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Old 5th June 2013, 18:14   #11836
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Default Re: The DSLR Thread

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Originally Posted by joe1980 View Post
If you are talking about EVF (Electronic View Finder), yes the Nikon D3200 has it as well, otherwise I wouldn't have bought it in the first place.
You mean it has just the live view functionality, right?
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Old 5th June 2013, 18:33   #11837
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You mean it has just the live view functionality, right?
The D3200 has both, the Live View and the EVF. But it does not switch automatically as I have it on my NEX-6 where I bring my eye to the EVF, the Live View goes off automatically. I find it a bit strange in the D3200 that it has an extra stupid button. I'm not sure if this is the same across the Nikon high end models. If yes, they they should learn that from Sony on how to do it. This feature definitely does not warrant an extra button to switch from the EVF to the Live View.
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Old 5th June 2013, 19:00   #11838
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The D3200 has both, the Live View and the EVF. But it does not switch automatically as I have it on my NEX-6 where I bring my eye to the EVF, the Live View goes off automatically. I find it a bit strange in the D3200 that it has an extra stupid button. I'm not sure if this is the same across the Nikon high end models. If yes, they they should learn that from Sony on how to do it. This feature definitely does not warrant an extra button to switch from the EVF to the Live View.

This is because your D3200 has OVF and not EVF , That extra button is to make a mirror move so that OVF can work, They could have automated it but then mirror will move too many times uselessly.

In canon there is a proximity sensor at the top of LCD which switchs on /off LCD but for coming out of live-view you need to press a button for mirror to move.
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Old 5th June 2013, 20:55   #11839
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
This is because your D3200 has OVF and not EVF , That extra button is to make a mirror move so that OVF can work, They could have automated it but then mirror will move too many times uselessly.

In canon there is a proximity sensor at the top of LCD which switchs on /off LCD but for coming out of live-view you need to press a button for mirror to move.
Is it an OVF? I thought it was an EVF. My understanding is that for an OVF, there should be the finder glass piece in the front. On the D3200 that is not the case. The Fuji X100 or the Fuji X-Pro1 has an OVF where it can be seen that the front side has the provision for the glass to see through. Is it that the lens reflex (on the DSLR) cameras call them the OVF?
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Old 5th June 2013, 21:21   #11840
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Default Re: The DSLR Thread

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Originally Posted by joe1980 View Post
Is it an OVF? I thought it was an EVF. My understanding is that for an OVF, there should be the finder glass piece in the front. On the D3200 that is not the case. The Fuji X100 or the Fuji X-Pro1 has an OVF where it can be seen that the front side has the provision for the glass to see through. Is it that the lens reflex (on the DSLR) cameras call them the OVF?
The DSLR is a OVF camera, that's where the R comes from the reflex mirror. An EVF OTOH is a micro miniature LCD screen..it comes with all the pluses and minuses of a LCD screen, including real time updates of ISO and image tweaking updates, the -ves being tearing, lag, colour inaccuracies among others.

Here you go:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viewfin...al_viewfinders

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_viewfinder
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Old 5th June 2013, 21:24   #11841
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Default Re: The DSLR Thread

The D3200 has a penta mirror based OVF which you may have noticed by now is tiny and dim compared to the much bigger and brighter OLED EVF in the NEX6 (which is the best out there).

You also cannot gauge the DOF correctly in OVF cameras especially the ones which have a mirror.

I still feel the NEX 6 with a lens adapter is the best way to take macro shots,the focus peaking of the Sony is by far the best out there.Unlike a OVF in a EVF "WYSIWYG" .

It doesn't matter now but you could have also got yourself a Sony A58 available for 29k,it has a OLED EVF and also has focus peaking and IBIS so any lens mounted gets free IS and the lenses you buy for this will work fully with your NEX but with right adapter.

@R2D2
There is no tearing or lag which is caused by OLED EVF.The lag in OLED is in "micro" seconds not the "milli" seconds of a lcd EVF.
The LAG you may notice at high speed burst mode is not caused by the EVF but rather due to the sensor which has to briefly take images when you press the shutter during which period you will notice the lag.Then again in a OVF you see black out when the mirror slaps.

