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Old 17th September 2012, 22:54   #4996
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Of connectors and accessories, of screen sizes and camera, of processing power and weight of design and usability.

Apple deems its ok to let go off the connector as the design was really old, for few of us had started to ask for a change to MagSafe type connector. They came up with lighting to save space to add battery life. Accessories can still work with the old devices via the additional connector (expensive but not to throw away your expensive jukebox or car charging kit). Bluetooth 4.0 addition indicates and is welcome for AirPlay and wireless data transfer, BTW it's said, couldn't confirm myself the connector is USB 2 not 3 indicating Apple thinks its more to charge than to transfer data.

Biggest screen size on phones can be your JB iPad connected to 3G how cool will be that with a Bluetooth headset. I have used it but it's no fun while not in comfort of office. Ergonomics dictates and Apple has the best interface. I don't feel comfortable with S Note with one hand operation.

Camera on iPhone will set the benchmark again not due to pixels but due to its low light, I am not great at this aspect and maybe someone else can compare it with Pureview from Lumia.

Processing power is great for the phone, I have seen quad core processor mock ups and those get real hot and eat battery not something you would want in a phone.

Weight though less is great here but there ought to be balance and I think Apple handled this perfectly, you do not feel the phone having mass at a particular part like in some Nokia and Samsung phones. Thought behind adds value to the device.

edit: I did not see new posts coming along.

NFC: a great tech but do you know it's again segregated. Not every NFC tag is made equal. Standardization and security is slowly changing this industry. Apple would have pushed and accelerated the progress but they would rather not side so soon. Evolution will bring new devices.

S3 vs iPhone : To each his own. I have both as devices and fun to play but I also still carry Nokia C5 as my mobile talk phone

Last edited by Sn1p3r : 17th September 2012 at 23:02.
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Old 18th September 2012, 01:15   #4997
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technocrat View Post
I am still not sure, how is it fleecing its customer?
The interface for dock is licensed to various accessory manufacturers.
Cables and connectors have fattest margins + they are not in 200$ bundle of subsidized phone ( except basic charger).t
To be fare all manufacturers selling Operator subsidised phones used to do this to make some extra money as the bulk deals are heavily discounted.
This changed last year with European commissions rule on one charger came in to force to minimize environmental impact.

European union enforced a universal charger rule but Apple being Apple they are getting around by putting a USB connector at the wall end ( from adapter to cable) an maintain propriety interface at phone end

Check this link.

http://ec.europa.eu/enterpise/sector...s/index_en.htm


I think they are not going to mend their ways until EU adds test for USB connector on the handset body in GCF type certification and force them to be compliant.
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Old 18th September 2012, 01:19   #4998
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Looks like the iPhone 5 is not as interesting as it was before. But what else to expect every year? I guess, the iPhone was itself an innovation and making innovation on the iPhone every year seems a bit too much. But I like the bigger screen on the iPhone 5.

Here is rather an interesting news from Yahoo

http://gadgets.ndtv.com/mobiles/news...ome-editorpick

Interesting way to get back into business.

Last edited by joe1980 : 18th September 2012 at 01:25.
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Old 18th September 2012, 01:30   #4999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
The interface for dock is licensed to various accessory manufacturers.
Agreed, it makes a lot of business sense, but I still don't get fleecing part. As this doesn't change for existing makers, almost all the old docks would work with the adapter except a few which are designed for specific dimensions of an iDevice in which case the dock wouldn't have worked anyways.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Cables and connectors have fattest margins + they are not in 200$ bundle of subsidized phone ( except basic charger).
The basic cable comes with all iOS devices, the adapter would have to be bought, pretty standard practice I would say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
To be fare all manufacturers selling Operator subsidised phones used to do this to make some extra money as the bulk deals are heavily discounted.
Exactly, why blame just Apple then as some folks are doing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
European union enforced a universal charger rule but Apple being Apple they are getting around by putting a USB connector at the wall end ( from adapter to cable) an maintain propriety interface at phone end

Check this link.

http://ec.europa.eu/enterpise/sector...s/index_en.htm
Interesting info, I am unable to open your link, it points to the index page after a brief message.
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Old 18th September 2012, 08:13   #5000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
European union enforced a universal charger rule but Apple being Apple they are getting around by putting a USB connector at the wall end ( from adapter to cable) an maintain propriety interface at phone end.

http://ec.europa.eu/enterpise/sector...s/index_en.htm

I think they are not going to mend their ways until EU adds test for USB connector on the handset body in GCF type certification and force them to be compliant.
They didn't get around it by putting a USB connector at the wall end because the Apple cables have that anyway. What they did was make a MicroUSB to Lightning adapter at the device end.

