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Old 9th February 2011, 13:34   #1771
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Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
Wait till April-May, and get the Sandy Bridge CPU (i5 or i7) and a MSI/Gigabyte midrange MB. If you are interested in moderate OC, get 1600 MHz DDR3 RAM with decent latencies.
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Originally Posted by anku94 View Post
Are you sure you want branded ? You'll never get the same balance of power (a proper GPU to support a CPU) and it'll work out to be more expensive as well. At your budget, one can just about manage to squeeze in quite decent performance if you go for assembled. And a branded CPU normally equals a quite cheaper assembled CPU.

At 35k, you can allocate 10k for CPU, 8k for GPU, 7k for motherboard, 3-4k for storage, and 6-7k for PSU+Case, which equals good performance. (7-8k for CPU, 11k for GPU if you're gonna be gaming way too much)

This won't be possible in a branded CPU. Maybe you could describe your bad experiences so that we could allay your concerns ?

EDIT : Just scrolled through Dell's lineup. The Inspiron series do not have the option of shipping without a monitor or of a custom graphics card (maybe they'll be willing to do these on the phone), and the XPS desktop works out to 44k without a monitor and the cheapest GPU. A GPU you could have in your 35k build costs 7k extra. The processors available are AMD 6-core series, with different clock rates. You don't need 6 cores, 4 are more than enough, but you do need extra clock rate, so X6 1045T is a bad choice, and the ones with decent clock speed are priced 5k higher, not to mention i5 series architecture is better.
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Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
35K for a new CPU and components (primarily MB and maybe RAM) should get a very good setup in assembly, but not much if HDD, case, etc is to be considered.

If only Intel CPU, MB, RAM is to be considered, and the budget is 30-40K, I would really think that the Sandybridge would be a much better option worth waiting for till April-May, and 30-40K should get you a very good setup. Really do not see the sense in buying first generation i5 (LGA1156?? socket) or i7 (LGA1366 socket,X58) now that Sandybridge (LGA1155 socket) is out. However, note the recent glitches in Sandybridge and even then it should be available widely in May.

Well most of what you guys said sounds like greek to me. A little simpler perhaps?

But what youll are saying is that ill get a better pc if assembled for the same price as a branded?

In that case let me consider assembled too. I might have to find a different vendor from my normal useless guy.

What is this sandybridge? Sorry for all these noob questions.

I think beginning-mid april is when I would want to pick it up. Also if I could get one of those smaller cabinets it would be good.

Please give me a good setup, including the price of the OS. And no it wont be used much for gaming, so I could possibly carry over the ATI card I have now, its only a year old and is the 1gb version with HDMI etc.

Last edited by Akshay1234 : 9th February 2011 at 13:36.
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Old 9th February 2011, 13:45   #1772
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Default re: The Computer & Configuration Thread

I don't know what Sandybridge is either! Well, not specifically: I just know that manufacturers like to give code names (as well as infinitely confusing model names and numbers (especially Intel)) to their processors and this is one of them. So I can say that "sandybridge" is an Intel processor!

The advantage of buying branded is warranty. You could compromise and get your local dealer to do the build for you. He may even offer you a warranty on the complete machine, and he may even honour it --- but a small shop can't possibly have the same resource as a multinational company. On the other hand, MNCs don't give person-to-person service.
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Old 9th February 2011, 13:53   #1773
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`Sandybridge' is the code name of newer generation of Intel processor, and has overwhelmingly received great reviews. Infact most are saying that in most cases, the previous generation i7 9xx series is history, and there is no reason to buy a $1000 processor (i7 980x) when a US$300-350 CPU (core i7-2600K/Sandybridge) will be comparable in most situations!!!. You can google a lot about this. Note that even better processors should be out in late-2011/2012 but they should be much over 35-40K (perhaps 50-60K for CPU+MB+decent RAM speed and sticks).

However, these processors had a chipset problem and so if you want to buy one, you may have to wait till April-May-June (in India).

I would say buy a core i7-2600K (Rs. 15-18K) or i5-2600K (should be Rs. 12-15K), get a decent MB (MSI/Gigabyte for 10-20K but even 10-15K should get you a very good MB with lots of options and features), and get at least 1600MHz DDR3 RAM (min 4 GB). Decent 1600MHz RAM from good manufacturers and with good latency presently costs on average perhaps Rs. 800-1200 per GB. So, say 6GB should be Rs. 6-7K. If you are into OC, even 1833 MHz can be considered. By May-June, RAM prices should fall some more, as is the case for all components.