Last edited by aim120 : 5th June 2013 at 21:29.
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Old 5th June 2013, 22:23   #11842
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Originally Posted by aim120 View Post

I still feel the NEX 6 with a lens adapter is the best way to take macro shots,the focus peaking of the Sony is by far the best out there.Unlike a OVF in a EVF "WYSIWYG" .

It doesn't matter now but you could have also got yourself a Sony A58 available for 29k,it has a OLED EVF and also has focus peaking and IBIS so any lens mounted gets free IS and the lenses you buy for this will work fully with your NEX but with right adapter.
In fact that was what I tried first. I did not want to have yet another camera body. I tried using a Novoflex adapter with the 105mm Nikon lens, but the combo looked too heavy and bulky on the tiny NEX-6. With that combination, I should handle it with extreme precaution. I'm not game for it. I love my NEX-6 for what it delivers with the 50mm E-Mount lens on it. It is a keeper for me for the next couple of years. If there was an E-Mount macro lens available in the 85 to 105mm, I would have definitely got that. But unfortunately that was not the case and I'm sure that it won't happen for the next 2 years atleast. I find taking macro shots very interesting and challenging. Hence, I decided to go for an additional body, the cheapest one available.

I'm not interested in the SLT lineup from Sony. Focus peaking is interesting and I use it everytime on my NEX, but I do not feel that I miss it on my D3200. I test drove my D3200 yesterday and took a lot of macro shots and none of them went out of focus. I've adapted myself to live without focus peaking on my D3200 especially when doing macro shots.

What I would repeat is that working with a mirrorless system is easy compared to the DSLR. I'm convinced and confident that the future will see many DSLR users moving to the mirrorless systems. I compare this to the punched card programming to modern day functional programming. Excuse me if I have hurt anybody's sentiments.

A big thanks to all you guys in nailing down my first ever DSLR purchase. You guys have been a great source of knowledge.

Last edited by joe1980 : 5th June 2013 at 22:25.
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Old 5th June 2013, 23:46   #11843
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Default Re: The DSLR Thread

I was about to start writing the OVF - EVF differences, and how a mirror-less/Translucent's EVF is different than the live view feature of DSLRs... but you guys are already done with the discussion!
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Old 6th June 2013, 10:17   #11844
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Originally Posted by aim120 View Post
You also cannot gauge the DOF correctly in OVF cameras especially the ones which have a mirror.
You can and more accurately if your DSLR body has DOF preview button but like many other features this is removed from lower Nikon bodies. All Canon bodies except 1000D and 1100D comes with DOF preview button. Actually DOF does on depend on type of view finder at all normally DSLR lens aperture remains open for focussing at widest end and closes down just for metering and before shutter is released. DOF preview button enables the aperture blades to close down whenever you wish.

Focus peaking mode also forces the aperture to close down and thus you get to see the real DOF. In case of manual aperture lenses OVF or EVF do not matter as everything is WYSIWYG.

Focus peakin is one good feature I have used it by Magic Lantern on my Canon and sorely miss it on my EPL3 . Somehow I dont find the Olympus 10X loupe that useful for MF.

There are many positives of EVF but few striking negatives whcih still make OVF a preferable choice are.

1. Color shift / Color casting : It is very difficult to gauge the color and set WB on EVFs colors looke specially garish in fluroscent light.
OLED EVF looks oversaturated, this may not be a problem for regular record shots but at both extremes that is either if you want to play with colors in PP specially for landscapes or need accurate color representation this is a hinderence.

2. Poor low light performance as compared to OVF , In isolation it may look good but shooting night lights with OVF and EVF contrasts the difference.

3. EVF may look fast in comparison to back LCD but still if you are used to OVF there is a small lag.

Last edited by amitk26 : 6th June 2013 at 10:24.
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Old 6th June 2013, 12:00   #11845
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Default Re: The DSLR Thread

Guys,

Other than Photo Shop, is there any other S/W available for Focus stacking? If yes, then is it available as a third party plugin ? I am on Aperture.
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Old 6th June 2013, 12:26   #11846
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Guys,

Other than Photo Shop, is there any other S/W available for Focus stacking? If yes, then is it available as a third party plugin ? I am on Aperture.
Quite a few are available. Google and you will get a big list. Some are
FREE
http://www.softpedia.com/progDownloa...oad-78530.html
http://myrmecos.wordpress.com/2009/1...ages-for-free/

