Connecting speakers - Newbie DIY

[DerAlte]

Originally Posted by shuvc

... There's one issue though:
The rear ELs are very faint. Barely audible at a volume level of say 30 (the Pio 4950 goes up to 60 odd). ...

Congratulations, @shuvc, that's terrific!

Your problems sounds like a tuning problem - the clue is your description: "Amp gain for both sub and fronts are at around 2-3V"! It is TOO precise to be true - are you relating to the HU spec (i.e. 4V pre-out)?

Your front setting (ignore sub) is too loud for the rear, so relatively the rears are sounding feeble.

Tune it once again, this time making sure that at any HU volume setting, Rear (fed from HU) is just less than Front (fed from amp) in the front seat. The amp gain knob is usually 270degress, so next time observe/quote the approx position of the indicator w.r.t. the left extreme.

[RAC]

The current settings are:
- EQ Flat
- Sub LPF 100hz from HU, HU boost 0
- Speakers HPF 100hz from HU
- Fader at centre/0
- SLA set to 0
- Amp gain for both sub and fronts are at around 2-3V


Hi. Can you tell me on how to set up or rather access the LPF setup on the HU.
I am using 7950UB, but do not re-collect seeing any such thing. I can only see the HPF settings when i access the sub-woofer menu on the HU.

Thanks

[shuvc]

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Your problems sounds like a tuning problem - the clue is your description: "Amp gain for both sub and fronts are at around 2-3V"! It is TOO precise to be true - are you relating to the HU spec (i.e. 4V pre-out)?

Your front setting (ignore sub) is too loud for the rear, so relatively the rears are sounding feeble.

Tune it once again, this time making sure that at any HU volume setting, Rear (fed from HU) is just less than Front (fed from amp) in the front seat. The amp gain knob is usually 270degress, so next time observe/quote the approx position of the indicator w.r.t. the left extreme.

Thanks !

That's what I tried. This is what I did.
1. Sub switched off from HU
2. Front speaker gain set to 6V. (that's minimum? 75.4 runs from 75mv to 6V IIRC)
3. Fade to rear fully
4. Increase volume till rear sounds decent (not loud). This happened at around 40 on the volume 'counter'. Should it not happen at a lower volume?
5. Fade to centre/0
6. Increase front speaker gain till it juuuuust overshadows rear, i.e I feel a front footwell 'staging?'
7. Bring in the sub and set it's gain

But this way I found that I'm having to crank up the volume to 40ish (60%) just to bring the rears into play. Isn't this odd?

I mentioned 2-3V based on that 270deg twist. The fronts are set at slightly beyond the half way twist mark, more towards the 75mV end.

[DerAlte]

Originally Posted by shuvc

Thanks !

That's what I tried. This is what I did.
1. Sub switched off from HU
2. Front speaker gain set to 6V. (that's minimum? 75.4 runs from 75mv to 6V IIRC)
3. Fade to rear fully
4. Increase volume till rear sounds decent (not loud). This happened at around 40 on the volume 'counter'. Should it not happen at a lower volume?
5. Fade to centre/0
6. Increase front speaker gain till it juuuuust overshadows rear, i.e I feel a front footwell 'staging?'
7. Bring in the sub and set it's gain

But this way I found that I'm having to crank up the volume to 40ish (60%) just to bring the rears into play. Isn't this odd?

I mentioned 2-3V based on that 270deg twist. The fronts are set at slightly beyond the half way twist mark, more towards the 75mV end.

O dada, kya korta hai! Pooro ulto korta hai je! Sref nombors bolta hai, pheeling ekdom nehin hai.

Sir, you have to take REARS as reference, and then set front. Also, please do not talk in Volts and millivolts unless you have a signal generator and a calibrated True RMS digital voltmeter or an Osci like @clipto333 maharaj!

1. Forget the sub (you've already done that; sub channel gain = 0)
2. Play your favourite music (something that you can hear over and over again and which will lull you from thinking technical!)
3. Set Front channel amp gain to 0
4. Set the rear volume at the HU to a comfortable listening volume (usually comes at 1/3rd of the HU maximum) in the rear seat
5. Increase the Front channel amp gain gradually (forget the knob indicator) till the front volume matches the rear (you have to be in the front seat, turn 90deg toward car center and do a left ear - right ear comparison for rear / front)
6. Reduce and increase the volume at the HU and see if the front/rear relationship is maintained at each point (by now you should have a neck sprain and numbness in the legs). Repeat with different sources. Once you are through fiddling around, increase the front gain a weeee bit
7. Go back to the 'comfortable listening' volume on the HU. NOW bring up the sub channel gain gradually to a point that you can just feel it if you increase slightly and not feel it if you reduce. Go slightly higher if you are the boom types, or another 30deg if you are the ka-boom type. Sit back, relax and enjoy the music till the pins and needles of your numb feet have gone away (neck sprain to boudi ka area hai, music koochh nahin kar sakta hai)

After that, switch the car off, lock the car, go home and spend some quality time with your phamily.