As a helpful tip, the Sandybridge CPU is LGA socket 1155 and there are 2 categories of MB-H67 and P67. P67 is perhaps for OC. In CPU, there are two types, say i5-2400 (on H67) and i5-2400K (on P67). The CPU price diff between non-k/H67 and K/P67 is not much and K/P67 overclock better and safer. The line-up should be populated over the course of 2011 perhaps.

Bottomline is that 30-40K should get you a system that would be mostly better than the present core i7-9xx series. Just wait till April-June. No point in buying yesterday's stuff at this budget.

Last edited by vasudeva : 9th February 2011 at 13:56.
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Old 9th February 2011, 15:01   #1774
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Note that even better processors should be out in late-2011/2012 but they should be much over 35-40K (perhaps 50-60K for CPU+MB+decent RAM speed and sticks).
General consensus is that Ivy Bridge would not be out until mid-2012. This makes sense too. Intel's got some strategy where they do a die shrink one year, architecture upgrade another year, and then again a die shrink next year.

Sandy Bridge is an architecture upgrade, and Ivy Bridge will be a die shrink, and anyway, it doesn't make sense to launch a new generation a few months after a generation has been launched. i3 Sandy Bridges haven't even been launched yet.

So does that mean you aren't upgrading until mid-2012 ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by akshay1234 View Post
But what youll are saying is that ill get a better pc if assembled for the same price as a branded?
Absolutely. I looked up Dells and HPs and Lenovos today morning, and didn't find very good configs, even at high prices.

Quote:
In that case let me consider assembled too. I might have to find a different vendor from my normal useless guy.
Yes, most vendors don't know a thing about assembling. Why don't you ask some BHPian who lives in your city to recommend you one ? Any vendor who could live up to a BHPian's expectations is most likely a good vendor.

Quote:
What is this sandybridge?
Sandy Bridges are new generation Intel processors, and have received very positive reviews. But a design error has been found in motherboards that support Sandy Bridge processors, and Intel's busy rectifying the error while manufacturers all over the world are implementing recall programs. Problem's expected to be sorted out by february end, while new motherboards are expected to be out in March.

Quote:
I think beginning-mid april is when I would want to pick it up. Also if I could get one of those smaller cabinets it would be good.
That would be good time. You'll have many motherboard choices at that time.

By smaller cabinets, you mean the micro-ATX form factor. @Vasudeva uses a mATX board. They have some limitations, but that isn't a problem for anyone but a very high end user.

Quote:
Please give me a good setup, including the price of the OS. And no it wont be used much for gaming, so I could possibly carry over the ATI card I have now, its only a year old and is the 1gb version with HDMI etc.
[/quote]

Oh, you have a card...great ! Now you can easily fit in a i5 2500K in your budget. (Costs Rs. 12k-15k). Let's have a look at motherboards in March or April.

Power supply
: Corsairs are good and most easily available. So I think Corsair 450VX is fine, unless you have a very powerful and power consuming graphics card. (Costs 4k, but it's a lifelong investment as a power supply doesn't need to be upgraded very often)

Case : Go for a good one, depending on the availability. Expect to shell about 3k (at least) for a good one. NZXT Vulcan is a good one, but not so small, but won't have any installation issues. If you go for very small cases, you will have problems with installation, some things might not fit.

Another good option is Silverstone SG02. It comes with a 300W power supply. If your graphics card has low power consumption, you can go for this one. It is also smaller than the Vulcan.

CPU : i5 2500 (i5 2500K if you're gonna overclock. It's priced about 2k higher)

Motherboard : Wait a month, and then check out good mATX boards.

Storage : WD Caviar Black is a performance HDD while Samsung Spinpoint F3 is a budget good performance HDD. Choose one depending on your budget. Spinpoint F3 might be hard to procure, though.

RAM : Don't have much info about those. Grab Corsair/Patriot/Mushkin DDR3 (CAS Latency : 7, 1400/1600MHz whatever speeds they come in) 6GB, or maybe someone can give better suggestions.
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Old 9th February 2011, 17:20   #1775
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Default re: The Computer & Configuration Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
Wait till April-May, and get the Sandy Bridge CPU (i5 or i7) and a MSI/Gigabyte midrange MB. If you are interested in moderate OC, get 1600 MHz DDR3 RAM with decent latencies.
No I dont intend to OC.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroy View Post
What I suggest is that you sit down with the IT guys
Ok I sat down with the IT guys and realised the following.