And according to the EU Memorandum, it's perfectly valid if a manufacturer makes available an adapter for non-microUSB connectors.

Excerpt: "In order that compatibility of as many Mobile Phones as possible with a Common EPS may be enabled, if a manufacturer makes available an Adaptor from the Micro-USB connector of a Common EPS to a specific non-Micro-USB socket in the Mobile Phone, it shall constitute compliance to this article."
Link: http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/secto...ers_mou_en.pdf

Apple is offering MicroUSB adapter for the Lightning connector in Europe and consequently fulfills its obligations to the memorandum. I seriously doubt that the EU is as concerned about this as you are.

---

Meanwhile this is interesting:

iPhone 5 benchmarks have appeared in Geekbench.
It reveals a dual-core, 1GHz CPU with 1GB RAM.
The really interesting bit is this: it handily beats the quad-core, 2GB RAM Samsung S3. In fact, it beats every Android phone and tablet out there. Goes to show that good design and engineering can trump technical specs every time.
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Old 18th September 2012, 08:14   #5001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anujmishra

This is really funny that Apple has done some survey.

1. There is no NFC in IPhone 5, which is one of biggest demanding features of Smartphone.
I mentioned that probably Apple has done a survey, not sure.

NFC, I see it going the Flash way. NFC us being propagated a lot in payment card industry for donkeys years. But, it has not taken off as expected , because of various reasons.

I see Samsung devices like Korean cars; lots of features, attractive prices - great to sell. But, reality dawns once you start using them.
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Old 18th September 2012, 11:06   #5002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technocrat View Post
Agreed, it makes a lot of business sense, but I still don't get fleecing part. As this doesn't change for existing makers, almost all the old docks would work with the adapter except a few which are designed for specific dimensions of an iDevice in which case the dock wouldn't have worked anyways.
The basic cable comes with all iOS devices, the adapter would have to be bought, pretty standard practice I would say.
For existing devices it is just pushing down as 30$ adapter but that is not what probably Anuj called fleecing.


See it works like this a good quality micro USB cable can be at the most 2$ in open market so a consumer is unlikey to spend 38$ on a OEM cable ( there are still some people who buy overpriced OEM micro USB cable but let's keep them aside ).

Micro USB / USB spec is open so any vendor making speakers , Gym equipments , Car Audio etc can use the same connector and he need not pay royalty so these devices are cheaper whereas iPOD specific docks , Treadmills , lightning mood enhancers , head /back massagers etc need to pay connector royalty on every device being manufactured.

By 2012 majority of iPhone buyers have already collected the acessories they want so it is time to push them to another spending cycle.
For couple of years you will have this 30$ converter available in shops but slowly it will strart fading away and others wont be able to make it legally.

Over a period new acessories will just have lightning conncetor forcing existing users to change iPhone to newer ones rather then buy expensive adapters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technocrat View Post
Exactly, why blame just Apple then as some folks are doing?

.
They were fleecing but stopped after EU nudge in 2011 ( Mandated from 2nd Feb 2012) Apple saw the nudge and continued fleecing with a small workaround to fit in compliance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Orko View Post
I seriously doubt that the EU is as concerned about this as you are.
EU is seriously concerened and that is why they came up with this idea the proposal was to save environment , This has exctly forced Nokia , Samung and Motorola to abondon propriety connectors and forgo around 50 to 100 $ revanue per handset in aftermarket bundles.

Yes there are workarounds untill they are plugged by tighter compliance norms and this is historically how it works first a spec comes then it becomes mandatory after an year and then it gets added to GCF Type certification. Thereafter they strat removing workaround and loopholes.

In fact ECC has very good track record in development of mobile telecom industry as I have seen over last 15 years. Remember EU forced Erricson, Nokia and others to come together and agree on GSM in late 80s and they came up with very strict GCF type compliance for handset manufacturers. Also it was EU which forced SIM card on handset vendors as they did not want locked phones.
It is another story that manufacturers came up with locking mechanisms defeating original intent.