PS: Front footwell staging? The stage should be 'high' (ask @B&T what it should imbibe to be in that state)

[shuvc]

Just went and tried tuning again.
With full rear fade and sub off, the rears are just about audible at volume reading 20 ie. 30% volume.

And sigh .. the sliiiight static (krrrr+hsss) is back again. Audible only between songs.

Another thing I noticed. When I reduce the volume to zero '0', there's a slight 'bip' sound the moment it hits 0.

This grounding thing is pretty tough.

[planet_rocker]

Originally Posted by DerAlte

O dada, kya korta hai! Pooro ulto korta hai je! Sref nombors bolta hai, pheeling ekdom nehin hai.

OT: it seems someone is mocking me - mera hindi bolne ka style aapse bahut milta hai

ok! i am out of this thread - btw, shuvc - do you still get the radio ka sound in the back ground - i guess the hisss-grrr-krrrr-phhssss sound is what you are talking about.

[DerAlte]

Originally Posted by shuvc

Just went and tried tuning again.
With full rear fade and sub off, the rears are just about audible at volume reading 20 ie. 30% volume.

By any chance the rear speakers are connected to front output at HU? Then at Fade 0 rears will sound OK. Unlikely that either the HU amp or the speakers are kaput!

Originally Posted by shuvc

And sigh .. the sliiiight static (krrrr+hsss) is back again. Audible only between songs.

Is this in the amp-amplified channel or the HU amplified channel? Or both?

Originally Posted by shuvc

Another thing I noticed. When I reduce the volume to zero '0', there's a slight 'bip' sound the moment it hits 0

Illusion due to the Illusions? Again, front / rear / both?

[DerAlte]

Originally Posted by planet_rocker

OT: it seems someone is mocking me - mera hindi bolne ka style aapse bahut milta hai

ok! i am out of this thread - btw, shuvc - do you still get the radio ka sound in the back ground - i guess the hisss-grrr-krrrr-phhssss sound is what you are talking about.

Arrey @p_r dada, but your writing style is perfect, no! Why should anyone mock you?

BTW, what is the expression "jaa-taa"?

[shuvc]

Originally Posted by DerAlte

O dada, kya korta hai! Pooro ulto korta hai je! Sref nombors bolta hai, pheeling ekdom nehin hai.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Sir, you have to take REARS as reference, and then set front.

Eggggjactly what I am trying to do.

Have been doing all the steps as you have mentioned.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

4. Set the rear volume at the HU to a comfortable listening volume (usually comes at 1/3rd of the HU maximum) in the rear seat

This seems to be the root of the problem. This comfy listening volume is coming at 2/3rd the HU max and not 1/3. Like I mentioned earlier, at around 40 out of 62 max. At volume level 20, it's very faint.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

you have to be in the front seat, turn 90deg toward car center and do a left ear - right ear comparison for rear / front

Did that too.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

by now you should have a neck sprain and numbness in the legs

Had that too. Yesterday.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Go back to the 'comfortable listening' volume on the HU

Did that too. It's just that I'm not happy with a comfortable listening position which is 2/3 max HU volume. Doesn't seem right.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

neck sprain to boudi ka area hai, music koochh nahin kar sakta hai

No such luck. Mooozik pe hi depend karna parega !

Originally Posted by DerAlte

PS: Front footwell staging? The stage should be 'high' (ask @B&T what it should imbibe to be in that state)

Yeh tow malum hay, that it should be high. But for now, it's been a conscious decision to keep the staging low. Which is why I went for coaxes instead of compos. I still kind of find it distracting when driving, if the music is 'in-my-face'. But then people change, don't they

Actually that brings me to another DIY query.
How can one install the crossover unit and the tweets without ANY cutting-shutting-drilling of the car door/dash panels?

[shuvc]

Originally Posted by DerAlte

By any chance the rear speakers are connected to front output at HU? Then at Fade 0 rears will sound OK.

This I need to recheck. IIRC, when I first connected the rear to the HU (ie, fronts , sub disconnected) I had faded to the front and the rear speaker had faded out. But I still got to recheck this.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Is this in the amp-amplified channel or the HU amplified channel? Or both?

