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Old 24th July 2011, 20:46   #2146
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Default Re: The Home Appliance thread

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Originally Posted by vina View Post
Are you sure that is icing? It may be damaged (bent) radiator panes, they also shine up when you take a picture.

Also, I think, if the freon is escaping so fast that it can generate ice, then it wont last long 4 months in his AC to begin with.


If there is Icing on the coils then it indicates a gas leak. I never said there is icing. Prior to reading too much in to a generic response, at least look at the correct area of the photo that is being referred to. I am talking of the coils and not the fins on the evaporator. In fact there is so much dirt that the fins are not visible at all.

Any gas for that matter even ordinary compressed air when escaping from a high pressure to a low pressure area results in a tremendous temperature drop including icing. Further there are known instances of ACs suffering from slow leaks while still providing conditioning albeit at depleting rates for extended periods extending into several seasons forget months. Read up on the appropriate thread.
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Old 24th July 2011, 21:06   #2147
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Default Re: The Home Appliance thread

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Originally Posted by khoj View Post
If there is Icing on the coils then it indicates a gas leak. I never said there is icing. Prior to reading too much in to a generic response, at least look at the correct area of the photo that is being referred to. I am talking of the coils and not the fins on the evaporator. In fact there is so much dirt that the fins are not visible at all.
My mistake - sorry about that. But I can't see any icing on the tubes either - they do look dirty though.

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Originally Posted by khoj View Post

Any gas for that matter even ordinary compressed air when escaping from a high pressure to a low pressure area results in a tremendous temperature drop including icing. Further there are known instances of ACs suffering from slow leaks while still providing conditioning albeit at depleting rates for extended periods extending into several seasons forget months. Read up on the appropriate thread.

gas evaporating is how cooling works for both ACs and refrigerators - as you have pointed out. And yes if it happens fast it will cause icing.

My question was - if the leak is so slow that his AC still cools when the last refill was 4 months ago - can the gas still cause enough cooling to make ice?
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Old 24th July 2011, 21:38   #2148
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Default Re: The Home Appliance thread

You are still not reading the reply thoroughly. In response to your post let me quote from my post above

Quote:
Originally Posted by vina View Post
My mistake - sorry about that. But I can't see any icing on the tubes either - they do look dirty though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj
I never said there is icing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vina View Post
My question was - if the leak is so slow that his AC still cools when the last refill was 4 months ago - can the gas still cause enough cooling to make ice?
Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj
I never said there is icing.
Any gas for that matter even ordinary compressed air when escaping from a high pressure to a low pressure area results in a tremendous temperature drop including icing.
It is not the gas alone but the the law of Physics that governs this occurance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khoj
Further there are known instances of ACs suffering from slow leaks while still providing conditioning albeit at depleting rates for extended periods extending into several seasons forget months.
In light of my above statement it is amply clear that in case there was a leak in the evaporating system, icing would occur. The leaks or rather the cracks in copper tubing are microscopic in nature and not big enough to allow all of the gas to simply leak out. Further the compressed gas itself is being pushed through the system and there is not enough time for it to accumulate over the hole to wait and be let out. Whatever tiny amount comes out is enough to create icing aided partly by the velocity of escape and partly by its nature to cool upon expansion.




If you have any further queries in this case or air cons in general, do post in the appropriate thread.
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Old 26th July 2011, 09:27   #2149
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Default Re: The Home Appliance thread

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@santosh9999
1. Wrong thread for this question
2. The black residue is dirt, your air con needs to be cleaned thoroughly
3. Moisture on the coils indicates cooling is taking place
4. Icing on the copper tubes on extreme left indicates a leak
Thanks Khoj, that's what I wanted to confirm.
Sorry about posting here, I suppose the Air conditioner thread is the appropriate place?
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Old 1st August 2011, 11:08   #2150
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

Saw an ad yesterday that Videocon 1.5T Split (3 Star rated model) is available for 15k under exchange. I normally wouldn't go for Videocon but wondering if it's something worth going for?
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Old 2nd August 2011, 01:50   #2151
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

I have seen Videocon and Godrej have same units. While the front panel was different, the remote control unit was a give away. But I have a Videocon unit. Pretty silent and effective. My experience has been good.
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Old 2nd August 2011, 14:07   #2152
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Default Re: The Home Appliance thread

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Originally Posted by khoj View Post
If there is Icing on the coils then it indicates a gas leak.....
Not always, Khoj!
Insufficient air flow past the coils can also cause icing.
Which is why dual fan units have an interlock with evaporator fan to cutoff the compressor if the evaporator fan stops for some reason.
A choked filter can lead to icing on the evaporator coils.
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Old 2nd August 2011, 15:27   #2153
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

Suspect that the difference may be frosting or icing.

