Help Computer Configuration

[bottle]

Originally Posted by BUSA

I want a CPU which will remain switched on 24 hours a day(there should be no heating issues) and i can play all games on it. And when i want to upgrade its not a problem.

just a suggestion for a video card get one of the new ati radeon 3850 or 3870 depending on your budget if you can. they wont be bleeding edge but they run very cool and will handle most of the latest games for sure

[Nikhilb2008]

OMG. Notorious. You have no idea whom you are dealing with. I suggest you back off.

@Chaos --- Go for the jugular . I want a replay of Shantanu from digit .

PS: This isnt the same Shant2nu who is here on t-bhp.

[Amey]

1] for 25.5k i can also include a q6600, which is a quad core processor. over clock it and play all games you want.

Well most of the games are not optimised for quad core so given a choice, clock to clock i would choose a faster dual core, in this case a faster Core2Duo.

2]Nvidia is Nvidia and ati cannot match it where the performance is needed.and i said that suggest a vista compatible vidio card in 5-7k range and not 10k

Really ? Also what he is trying to say is readjusting the CPU and GPU budget, which makes sense. I guess you are not aware of the 9800Pro / Geforce 5950 era, otherwise you wouldnt have made that claim. FYI there is 8500GT which is ~ 4k so basically, there are cheaper vista capable video cards. If vista capability is all thats needed, one doesnt need to go for 8600GT.


3] There you proved that you are not satisfied with your own pc.a person who cannot make a pc for himself, what he will advice to others. There is a way to do something.if you dont know the way, then it is not a mistake of any product or drivers.

Woaah ! thats a bold statement.Well ROC is pretty experienced when it comes to building PCs. He knows what he is doing for sure.If he went for that board, there must be a reason for it, in this case it was SLI support i suppose.
Have you ever played with the 680i based boards to make such statements ? I have and i know how that chipset behaves.Its great for memory clocking but sucks overall.Intel chipsets are much better overall for Intel platform.Except for SLI support and good memory clocking capability, i dont think there is anything great about that chipset and mind you that chipset is quite expensive but that doesnt translate into performance.

4] Dont tell me that you are assembling pc's from 90s and never heard of xfx nvidia.

XFX is a division of Pine and was non existant in the early 90s or for that matter even the mid 90s.
They are Nvidia partners for cards and boards. Thats what my limited knowledge tells me, never heard of anything like 'XFX Nvidia'

5] source ?. I really need one very badly,best boards in the world are made on nvidia chipsets.wanna proof ???

Yeah i want to see a proof. Please prove your statement.I would like to see all the 'BEST' boards built on Nvidia chipset.

6] Where the hell in world you overclock a core2duo E-6750 for just surfing net and downloading movies.

Read properly man, Busa mentioned that he uses the PC for gaming too.Higher clocked CPU always helps in improving gaming performance.

7] Cabinet with psu =odessy with 500 watt smps =2000

Heh, 500W PSU along with a cabinet for 2k, speaks a LOT about the PSU.BTW whats current rating on the +12V Rails on that PSU ?

8] not worth spending extra few buks on 800mhz as there is no performance gain

You sure about that ? would you like me to prove you wrong ? 800MHz IS faster than 667 at same timings and does affect performance.
Also isnt it stupid to go for a fast CPU and cut on the RAM ? 2GB always helps, suggesting E6750 with 1GB is plain stupid. E6550 + 2GB makes way much more sense.

Some comments for you notorious

[reignofchaos]

BUSA if you can spend more, spend on the video card before spending on the CPU. You'll get a lot more mileage that way and the system will last much longer. The ATI HD 3850 that got launched last week seems to be really good and eats very little power.

As for notorious, don't think I need to say something. Amey has already said whatever I wanted to.

[Amey]

Busa ji,
As ROC already mentioned and i have also mentioned that most of the games are not optimized for Quad Cores and higher clocked Dual Core is much better.So it is benificial for you to go for a cheaper ,lesser clocked CPU with a better GPU. The ATI 3850 and 3870 are really impressive cards with low costs.
So if you get an E6550 or even E4500 or so, you can overclock it easily with a good motherboard like Abit IP35-E.

[NOTORIOUS]

Originally Posted by nikhilb2008

OMG. Notorious. You have no idea whom you are dealing with. I suggest you back off.

Thank you for your suggestion, but i will not.