Again got to check.

Originally Posted by DerAlte

Illusion due to the Illusions? Again, front / rear / both?

More checking.

Man, you suddenly have given me 3 to-dos at the end of the day. This is almost like the typical boss at office!

@planet, now it's only the krrr-hissss. The problem is that it's so inconsistent. It varies between the following.
1. mild krrrrr-hsssss with the hssss increasing slightly with increasing volume.
2. very infrequently one of the FM channel filters in, while in CD mode. It filters in even when playing a different FM channel
3. Somedays none of the above happen. All nice and quiet.

Have grounded the RCA sockets of the HU to the frame that holds the HU. Might need a more thorough job there a.k.a. a snap which I recall elsewhere on the forum.

[razor4077]

Originally Posted by shuvc

But then people change, don't they

Don't we know that! I forget what "budget" you started off with.........

I have some lean time at office (yay!) for a change. Maybe I can come down and lend a hand/ear tomorrow sometime? Will hit you up on gtalk.
And congrats!

[shuvc]

Checked the rear speaker wiring again yesterday. They are connected to the rear speaker level outs of the HU.

I managed to squeeze a bit more 'volume' out of the rears by setting the HPF off. Now a comfortable level of rear spkr sound arrives at 1/2 volume, as oppposed to 2/3 earlier. But it's still weak at 1/3 volume.

A query here. Does the HPF setting on the HU have an effect on both
A) the speaker level output and
B) the RCA outs?

A fallout of checking the wiring - all the krrr/hsss/FM sounds seem to have vanished. Wonder for how long !

The 'bip' sound, when volume hits 0, isn't an Illusion . It is happening still for the amped channels - fronts and sub.

@Razor, response to your post is here
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/sound-...tml#post696656 (What ICE & @ What Price)


EDIT: That's my 1500th post. I would never, in my wildest dreams, have bet that it would be in the ICE section !!!!

[RAC]

Originally Posted by shuvc

Checked the rear speaker wiring again yesterday. They are connected to the rear speaker level outs of the HU.

I managed to squeeze a bit more 'volume' out of the rears by setting the HPF off. Now a comfortable level of rear spkr sound arrives at 1/2 volume, as oppposed to 2/3 earlier. But it's still weak at 1/3 volume.

A query here. Does the HPF setting on the HU have an effect on both
A) the speaker level output and
B) the RCA outs?

A fallout of checking the wiring - all the krrr/hsss/FM sounds seem to have vanished. Wonder for how long !

The 'bip' sound, when volume hits 0, isn't an Illusion . It is happening still for the amped channels - fronts and sub.

@Razor, response to your post is here
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/sound-...tml#post696656 (What ICE & @ What Price)


EDIT: That's my 1500th post. I would never, in my wildest dreams, have bet that it would be in the ICE section !!!!

Hope you are able to figure out the 'bip' sound. Ok..selfish reason I get a bip - bip - bip sound on the amplified channels (rear speakers) when turning the volume knob down from about 8 to 0.

BTW, excellent job on the DIY.

Rishi

[DerAlte]

Originally Posted by shuvc

The 'bip' sound, when volume hits 0, isn't an Illusion . It is happening still for the amped channels - fronts and sub.
...
EDIT: That's my 1500th post. I would never, in my wildest dreams, have bet that it would be in the ICE section !!!!

Naseeb ki baat hai, jaani! Dedh hazzar ka congratulations, sir.

Check in the manual of the amp - is there an "auto-off when input signal is 0" kind of feature?

[clipto333]

Originally Posted by DerAlte

O dada, kya korta hai! Pooro ulto korta hai je! Sref nombors bolta hai, pheeling ekdom nehin hai.

Sir, you have to take REARS as reference, and then set front. Also, please do not talk in Volts and millivolts unless you have a signal generator and a calibrated True RMS digital voltmeter or an Osci like @clipto333 maharaj!

Sit back, relax and enjoy the music till the pins and needles of your numb feet have gone away (neck sprain to boudi ka area hai, music koochh nahin kar sakta hai)

After that, switch the car off, lock the car, go home and spend some quality time with your phamily.

haha this is hilarious. lol i really like your language skills. it seems you are familiar with every language in india. :-)

i still don't have an osci paaji. was planning to get one but have deferred the plan. will get it in a month or two. im really missing it though.
i use a normal Dmm and the results are quite good. i have set my amps gains using the DMM. it didn't need any fine tuning. it was spot on(according to my tastes)

@ The DIYer. good to see people doing stuff them self. you are doing great. :-)

cheers