, 07:44   #20
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Isnt a Motorhome based on a Truck Chassis going to be really really uncomfortable and bumpy? Woudnt you rather get a Bus?
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Old 27th November 2010, 08:41   #21
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Isnt a Motorhome based on a Truck Chassis going to be really really uncomfortable and bumpy? Woudnt you rather get a Bus?
Yes , sure . But Mr. Shootsingh is looking for a 4x4 motorhome ( that is my dream too )

then who cares for few bums & thumps ( well things will need to be tied down during a ride though )

But if road conditions are good & you are not going to go off road then a Volvo B 7R ( just like the Neeta bus ) is the best thing for comfort & style (this is again my dream , )

Sudarshan
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Old 27th November 2010, 16:21   #22
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SUDARSHAN I WILL MAKE A SEARCH FOR TATA 1210 TOO, NEVER THOUGHT OF IT BEFORE, I AM FAN OF SHAKTIMAN, I WILL ASK MY MECHANIC SWAPING THE TATA ENGINE AND TRANSMISSION TO MAN, may be bit pricy but shouldnt be a problem, but still RC comes first if i get it registered then anything else will be taken as fun for life.
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Old 27th November 2010, 17:53   #23
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shakthiman specs on Jane's says that it is a 4 tonner. The Tata 1210 is a 10 tonner.

Also, if you are looking for fun, and modifications, IMHO, better (in technical reliability sense) get a 1210, and put a Shakthiman body on it.

If you are looking for purity, stick to original shakthiman parts, and do the swap only when you are unable to locate some critical part.
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Old 27th November 2010, 17:59   #24
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@ Shootsingh, a small correction , the pictures I have shown date back to the eightees. Now newer generation of mechanicals including engine have come .

If money is not a problem then get a brand new chassis & send it to DC ( a Dilip Chabria company ), with all your Ideas to be incorporated . Thus have a peace of mind for atleast a 100,000 kms ,because everything will be brand new .

Sudarshan
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Old 27th November 2010, 18:43   #25
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sorry i didnt mention earlier,being an artist its more likely to be my art project i must stay in budget and thats what brings me to forum and seek help from you guys. New stallion itself (without body work) is 25 lacs ex taxes. As it is for fun and hobby sake, i personally feel that the journey is important and it should start from scratch, the process of restoring is more important for me. Apart from the engine and technicle part evrything else is gonna handled by me personally, Drilling fixing pasting grinding etc fixing beds chairs shower room toilet ketchen and sound system etc. It will work in stages and may never be perfect. I own a jonga and mm550 they are always in need, every year they cost me alot, but i love them.
I have spoken to my mate and we have to wait and watch what comes to disposal, at jallandhar. Tata or man. Mean while your help is much appreciated and is vital for this project, i am learning alot, Thanks guys
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Old 27th November 2010, 18:54   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaCkSeAtDrIVeR View Post
shakthiman specs on Jane's says that it is a 4 tonner. The Tata 1210 is a 10 tonner.

Also, if you are looking for fun, and modifications, IMHO, better (in technical reliability sense) get a 1210, and put a Shakthiman body on it.

If you are looking for purity, stick to original shakthiman parts, and do the swap only when you are unable to locate some critical part.
I will consider doing this unless i get a pure n safe shaktiman. But i still have strong views regarding mans reliability (through my search from military itself, from people who driven both man n stallion)
The only wory is that man is full time 4x4, there is no option to disengage front axle, does some one have a clue for this problem. Its could be more juicy Running 4x4 fulltime?
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Old 27th November 2010, 19:08   #27
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Check this site, its man truck site you will require google translator to convert fron german to english MAN 630

Its actually called man 630
It Engine is multi fuel same as indian shaktiman runs on multifuel.

MAN 630
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Old 27th November 2010, 21:46   #28
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sorry i didnt mention earlier,being an artist its more likely to be my art project i must stay in budget and thats what brings me to forum and seek help from you guys. New stallion itself (without body work) is 25 lacs ex taxes. As it is for fun and hobby sake, i personally feel that the journey is important and it should start from scratch, the process of restoring is more important for me. Apart from the engine and technicle part evrything else is gonna handled by me personally, Drilling fixing pasting grinding etc fixing beds chairs shower room toilet ketchen and sound system etc. It will work in stages and may never be perfect. I own a jonga and mm550 they are always in need, every year they cost me alot, but i love them.
I have spoken to my mate and we have to wait and watch what comes to disposal, at jallandhar. Tata or man. Mean while your help is much appreciated and is vital for this project, i am learning alot, Thanks guys
Hey no problem man ( I mean you ) most of us are like this .

To be frank I am Impressed by your passion with your dream , I have a similar dream too ( as I have earlier mentioned ) . It may not be possible for me in my life , but sometimes we need dreams to live thrugh the reality of the routine life.

Right now I have a 40 odd year old Land Rover with me ( at least I could make this possible ) which I have restored myself ( yes alone & working as time & money permitted ) . I can share those experiances with you

My budget had been always tighter so what ? I think the passion is the thing that makes dreams come true .

Sudarshan
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Old 27th November 2010, 22:01   #29
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That is nice, you must have the original landrover, one with the tyre on engine bonnet. Later "landrover" term is only used as company logo for their motors. I would love to see your LR pics. And what changes did u bring? shootsingh@gmail.com
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Old 27th November 2010, 22:07   #30
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Originally Posted by BaCkSeAtDrIVeR View Post
shakthiman specs on Jane's says that it is a 4 tonner. The Tata 1210 is a 10 tonner. ?
Shaktiman is mentioned as a 4 tonner because that is what its rated payload is, the gross vehicle weight (GVW) being much higher. Tata 1210 is actually a 12 tonner, not 10 tonner but these are GVW figures. The "12" in 1210 stands for GVW. If I'm not mistaken, both these trucks were called three tonners in army. Obviously, the army guys don't overload their trucks the way transporters do.


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Originally Posted by shootsingh View Post
I will consider doing this unless i get a pure n safe shaktiman. But i still have strong views regarding mans reliability (through my search from military itself, from people who driven both man n stallion) The only wory is that man is full time 4x4, there is no option to disengage front axle, does some one have a clue for this problem. Its could be more juicy Running 4x4 fulltime?
Even Stallion is full-time 4 X 4. So the two trucks are similar on that count. I think conversion to 4X2 mode should be possible.
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