[Amey]

@ Notorious,
man you were going to provide some proofs, i am waiting

[NOTORIOUS]

Originally Posted by Amey

1]Well most of the games are not optimised for quad core so given a choice, clock to clock i would choose a faster dual core, in this case a faster Core2Duo.

Thank you , i think you are right sir.


2]Really ? Also what he is trying to say is readjusting the CPU and GPU budget, which makes sense. I guess you are not aware of the 9800Pro / Geforce 5950 era, otherwise you wouldnt have made that claim. FYI there is 8500GT which is ~ 4k so basically, there are cheaper vista capable video cards. If vista capability is all thats needed, one doesnt need to go for 8600GT.

Sir, you are right, i am not aware of ati series as it is not my taste.and i am suggesting 8600gt as it offers some very good performance then 8500gt.

3] Woaah ! thats a bold statement.Well ROC is pretty experienced when it comes to building PCs. He knows what he is doing for sure.If he went for that board, there must be a reason for it, in this case it was SLI support i suppose.
Have you ever played with the 680i based boards to make such statements ? I have and i know how that chipset behaves.Its great for memory clocking but sucks overall.Intel chipsets are much better overall for Intel platform.Except for SLI support and good memory clocking capability, i dont think there is anything great about that chipset and mind you that chipset is quite expensive but that doesnt translate into performance.

yes sir , i have played on the chipsets which are based on nvidia 680i.the things which i have noticed is that they are just for anthusiast people who want some raw power for a short time , but for everyday use the are not as great as intel chipsets.

4]XFX is a division of Pine and was non existant in the early 90s or for that matter even the mid 90s.
They are Nvidia partners for cards and boards. Thats what my limited knowledge tells me, never heard of anything like 'XFX Nvidia'

No comments.

5] Yeah i want to see a proof. Please prove your statement.I would like to see all the 'BEST' boards built on Nvidia chipset.

Sir the boards are Asus Striker,Striker Extreme,Blitz etc.

6]Read properly man, Busa mentioned that he uses the PC for gaming too.Higher clocked CPU always helps in improving gaming performance.

I mean to say if you need to overclock then go for quad core.i agree that in normal conditions the core2duo is best ,but when you overclock a quad core then a core2duo is a history.a core2duo cannot compeate to a quad core when a quad core is overclocked.

7] Heh, 500W PSU along with a cabinet for 2k, speaks a LOT about the PSU.BTW whats current rating on the +12V Rails on that PSU ?

I will conferm and let you know.

8]You sure about that ? would you like me to prove you wrong ? 800MHz IS faster than 667 at same timings and does affect performance.

sir i mean to say that ther is a very little performance gain according to the price. rest is your decision.

9]Also isnt it stupid to go for a fast CPU and cut on the RAM ? 2GB always helps, suggesting E6750 with 1GB is plain stupid. E6550 + 2GB makes way much more sense.

I have suggested that because according to me ,adding a new ram of 1200 bucks in future is easy then changing the processor.
Some comments for you notorious

@Amey Sir i have posted the answers against your comments.

[Amey]

1] Sir the boards are Asus Striker,Striker Extreme,Blitz etc.

Well the Blitz series is based on Intel P35 chipset, if you didnt know, its not based on Nvidia 680i,650i etc..

2] I mean to say if you need to overclock then go for quad core.i agree that in normal conditions the core2duo is best ,but when you overclock a quad core then a core2duo is a history.a core2duo cannot compeate to a quad core when a quad core is overclocked.

Depends on the type of application. For example a faster clocked dual core will perform better than a lower clocked quad core in say , Super Pi. So basically it all boils down to what are apps optimized for. Quad core or multi core apps will benifit from faster clocked Quad core.

3] have suggested that because according to me ,adding a new ram of 1200 bucks in future is easy then changing the processor.

Right now DDR2 rates are low but that doesnt mean they have to remain like that forever, look what happened to DDR1, its very much expensive today,same will happen with DDR2 one day. Hence getting more memory when its dirt cheap makes much more sense.
If he gets the E6550, he can clock it to 2.66 [E6750] within a fraction of a second.But then this is just my opinion.

4] yes sir , i have played on the chipsets which are based on nvidia 680i.the things which i have noticed is that they are just for anthusiast people who want some raw power for a short time , but for everyday use the are not as great as intel chipsets

any particular observation that made you come to this conclusion ? Raw power as in ? Short time ? Pardon me but i didn't get you there.

5] Last but not the least, a list of some lackluster boards based on Nvidia chipsets,

1] Asus K8N
2] Asus SK8N

In short all board based on the Nvidia NF3 250Gb chipset, only exception being the DFI NF3 250 but that was superb engineering from DFI engineers.