PURCHASE
http://zerenesystems.com/cms/stacker
http://www.heliconsoft.com/helicon-f...icenses-swreg/
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Old 6th June 2013, 12:56   #11847
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
You can and more accurately if your DSLR body has DOF preview button but like many other features this is removed from lower Nikon bodies. All Canon bodies except 1000D and 1100D comes with DOF preview button. Actually DOF does on depend on type of view finder at all normally DSLR lens aperture remains open for focussing at widest end and closes down just for metering and before shutter is released. DOF preview button enables the aperture blades to close down whenever you wish.
The Penta mirror based OVF are still inferior in DOF while the Penta prism ones are better.The bokeh looks different in low end OVF vs the WYSIWYG in EVF.

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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Focus peaking mode also forces the aperture to close down and thus you get to see the real DOF. In case of manual aperture lenses OVF or EVF do not matter as everything is WYSIWYG.
Focus peaking has nothing to with aperture closing down, its mere job is only to highlight where the maximum contrast is and this helps you nailing the focus.The camera changes the aperture automatically one in S Mode and auto mode.


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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
There are many positives of EVF but few striking negatives whcih still make OVF a preferable choice are.

1. Color shift / Color casting : It is very difficult to gauge the color and set WB on EVFs colors looke specially garish in fluroscent light.
OLED EVF looks oversaturated, this may not be a problem for regular record shots but at both extremes that is either if you want to play with colors in PP specially for landscapes or need accurate color representation this is a hinderence.
You can't even know whether the camera selected the right WB in OVF cameras until one takes the shot.Where as in EVF you exactly know how the image is going to look before hand and for what even reason if you have trouble perceiving the right color in EVF you still can look directly with ones eyes.

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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
2. Poor low light performance as compared to OVF , In isolation it may look good but shooting night lights with OVF and EVF contrasts the difference.
The EVF is the one which is better in low light .In OVF ones is basically taking a blind shot.


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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
3. EVF may look fast in comparison to back LCD but still if you are used to OVF there is a small lag.
There is that small lag but is it really going to make a difference,i have no trouble taking shots of a low flying fighter jet traveling at 1000km/h or even BIF.
I see this no different then the blackout ones experiences in DSLR when the mirror moves up.

Last edited by aim120 : 6th June 2013 at 12:58.
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Old 6th June 2013, 13:04   #11848
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I had looked at Helicon. They are very expensive. And that too 200$ on a yearly basis does not make sense at all.

Have been looking at Zerene too.
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Old 6th June 2013, 13:42   #11849
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Originally Posted by aim120 View Post

You can't even know whether the camera selected the right WB in OVF cameras until one takes the shot.Where as in EVF you exactly know how the image is going to look before hand and for what even reason if you have trouble perceiving the right color in EVF you still can look directly with ones eyes.
This (WB) is hardly a concern if you are a RAW shooter as it can be corrected post production.

Though I totally get your views regarding the dim OVF in cheap DSLRs vs the EVF in Sonys. I have seen it myself how good the viewing experience is in A57 compared to Nikon D5100 or Canon 600D. Unless you are talking about high end pentaprisms EVF is more useful I think. The cheap mirror in the likes of D5100/D3200/600D/650D etc cannot really compare to EVF in Sony's SLTs. It is simply too dim and in an EVF you can see how exposure is changing your final image which is huge bonus esp for people who are beginners.

I think only FF bodies will come with high quality OVFs in future and others will eventually use EVFs only.

Last edited by joslicx : 6th June 2013 at 13:44.
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Old 6th June 2013, 15:05   #11850
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
1. Color shift / Color casting : It is very difficult to gauge the color and set WB on EVFs colors looke specially garish in fluroscent light.
OLED EVF looks oversaturated, this may not be a problem for regular record shots but at both extremes that is either if you want to play with colors in PP specially for landscapes or need accurate color representation this is a hinderence.
Though my post is besides the point, I never got why people are so much interested in white balance "correction". The camera should record what it sees. Now if we have a problem with the scene's white balance, change the light source!

Of course this is not possible in cloudlight/moonlight case - but then in such cases our eyes are anyway seeing skewed colors! Why should a camera then work hard to try to make it look like a 6500K sunlit scene (or is it 5500K)?
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