1. I use FEA about 3-4 times a year and if a model takes 30-40 minutes I am ok with it as I run the FEA during my lunch
2. I use Ulead about once a month but I need the machine to process 60 min of AVCHD to DVD fast.

If the budget is 1L for the PC the CPU cant cost more than 25K na? After all the motherbaord (30K), RAM (15K), Graphics card (15K) will also cost 60K and then the cabinet and Power supply will cost about 15K. The choices for under 25K are the Intel Xeon L5530 or Intel Core i7-960.

Which is preferable. Any other choices?
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Old 9th February 2011, 17:28   #1776
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
`Sandybridge' is the code name of newer generation of Intel processor, and has overwhelmingly received great reviews. Infact most are saying that in most cases, the previous generation i7 9xx series is history, and there is no reason to buy a $1000 processor (i7 980x) when a US$300-350 CPU (core i7-2600K/Sandybridge) will be comparable in most situations!!!.
That's still a lot more than I paid recently for my AMD processor, but still amazing. I wonder what AMD will do next!

I think it was from the Antec site that I learnt that power supplies age, and become capable of delivering less power over time, so, if one is making a long-term investment in case and PSU, this might be considered. I invested a lot in my case/psu (Antec P183 and CP850, coming to Rs17,000) but it was part of a strategy to get a quiet-running PC. I'd hope not to be doing a new build for three years, but, even then, I'd expect to be using the same case --- and perhaps, even, for the build after that!

The quiet pc has yet to be realised, by the way, by the replacement of the AMD stock cooler.
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Old 9th February 2011, 17:41   #1777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
The hardware in question is Dell Ultrasharp 2410. Display quality is subjective. Nearly every review (incl. anandtech, and other such highly rated review sites) rates it extremely high but user reviews are substantially different or at least significantly at odds with the reviews that I have had second thoughts about paying Rs. 30K for the monitor.
True. Look out for repeated mentions of a particular -ve in the user reviews, and then try to find a review of the monitor by someone who clearly knows what they are talking about. These days with tons and tons of new items coming out every day its hard to find good reviews.

I have a Dell Ultrasharp 2407 WFP. No complaints whatsoever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
The background to this is that I had bought a 22" Dell monitor in 2010 which had such a torn and grainy look that I had to get it replaced in 1 day at a loss of Rs. 6000.
Are you sure you were running the right resolution / refresh rate?
Also, i guess this depends on what panel is used (TN, IPS, S-PVA etc). Not all Dell monitors are created equal. Its like buying a Palio with a 1.2 or a 1.6 engine inside.

Strange that you made a loss of 6k. I hear Dell has AMAZING customer service. Did they not help you out? Infact one of my friends complained about his monitor and then sent him a NEW 24" IPS monitor as a replacement/upgrade!

cya
R
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Old 9th February 2011, 19:02   #1778
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To reply to the various queries:
1. I tried everything with the Dell incl. Nvidia tweak, monitor settings, etc but just gave up. Dell offered a same piece replacement and not a different monitor. Reading reviews only confuses because what is noticed by reviewers is not an average person will notice most of the time. But one bad experience with dell has made me wary of plonking 28-30K on another Dell (2410 ultrasharp) without being certain. Unfortunately in India, one does not get to see and experience PC monitors before purchasing. It is all based on references and reviews.
2. As to my MB, it is a m-ATX but then my case can take a proper ATX and that is what I will buy. No harm in mATX though.
3. As to Ivybridge vs Sandybridge, I do not plan on Sandybridge because of (a) plan on replacing only by July-Dec 2011 and by that time plans for Ivy.. or whatever will be more definite. No point in going from x58 to Sandy.. when Ivy../ is around the corner. To reduce the inferiority complex, as noted, OC will take care of some deficiencies. However, x58 is definitely out for me (not even a i7 980x). Buying i7 980x for 40-45K may sound cheap compared with buying Sandy/Ivy (replace both CPU+MB) but definitely worthwhile upgrade.
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Old 9th February 2011, 20:38   #1779
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Originally Posted by navin View Post
If the budget is 1L for the PC the CPU cant cost more than 25K na? After all the motherbaord (30K), RAM (15K), Graphics card (15K) will also cost 60K and then the cabinet and Power supply will cost about 15K. The choices for under 25K are the Intel Xeon L5530 or Intel Core i7-960.