US was a late bloomer in Mobile world as for whole of 90s the networks were fragmented in AMPS , DAMPS , CDMA etc they came up with PTCRB type certification as late as 1997 , Till today you have a problem that handsets on one major network don't work on another.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Orko View Post
Meanwhile this is interesting:

iPhone 5 benchmarks have appeared in Geekbench.
It reveals a dual-core, 1GHz CPU with 1GB RAM.
The really interesting bit is this: it handily beats the quad-core, 2GB RAM Samsung S3. In fact, it beats every Android phone and tablet out there. Goes to show that good design and engineering can trump technical specs every time.
Sigh .. A core is not just a Core the Quad Core processors are Cortax-A9 where as the A6 is Cortax-A15 , So most of the performance gain is due to newer generation ARM core.
I suspect that Apple has fittered away the core advantage as of now in iOS6 by not using any advanced possibility like Automatic Scaling of Graphics ( Why letterbox mode ?? ) , No Virtualization Caging for secure transections ( Why to use A15 if you dont want to use the instruction set)

Last edited by amitk26 : 18th September 2012 at 11:10.
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Old 18th September 2012, 12:40   #5003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technocrat View Post
almost all the old docks would work with the adapter except a few which are designed for specific dimensions of an iDevice in which case the dock wouldn't have worked anyways.
I doubt. There are many docks on which if you put adapter on IPhone, you may risk to damage your $1000 IPhone. Adapters cannot guarantee stability. Many of them have to provide one more docks for new IPhone to work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technocrat View Post
The basic cable comes with all iOS devices, the adapter would have to be bought, pretty standard practice I would say.
Correct but selling it for $30 which probably others can make and sell for $2 - $5. Who is earning rest for such trivial device?
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Old 18th September 2012, 12:51   #5004
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Default re: The iPhone Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by anujmishra View Post



Correct but selling it for $30 which probably others can make and sell for $2 - $5. Who is earning rest for such trivial device?
I bought a couple of cables from DX.
One was a USB, other was an AV out for an IP4. All in all for about 15$.
Worked perfectly, and then one ios upgrade later, suddenly these were not compatible. Option was to buy it for 35$ off of apple. That sounded unfair.
And all i wanted was to watch movies off the phone in hotels.
So i got a 10$ AV cable for my tab instead.
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Old 18th September 2012, 12:58   #5005
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Yes there are workarounds untill they are plugged by tighter compliance norms...
Would you call something a workaround or a loophole if it's specifically sanctioned in an official document??
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Old 18th September 2012, 13:30   #5006
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FYI: Spoke to my personal manager from Vodafone. The nano sim will be available sometime from the first week of October.
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Old 18th September 2012, 13:51   #5007
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Would you call something a workaround or a loophole if it's specifically sanctioned in an official document??
It is indeed a workaround , All such provisions are outcome of intensive lobbying and efforts in standardization bodies / Industry consortiums.

Anyway I really don't understand what is the point here , Do you think changing adapters or insistance on deviation from standard is an act of Philanthrophy or is it in anyway improvised over USB , USB-MHL or any other form of connectivity ?
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Old 18th September 2012, 14:37   #5008
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Here is a link for impact of the lightning adapter on movement to BT for healthcare segment.

http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Health-Care...etooth-192179/

Bluetooth was not very popular in healthcare peripheral segment due to costs but the lightning adapter has exposed vulnerability of peripheral makers to Apple.

Impact should be similar to all accessory makers but I guess entertainment oriented peripherals can absorb the cost easily and may even benefit as people spending thousands on high end entertainment systems can easily buy new lightning to HDMI , Lightning to USB, Lightning to VGA adapters.
And entirely new peripherals in some cases.
On the other hand some other segments may rethink as a 5$ BT chip makes better sense now.

This does not include china based peripheral makers for Dealextreme etc because usually they have zero royalty impact

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
It is indeed a workaround , All such provisions are outcome of intensive lobbying and efforts in standardization bodies / Industry consortia.

Anyway I really don't understand what is the point here , Do you think changing adapters or insistence on deviation from standard is an act of Philanthropy or is it in anyway improvised over USB , USB-MHL or any other form of connectivity ?
Mods: Sorry for back to back post can't Edit previous one

Last edited by amitk26 : 18th September 2012 at 14:38. Reason: Mods: Sorry for back to back post can't Edit previous one
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Old 18th September 2012, 14:59   #5009
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The Iphone 5 performance gains are notable and as per anandtech experts, the A6 is the first Apple SoC to use its own ARMv7 based processor design. The CPU core(s) aren't based on a vanilla A9 or A15 design from ARM IP, but instead are something of Apple's own creation.
The details of this are given here

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6292/i...15-custom-core
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Old 18th September 2012, 15:39   #5010
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Originally Posted by bullock-Car View Post
The Iphone 5 performance gains are notable and as per anandtech experts, the A6 is the first Apple SoC to use its own ARMv7 based processor design. The CPU core(s) aren't based on a vanilla A9 or A15 design from ARM IP, but instead are something of Apple's own creation.
The details of this are given here

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6292/i...15-custom-core
In addition to the above, the A6 processor is 2x faster than the processors on S3 and OneX and all other flagship models. However, once Jelly Bean is out on S3 and others, A6 will go on the backseat. Too much competition and too much complications.
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