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Old 4th October 2007, 23:17   #1051
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All these are high grade or super high grade lenses (weather sealed).

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Old 4th October 2007, 23:33   #1052
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1500$ vs 400$?
fisheye is something else, for someone just wanting a nice wide angle lens with around 15-16mm FOV, oly is a bad bet for now.
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Old 5th October 2007, 10:00   #1053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
1500$ vs 400$?
fisheye is something else, for someone just wanting a nice wide angle lens with around 15-16mm FOV, oly is a bad bet for now.
Well, you are comparing price of lenses of two different quality levels. Unfortunately Olympus offers only super high grade quality lenses in ultra wide or ultra tele ranges.

On the tele side they are finally offering a cheaper 70-300mm lens, till now I am stuck with 50-200mm with max EFL of 400mm or 560mm with TC.

But on the wider side, it is really expensive to make good wide lens for 4/3 format. If wide angle photography is your main stay, then it is expensive, but you'll get excellent glass.

But if you are happy with 22mm EFL or above, then Olympus proves to be excellent value for money.
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Old 5th October 2007, 11:25   #1054
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post
such high ISO in daylight, hope you didnt turn on your flashlight too. heheh..kidding
he he, thankfully the flashlight pops up giving an indication

Quote:
Originally Posted by mail4ajo View Post
But what was the idea to shoot with 800+ ISO in broad daylight? I thought higher the ISO, higher the noise. I also learned that using the flash in bright sunlight enhances the image. Correct if wrong.
Yeah it was a mistake. Thats what I was trying to point out. But it is after all an SLR, and even mistakes like these dont seem to show up. Check this shot taken at ISO 1600. (zero pp)



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Originally Posted by vivek_pinkoo View Post
I come across one news about DIGICAM CCD fails (DISPLAY PROBLEM IN SHOOTING MODE) in those cameras where sony supplied the CCDs to different manufactures including CANON.

Anybody having detail about the same and facing such problem?
I have faced same problem with my S1 IS. It was over 4 years old and bought from US. I did not have any bill or warranty. Canon India has replaced the CCD Free of charge. Really good service, I must add. Infact, at one point they gave free S3 IS for some people (my friend got it, unlucky me) But still free of charge service is good enough for a 4 year old camera. (However, they have to be convinced it is that CCD fault ONLY)
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Old 5th October 2007, 13:32   #1055
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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
Gotta admit, I was shocked to see the prices above (grey I think). But to see Canon 400D costing same as the much superior Olympus E-510 is really funny.
Canon 400D everywhere else is considerably cheaper than Oly. Which one of the two is better, is relative. Canon has better sensor and 9 point autofocus, it also has the dust reduction system, the only thing it looses out on is the IS, but then Canon has better metering of the two (Nikon is the best).
For maximum bang for the buck, none comes close to Pentax K10D

P.S. The oly's are the cheapest on the site you mentioned.

Last edited by extreme_torque : 5th October 2007 at 13:48.
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Old 5th October 2007, 13:37   #1056
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Quote:
But what was the idea to shoot with 800+ ISO in broad daylight? I thought higher the ISO, higher the noise. I also learned that using the flash in bright sunlight enhances the image. Correct if wrong.
I guess the noise did not show up probably because the job of high ISO setting is to amplify the very feeble light signals in low-light situations and this high amplification is the source of the noise. And while shooting in broad daylight, no amplification would be required and hence, noise would not be generated. Anyway, would try with my Canon A-1710IS at high ISO and report the results.
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Old 5th October 2007, 13:43   #1057
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anuragn View Post
I guess the noise did not show up probably because the job of high ISO setting is to amplify the very feeble light signals in low-light situations and this high amplification is the source of the noise. And while shooting in broad daylight, no amplification would be required and hence, noise would not be generated. Anyway, would try with my Canon A-1710IS at high ISO and report the results.
The noise would be there, since you asking the sensor to amplify or gain.
The shutter speed would be lower than it would have been at lower ISO but noise would be there.
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Old 5th October 2007, 14:43   #1058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
Well, you are comparing price of lenses of two different quality levels. Unfortunately Olympus offers only super high grade quality lenses in ultra wide or ultra tele ranges.