So my point is Nvidia does make good chipsets but some of them have been horrible and some of them though good, have some shortcomings.

Cheers !

[chetan]

chaos is the ATI HD 3850 comparable to 8600gt ?

[Nos007]

Oh man please cool of don't be very hyper , this thread is for BUSA who needs a CPU with a small budget.

guyzz.. all the things depends upon the taste & budget

if u r an enthusiast & hardcore gamer, then u need a plenty of bucks to make an hardcore gamer PC,

and if u know exactly right that worlds best gaming motherboards like ASUS Striker & Striker Extreme are the only two motherboards which are based on NVIDIA nForce® 680i SLI™ chipset

&

ASUS Maximus Formula, Maximus Extreme, Maximus Formula (Special Edition), Blitz Formula (Special Edition), Blitz Extreme, Commando are some of the motherboards which are based on various intel chipsets...

so first of all get the right information & then post it on the site other then giving the bullish comments to each other....

all the above motherboards are way out of the reach of many peoples, they are very much expensive..

&

if u heard the name of company ALIENWARE which is recently takenover by the DELL then i would like to tell u that they make the fastest gaming PCs ever & in many of there PC's they mostly uses motherboards which are based on NVIDIA nForce® 680i SLI™ chipset... & in some of there PC'c they also used Intel chipsets...

&

coming to the Core 2 Quad(Kentsfiled) & Core 2 Duo(Conroe) in many applications Core 2 Duo with higher clock speed & FSB then Core 2 Quad performs better in a lot of applications, including games when runs in nominal mode, but with proper air-cooling when Core 2 Quad is overclocked then they perform better than Core 2 Duo CPUs overclocked to their maximum, Quad Core CPUs have twice as many computational cores & twice as large L2 cache as compare to Core 2 Duo CPUs, & plaese don't forget that most upcoming applications and games are being designed with multi-threading in mind that is why Core 2 Quad may be a more promising solution even if used in its nominal mode.

I am talking about the highest model of Core 2 Duo i.e Core 2 Duo E6850 which has a Nominal frequency of 3.0 GHz, Bus frequency of 1333 MHz with 4 MB L2 cache

&

the lowest model of Core 2 Quad i.e Core 2 Quad Q6600 which has a Nominal frequency of 2.4 GHz
, Bus frequency of 1067 MHz with 8 MB L2 cache



there is merely a very nominal price difference between both the processors.

i would also like to tell that the Intel's Core™2 Extreme quad-core processor that is QX9650 which is based on 45nm technology runs on the clock frequency of 3.0 GHz has 12 MB of total L2 cache & 1333 MHz front side bus u won't imagine the power of this Desktop processor it is the beast that has to unleashed, i am really curious to get the hands on this monster.

&

Coming to the GPUs ATI readon is very good but remember one thing that it wont be able to outperform NVIDIA..

NVIDIA GPUs are the worlds best & they'll continued to be the best.

thats why i am not going very technical with this but please guyz we are here to solve the others problem not creating problems for each other,

I know NOTORIOUS personally he is a very good Networking/Hardware engineer, i don't know other members in this thread but please instead of giving comment to each other share information, that will help in soughtout the problems.

Anywayzz Cheers Guyzz..

[reignofchaos]

^Its way way way faster.

[Blue_V]

Okay, this is solely bookish knowledge but I do read a lot. So here's what I have to say.

Buy a Quad core compatible Motherboard (45 nm compatible), get urself 2 GB RAM.

Regarding the CPUs, if you want the best performance get the Quad core + 8600GT. If budget contraints, overclock a E2xxx or E4xxx CPU + 8600GT.

Forget abt the 667/800 diff, but u need to get 2 GB atleast. Capacity first, speed next. Anyone agree?

[bottle]

Originally Posted by no

Coming to the GPUs ATI readon is very good but remember one thing that it wont be able to outperform NVIDIA..

thats a pretty bold statement. considering nvidia has been raped by ati on quite a few occasions. granted the current 8800 series is the performance king. the current 38X0 series are almost there and priced much less. so it would make sense for a casual gamer on a budget to go for that rather than the low end nvidia cards.