Which is preferable. Any other choices?
If you're going for an i7, you have got to go for i7 2600. 2600K is unlocked, so offers overclocking, costs 2k more. But you don't intend on OCing, which, by the way, is a breeze with K-series and offers serious performance increases, so you don't really need the 'K-series'. But yes, wait till mid-march when the newer boards are out.
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Old 9th February 2011, 21:15   #1780
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
`Sandybridge' is the code name of newer generation of Intel processor, and has overwhelmingly received great reviews. Infact most are saying that in most cases, the previous generation i7 9xx series is history, and there is no reason to buy a $1000 processor (i7 980x) when a US$300-350 CPU (core i7-2600K/Sandybridge) will be comparable in most situations!!!. You can google a lot about this. Note that even better processors should be out in late-2011/2012 but they should be much over 35-40K (perhaps 50-60K for CPU+MB+decent RAM speed and sticks).

However, these processors had a chipset problem and so if you want to buy one, you may have to wait till April-May-June (in India).

I would say buy a core i7-2600K (Rs. 15-18K) or i5-2600K (should be Rs. 12-15K), get a decent MB (MSI/Gigabyte for 10-20K but even 10-15K should get you a very good MB with lots of options and features), and get at least 1600MHz DDR3 RAM (min 4 GB). Decent 1600MHz RAM from good manufacturers and with good latency presently costs on average perhaps Rs. 800-1200 per GB. So, say 6GB should be Rs. 6-7K. If you are into OC, even 1833 MHz can be considered. By May-June, RAM prices should fall some more, as is the case for all components.

As a helpful tip, the Sandybridge CPU is LGA socket 1155 and there are 2 categories of MB-H67 and P67. P67 is perhaps for OC. In CPU, there are two types, say i5-2400 (on H67) and i5-2400K (on P67). The CPU price diff between non-k/H67 and K/P67 is not much and K/P67 overclock better and safer. The line-up should be populated over the course of 2011 perhaps.

Bottomline is that 30-40K should get you a system that would be mostly better than the present core i7-9xx series. Just wait till April-June. No point in buying yesterday's stuff at this budget.

Thanks alot for that. So I guess ill wait till then and make my decision since your saying new products will be out and prices will fall. Thanks for the detailed explanation. And I dont know crap about overclocking so I doubt ill need anything which supports it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anku94 View Post


Absolutely. I looked up Dells and HPs and Lenovos today morning, and didn't find very good configs, even at high prices.

Yes, most vendors don't know a thing about assembling. Why don't you ask some BHPian who lives in your city to recommend you one ? Any vendor who could live up to a BHPian's expectations is most likely a good vendor.

Sandy Bridges are new generation Intel processors, and have received very positive reviews. But a design error has been found in motherboards that support Sandy Bridge processors, and Intel's busy rectifying the error while manufacturers all over the world are implementing recall programs. Problem's expected to be sorted out by february end, while new motherboards are expected to be out in March.

That would be good time. You'll have many motherboard choices at that time.

By smaller cabinets, you mean the micro-ATX form factor. @Vasudeva uses a mATX board. They have some limitations, but that isn't a problem for anyone but a very high end user.

Oh, you have a card...great ! Now you can easily fit in a i5 2500K in your budget. (Costs Rs. 12k-15k). Let's have a look at motherboards in March or April.

Power supply
: Corsairs are good and most easily available. So I think Corsair 450VX is fine, unless you have a very powerful and power consuming graphics card. (Costs 4k, but it's a lifelong investment as a power supply doesn't need to be upgraded very often)

Case : Go for a good one, depending on the availability. Expect to shell about 3k (at least) for a good one. NZXT Vulcan is a good one, but not so small, but won't have any installation issues. If you go for very small cases, you will have problems with installation, some things might not fit.

Another good option is Silverstone SG02. It comes with a 300W power supply. If your graphics card has low power consumption, you can go for this one. It is also smaller than the Vulcan.

CPU : i5 2500 (i5 2500K if you're gonna overclock. It's priced about 2k higher)

Motherboard : Wait a month, and then check out good mATX boards.

Storage : WD Caviar Black is a performance HDD while Samsung Spinpoint F3 is a budget good performance HDD. Choose one depending on your budget. Spinpoint F3 might be hard to procure, though.