On the tele side they are finally offering a cheaper 70-300mm lens, till now I am stuck with 50-200mm with max EFL of 400mm or 560mm with TC.

But on the wider side, it is really expensive to make good wide lens for 4/3 format. If wide angle photography is your main stay, then it is expensive, but you'll get excellent glass.

But if you are happy with 22mm EFL or above, then Olympus proves to be excellent value for money.
For wide angle photography, if I am okay with 1500$ I can get very very wide lenses on Canon.
I don't think that the 2x crop factor makes good sense.
510, 400D, 350D are entry level SLRs and people buy them because they cant afford the Mark IIs etc., etc.,
When I started photography I had this telephoto crazy, and coupled with my low light craze I was really dissapointed that oly did not make a cam that did ISO 1600 decently(E-500).
But now I do mostly wide angle, and even 28mm FOV seems to be too much.
I need 10-22mm. It costs 650$ if I want the high quality canon one.
At this price point its an excellent lens with pretty decent quality.
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Old 5th October 2007, 14:52   #1059
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Quote:
Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
Canon 400D everywhere else is considerably cheaper than Oly. Which one of the two is better, is relative. Canon has better sensor and 9 point autofocus, it also has the dust reduction system, the only thing it looses out on is the IS, but then Canon has better metering of the two (Nikon is the best).
400D having better sensor than E-510 is questionable (NMOS vs CMOS), there are no benchmarks, so let's leave that alone.

The 9-point AF, it may help you focus faster than Olympus, but once the focus is acquired there is no difference. If you are not into action photography, this is not an advantage.

The dust reduction from Olympus actually works, the one on Canon barely works, the one on Pentax/Sony doesn't work at all.

Proof: Review: Dust removal systems / sensor cleaning - Pixinfo.com

The E-510 has IS that really works, has been proved in the field to provide 2 stop advantage. The 400d doesn't have this feature.

The E-510 has live-view feature which works very well, the 400D doesn't have this feature.

The E-510 has spot metering, 400D doesn't.

The kit lenses that come with E-510 are of top-notch compared to 400D or even the older E-500 it succeeded.

I am only pointing out features that matter to photographers, I am sure both of them have many exclusive superficial features. I definitely agree 400D is better than my E-500 in many ways, but E-510 is miles ahead of both of these.

However, people may still prefer to buy 400D over E-510 even with all the points. That could be due to reasons like ease of local availability, brand recognition, bigger lens choices, aiming to upgrade to pro body, etc.
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Old 5th October 2007, 14:56   #1060
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
But now I do mostly wide angle, and even 28mm FOV seems to be too much.
I need 10-22mm. It costs 650$ if I want the high quality canon one.
At this price point its an excellent lens with pretty decent quality.
In that case I suggest you keep away from Olympus. It becomes too expensive in both Ultra-wide and ultra-tele range. It is very VFM between 28-400mm without considering TC.
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Old 5th October 2007, 16:20   #1061
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
400D having better sensor than E-510 is questionable (NMOS vs CMOS), there are no benchmarks, so let's leave that alone.
ISO 800 and 1600 images have much lesser noise than Oly. 2X crop factor is also a major hindrance.

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The 9-point AF, it may help you focus faster than Olympus, but once the focus is acquired there is no difference. If you are not into action photography, this is not an advantage.
It also makes focus tracking easier in case of say a flying bird. If I buy a DSLR, i want it to be as complete as possible, as a picture taking tool.

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The dust reduction from Olympus actually works, the one on Canon barely works, the one on Pentax/Sony doesn't work at all.

Proof: Review: Dust removal systems / sensor cleaning - Pixinfo.com
Agreed... I have read this before.

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The E-510 has IS that really works, has been proved in the field to provide 2 stop advantage. The 400d doesn't have this feature.
I have already mentioned this and its the only thing Canon lacks atleast on paper. Also there's no beating the Canon Prime and L lenses.