Its just that nvidia has a better precense that most dealers and computer engineers keep pimping nvidia than ati. i remember last time when the fx5200 was the end all of gpus for most pc dealers

[reignofchaos]

Originally Posted by Nos007

and if u know exactly right that worlds best gaming motherboards like ASUS Striker & Striker Extreme are the only two motherboards which are based on NVIDIA nForce® 680i SLI™ chipset

&

if u heard the name of company ALIENWARE which is recently takenover by the DELL then i would like to tell u that they make the fastest gaming PCs ever & in many of there PC's they mostly uses motherboards which are based on NVIDIA nForce® 680i SLI™ chipset... & in some of there PC'c they also used Intel chipsets...

There is only one board and its called the Striker Extreme. The other is the P5N32-E SLI. The only difference between the two is a backpanel display, onboard switches for power on/reset etc and a slightly more tweakable bios. The Striker is simply a waste of cash when the P5N32-E SLI can do what it can.

Alienware makes some of the ****tiest systems on the planet. Its obvious you've never used any. Their QA is so poor that they have the highest number of complaints registered per system in the industry. Then don't get me started on how poor their after sales service is. Go buy one and you'll know .

coming to the Core 2 Quad(Kentsfiled) & Core 2 Duo(Conroe) in many applications Core 2 Duo with higher clock speed & FSB then Core 2 Quad performs better in a lot of applications, including games when runs in nominal mode, but with proper air-cooling when Core 2 Quad is overclocked then they perform better than Core 2 Duo CPUs overclocked to their maximum, Quad Core CPUs have twice as many computational cores & twice as large L2 cache as compare to Core 2 Duo CPUs, & plaese don't forget that most upcoming applications and games are being designed with multi-threading in mind that is why Core 2 Quad may be a more promising solution even if used in its nominal mode.

Rubbish. The quads can't overclock as much as dual cores. An E6850 will overclock to 4GHz or more on air while getting a quadcore to clock more than 3.6 or so on air is hard... very very hard. In single or dual threaded apps, the dual core will hand the quad its posterior. You have to remember that more than 95% of the applications on PCs still belong to this category. Hell even at the same clock speeds, the quad will be slower than the dual core cos of scheduling issues. Plus one has to remember Amdahl's law which gives an upper bound to the expected speedup cos of parallelism. Basically means increasing the number of cores on a CPU improves performance sub linearly.

Infact your so called best of the best Striker Extreme has severe issues overclocking quad cores to more than 400FSB i.e. 3200MHz. To overclock quads properly, the board needs a GTL Ref chip and nearly all NF 680i boards lack this. Basically means no quad core overclocking. Been there, done that... 680i boards are absolute crap for quad cores and the bigger more hopeless thing is that they can't support the 45nm cpus at anything more than stock.

I am talking about the highest model of Core 2 Duo i.e Core 2 Duo E6850 which has a Nominal frequency of 3.0 GHz, Bus frequency of 1333 MHz with 4 MB L2 cache

&

the lowest model of Core 2 Quad i.e Core 2 Quad Q6600 which has a Nominal frequency of 2.4 GHz
, Bus frequency of 1067 MHz with 8 MB L2 cache



there is merely a very nominal price difference between both the processors.

What are you trying to prove here? As I said earlier the E6850 will be way way faster than the Q6600 in single and dual threaded apps. In a limited domain, the Q6600 will be faster.

i would also like to tell that the Intel's Core™2 Extreme quad-core processor that is QX9650 which is based on 45nm technology runs on the clock frequency of 3.0 GHz has 12 MB of total L2 cache & 1333 MHz front side bus u won't imagine the power of this Desktop processor it is the beast that has to unleashed, i am really curious to get the hands on this monster.

Best of luck... I'd rather spend my 1200$ on something more useful.

Coming to the GPUs ATI readon is very good but remember one thing that it wont be able to outperform NVIDIA..

NVIDIA GPUs are the worlds best & they'll continued to be the best.

thats why i am not going very technical with this but please guyz we are here to solve the others problem not creating problems for each other,

According to that generalization, a 7100GS is faster than an X1900XT . Do you think that is true?

The 8800 cards are the only cards till date since the Geforce 4 series cards where NVIDIA has actually outperformed ATI. If you have no clue about the video card world, please don't spew rubbish over here. Go compare a NVIDIA 7900 GTX with an ATI X1900XT. The NVIDIA chip will be absolutely murdered.

I know NOTORIOUS personally he is a very good Networking/Hardware engineer, i don't know other members in this thread but please instead of giving comment to each other share information, that will help in soughtout the problems.

Anywayzz Cheers Guyzz..

Yea this is true but we are also here to avoid misinformation. Thats exactly what you and notorious are spewing over here.