The reduced air flow in my unit led to solid ice building up. As ice expands as it freezes (err... from zero down to -4 water expands as it gets colder, in apparent denial of the laws of physcs --- if I remember my lessons correctly) this could end up damaging the coil/fins.
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Old 3rd August 2011, 10:38   #2154
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Suspect that the difference may be frosting or icing.
....
Thad, you're right; the correct term to use here would be 'frosting'.
The term 'icing' is more commonly used, in refrigeration parlance, to denote water vapour in the refrigerant circuit (there should be none, ideally, but...) freezing up and causing an obstruction. We do speak of expansion valves or pressure balancing valves icing up.
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Old 12th August 2011, 21:10   #2155
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Cool Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

Finally, my AC is working fine now. Installed a 7.5 KVA custom ordered SERVO stabilizer!

My ex-neighbor is a UPS / Servo manufacturer and I asked him to suggest me a proper capacity servo to run a 1.5 ton AC. He was first surprised, thinking that I had no idea about the cost of a SERVO stabilizer. He said that SERVO stabilizers usually start from 4 KVA range, and for a 1.5 tonnage AC, it would require more than 7 KVA, costing a bomb. He suggested me to go for triple booster electronic stabilizer.

After making him realize that I had my fair share of poor performances with double boosters, and I am dead serious about a industrial SERVO, he agreed to build one 7.5 KVA servo stabilizer for me. After placing the order, it took 15 days to reach my house.

The baby arrived one fine evening around 9, and all the setup was finished within 20 mins. The volt meter showed the input to be 190 volt and output to be 230 volts. and switched on the AC. WHOA! after so many months, my AC kicked off like a EVO-X, in the night time! I could instantly feel the chillness followed by a wide grin on my face!

To give a brief history, chennai's epic voltage fluctuation (in my street it is like 140volts in the nights) made my previous single-booster stabilizer a no-show! My AC would re-start frequently. After upgrading to a double booster (Rs.3600), the AC would start, but non-frequent and un-predictable chilling was the result. Myself and my wife had many sleepless nights. Many nights we had switched off the AC and opened the windows. To add more "chilli" to the situation, the ceiling fan will rotate slowly. Courtesy - the low-voltage.

Finally the SERVO baby arrived and my LG AC suddenly turned into EVO-X, making us sleep peacefully and smilingly. I did not mind spending Rs.15,000 for the servo. I know it is kind of overkill. But for me, it is all about the peaceful sleep, in a humid city like Chennai. Chennaites know what I mean!

The servo is rock-solid, industrial grade, and beats the fluctuations and low-voltages like anything. Always 230V on the output! Rocks! Worth Rs.15k!

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Last edited by rajeshsundaram : 12th August 2011 at 21:14.
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Old 12th August 2011, 22:38   #2156
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

Wow, that's quite something to put in the corner of your room! Is it noisy?

One thing I can say for our Samsung ACs is they handle the low voltage (with ordinary electronic stabiliser) very well indeed. Our LG microwave oven doesn't: thinking of double-boost for that.
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Old 12th August 2011, 22:46   #2157
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

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Wow, that's quite something to put in the corner of your room! Is it noisy?

One thing I can say for our Samsung ACs is they handle the low voltage (with ordinary electronic stabiliser) very well indeed. Our LG microwave oven doesn't: thinking of double-boost for that.
Haha.. roughly two-and-a-half feet tall. No it is not noisy. After a few initial days, we got used to the "trrr trrrrr" sound when the servo rotates the coil during fluctuations. We dont find that uncomfortable now. Infact, our ceiling fan makes more noise than that. LOL.
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Old 13th August 2011, 01:01   #2158
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

That is a neat looking piece and half a step in the right direction. A full step would be to install a servo stabilizer on to the house's mains so that all of the electrical/electronics in the house would benefit from stable input voltage. Just my thoughts.
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Old 13th August 2011, 01:28   #2159
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

That looks really good and much needed in chennai. But installing one for the whole house is legal? I am not sure but when i was exploring that option, i was told it is not legal and will also increase your electric bills. I did not dig much into that though. can anyone shed more light on this?..
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Old 13th August 2011, 02:41   #2160
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Default Re: Which home/office AC (air conditioner) to buy ?

As I had posted earlier on this thread it is very common in NCR and pretty much legal. It is connected to internal main wiring of your house and all you are doing is stabilizing the incoming voltage not stealing anything. There would be a minimal increase in the consumption on account of the servo.
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