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The E-510 has live-view feature which works very well, the 400D doesn't have this feature.
Depends, for me it doesnt matter. Infact I dont think this actually matter for a lot of photographers out there.
The live view adds about a second of shutter lag and the halfpress shutter release button does not locks focus.

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Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The E-510 has spot metering, 400D doesn't.
The metering itself in Oly isnt as accurate as Canon. There are workarounds for not having spot metering, though not perfect. The in-cam processing isnt as good as Canon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The kit lenses that come with E-510 are of top-notch compared to 400D or even the older E-500 it succeeded.
Again debatable. Ameteur's wont even be able to make out this, for pro's there's always the L and P lenses from Canon.

P.S. E-510 does not support a battery grip or an AC adapter.
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Old 5th October 2007, 16:30   #1062
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In my opinion the in built anti-shake, may not be as effective as lens-based stabilization, especially at longer focal lengths, nor is it visible through the optical viewfinder.


On the other hand you do enjoy the benefits of IS on any lens you attach to a camera with in built anti-shake.
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Old 5th October 2007, 17:02   #1063
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There is no end to this argument, let's defer to the experts. See what he says about ISO1600 performance of 400D/D40x/E-510. Also check the kit lens performance.

Olympus EVOLT E-510 Digital Camera - Full Review - The Imaging Resource!

I am not saying E-510 is flawless, it does have certain quirks, and it has some major advantages. For me the advantages of E-510 overwhelm that of 400D, for you it is the other way. I shoot ISO100 99% of the time, so I don't care about high ISO performance. All my lenses are L quality equivalent at much cheaper price, again I feel that's an advantage.

For me E-510 > 400D and for you E-510 < 400D. That's fine with me. The proof of the pudding is in the eating (Sam, you watching?). So, let's do further argument through our images in the non-auto image thread.

Last edited by Samurai : 5th October 2007 at 17:15. Reason: typo
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Old 5th October 2007, 17:07   #1064
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So, let's do futher argument through our images in the non-auto image thread.
Thats the knock-out punch eh? good one!
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Old 5th October 2007, 17:50   #1065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
There is no end to this argument, let's defer to the experts. See what he says about ISO1600 performance of 400D/D40x/E-510. Also check the kit lens performance.

Olympus EVOLT E-510 Digital Camera - Full Review - The Imaging Resource!

I am not saying E-510 is flawless, it does have certain quirks, and it has some major advantages. For me the advantages of E-510 overwhelm that of 400D, for you it is the other way. I shoot ISO100 99% of the time, so I don't care about high ISO performance. All my lenses are L quality equivalent at much cheaper price, again I feel that's an advantage.

For me E-510 > 400D and for you E-510 < 400D. That's fine with me. The proof of the pudding is in the eating (Sam, you watching?). So, let's do further argument through our images in the non-auto image thread.
Its the same experts who say that images straight out of the cam are "dissapointing" and that you have to play around with settings to get a decent or a good image which is not the case with Canon. Being a DSLR I expect 510's performance at high ISO to be good but I compared it with Canon and you may read reviews or even look at higher ISO images, the canon is the better of the two. E510 is certainly the better specified of the two and excellent value for money but those extra's may matter to you and not me.
In bright light most of the DSLR's would shoot the same, with almost the same detail, what really matters to me is what happens when the going get a little tough, for example indoor pics without flash, evening shots, shooting on cloudy days and that when you require the high ISO performance to be really good. I am sure E-510 would be very close, but close isnt good enough for me
I am not saying Canon is the better of the two, but I look at it from my perspective, and to me Canon seems a better bet right now.
I have a Canon S3 IS right now and I plan to buy a ameteur DSLR in the near future, I might as well go for the E-510 because its a compelling choice in its segment, one of the best. I will be having difficult times ahead choosing b/w these.... Pentax K10D, Canon 400D, Oly 510 as my first entry level DSLR.
By the way I dont have my images on the thread you mentioned, you can check them out on my flickr page, the link of which, is my signature.

Happy Clicking,
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