RAM : Don't have much info about those. Grab Corsair/Patriot/Mushkin DDR3 (CAS Latency : 7, 1400/1600MHz whatever speeds they come in) 6GB, or maybe someone can give better suggestions.
Thanks alot for the post. My card is probably the basic 1gb model considering I paid like 5k for it I think, maybe less. Will it be fine to continue using?

Even the OS (Windows 7 I guess) would be around 5-6k? And the less I spend the happier my family will be. Anyway will need it for 3 years max.

So the bottom line is that I should wait till march or so and then start asking you guys questions.
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Old 9th February 2011, 21:40   #1781
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I also do not know much about OC but a moderate OC (10-25% over stock frequency) is a matter of mins in i7 series. Just change the bclk in BIOS. OC is a separate issue and a reasonable and moderate OC needs a decent CPU cooler costing around Rs. 3-5K. But that gives a great boost and is worthwhile. i7 series are very easy to OC and one gets something for nothing (or max a cooler).

I am not saying new prods. Just Sansdybridge problem should be rectified. Once that happens, buy it. FYI, Sandybridge or 2nd gen i series are numbered in 4 digits (eg i5-2400). The previous generation i-3/5/7 CPU were numbered in 3 digits. The sansdybridge CPU will get populated and the present highest CPU is i7-2600K.
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Old 9th February 2011, 21:52   #1782
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My card is probably the basic 1gb model considering I paid like 5k for it I think, maybe less. Will it be fine to continue using?
It's difficult to say without knowing the exact model. With a Corsair 450W, it will be fine, but with a Seasonic SG02 300W, impossible to say. If you are unable to obtain the model number, run this tool.

GPU-Z Video card GPU Information Utility

Quote:
Even the OS (Windows 7 I guess) would be around 5-6k?
Yes, forgot to mention that. It was 6.7k online [Win7 Home Premium].

Quote:
And the less I spend the happier my family will be.
I know the feeling. My parents always get jitters when I propose a new purchase.

Quote:
So the bottom line is that I should wait till march or so and then start asking you guys questions.
Yes. If you have a clue on how much you'll be spending on a motherboard, you'll be in a better position to manage the rest of your budget.
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Old 9th February 2011, 21:56   #1783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anku94 View Post
It's difficult to say without knowing the exact model. With a Corsair 450W, it will be fine, but with a Seasonic SG02 300W, impossible to say. If you are unable to obtain the model number, run this tool.

GPU-Z Video card GPU Information Utility


Yes, forgot to mention that. It was 6.7k online [Win7 Home Premium].

I know the feeling. My parents always get jitters when I propose a new purchase.

Yes. If you have a clue on how much you'll be spending on a motherboard, you'll be in a better position to manage the rest of your budget.
Its the ATI Radeon HD 4350. Hows that?

Man I got lots planned for my car, so whatever is saved on this goes into my car

Thanks alot anku and vasudeva.

And just for the heck of it the rest of my setup -
26" samsung monitor (keeping this and also getting a 46-50" plasma which ill use as my monitor sometimes)
Altec Lansing MX5021 Speakers
Razer Tarantula Keyboard and Razer Lachesis mouse

And my CPU -
Intel core 2 dui 6300
Vista home premium (got it a week after its release, hence the old processor too. MB was changed last year along with graphics card)
Some Asus MB
320gb HDD

Last edited by Akshay1234 : 9th February 2011 at 22:02.
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Old 10th February 2011, 02:51   #1784
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Its the ATI Radeon HD 4350. Hows that?
Oh ! Its TDP is a measly 20W. You could run it by connecting it to a windmill and keeping the windmill near your nose (just kidding). In that case, the Seasonic SG02 is a good option.

SilverStone SG05 : Hands-On With Five Mini-ITX Cases
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Old 10th February 2011, 06:19   #1785
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Default re: The Computer & Configuration Thread

Whatever be your present card, do go for around 450-500W PSU from a good company (I prefer Coolermaster). It will save you some costs later and a lot of headaches.

As to MB, I saw a figure of Rs. 30K. That is too high for sandybridge. I think mid-end start from 10K and Gigabyte P67-UD5 should be around Rs. 14-15K. A very good MB can be had for less than 20K. I think 25-30K is for Gigabyte X58 UD9 or Ua9, which anyway is out now.
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