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Old 14th November 2009, 19:19   #1
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Default Poor Reliance Internet Service. Security Risk and bad support.

We have Reliance wireless Internet connection that Reliance calls Wimax. The claimed speed is 150 kbps for browsing, etc., which is just about OK. The download speed varies from 12 to 18 Kbps, which again is quite OK. Generally the ratio is 150/8 = 18.75 Kbps, but I am OK with the speed I am getting.

TRAI has clearly mentioned that for any internet to be called Broadband, the speed has to be 256 Kbps. We dont have broadband connection and in our case a small square dish is installed on our terrace, actually not terrace but above the cabin on the water tank. We have used Router so that more than one user can use internet, may be not at the same time, but we never want to change cables and all that stuff.

Initially, for one year everything was fine. One thing I must mention is that reliability for first one or may be one and a half year has been fantastic. What ever may be rain or any other thing, the net would work as long as we provide electricity to that dish through another device ( voltage regulator ? ).

Since last 8-10 months the issues have become irritating. We have never applied for Static IP, but my IP has not changed since long, may be one year. Why ? My IP is supposed to be Dynamic IP, so every time I log in and log out, I must be assigned a different IP. This worked with BSNL broadband that I had earlier. For the first one year, if I kept the dish switched OFF, the IP would change, but not for last one year. Next, downloads. Suppose I have downloaded something from Rapidshare ( mainly softwares for study ), then my computer would show UP + Down data usage as 700 MB, but Rapidshare would show that from my IP ( the IP ASSIGNED to me ) more than 1 GB is downloaded. I used Rapidshare for one month. My full one month usage was 7 GB and Rapidshare showed total download to be 14+ GB. Note that I did not use all those 7GB for Rapidshare. It was hardly 2-3 GB. I stopped using Rapidshare and other stuff, came back to torrents.

Now since last 3-4 months I am facing a weird issue. Suppose I am browing the net, which is mainly reading about automobiles, computers and solving paper for entrance exams for MBA, suddenly the connectivity goes away. As soon as this happens, I try to ping DNS servers. All three fail to ping. The connectivity would come back on its own, sometimes two minutes, sometimes 2-3 hours. Now when the connectivity is back, I have to log in again. After waiting for three months, I called on reliance customer care.

The customer care would say : Are you facing issue right now ? If I say no, they tell me to call next time when I am facing issue. Yesterday night, connectivity was lost, so I called them. First, an automated reply comes up. I know that after first instruction I have to press 2 and after second instruction I have to press 0. So my call will be answered by " Customer Care Executive ". This itself takes around 4-5 mins. So yesterday as soon as the call was received, i got the connectivity. The person who received call told me that the answer to this connectivity loss has to be answered by their technical department but right now he cannot transfer my call as I have got back my connectivity. Eventually after half an hour, my complain was registered with complain number 113161830.

Today at 11 am I got a call from My. Vyas from Vadodara for this problem. He promised me to call back after 20 mins. The call from his side never materialized. I called him at 1:45 PM. He said he did check my details, and the IP assigned to me is by captain and so it cannot change. About DNS connectivity loss ( which is definitely not a problem with my machine ), he said a person will be sent to my home within in 30 mins. The person never came.

Earlier around 2 weeks back, I made a similar call for loss of connectivity, the technical department instructed me to type ipconfig /all in my CMD to get physical address. She said that physical addess to not match so I will have to give her this from the dish. I provided her with the address. Now she said you are having connectivity, so her job is done. What is the main responsibility of technical department ? Just to confirm is one is getting login page or not. Everything else, its not their responsilibity, but its customer care executive's job. So I was basically in beech ka bandar situation.

One week ago, all of a sudden my password did not work. Argument from their side : you forgot to log out. I said no as I was browsing and after sudden connectivity loss I had to login again and this time login did not work.

My questions are :

1) As far as my understanding goes, if its Dynamic IP, whenever I login in an IP is assigned to me from a pool of IP. The customer care said that may be its only IP free. My point is that it cannot be a co-incidence that I get access to same IP for last one year.

Why my IP does not change ? No, I am not on net for 24 hours for all 365 days.

2) What is security about my IP ? I have noticed that at my ip usage is shown more at many places. And I check my computer's network statistics from CMD, not any third party software just to be a bit more sure.

I think my IP is being misused. When I try to download something from Rapidshare or hotfile, sometimes, I am informed that I am currnetly downloading a file, but my computer does not show any up or down byte transfer.

And this is why I want my IP to change.

3) Why frequent disconnectivity issue is there ? It was not there earlier.

4) What can I do to protect my IP. All my computers are running Free AVG, no underground site browsing, just simple mail, news and regular car, computer and study site browsing.

I am currently not getting any answer for my questions. Arguments like dont give password, type this command, etc are irritating as I am calling them only after making attempts like checking if I am able to ping DNS, etc. And the password is not given to anyone at any point of time.


The way those customer care people talk is like they are the ones who know everything and give useless arguments.

I am now afraid about my security as my ip remains static and sometimes I come to know that something is being downloaded from my IP, even though I am not downloading anything. And when the connectivity goes, I am mostly logged onto my account on Gmail or Time institute or PT insitute for study purpose.
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Old 15th November 2009, 14:57   #2
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I am going to sound like a tech from Reliance but i am not. Just trying to help since no one even bothered to comment.

Is your router attached 100% of the time?
Then IP address provided by Reliance will not change, since router never breaks network connection, you just change access to internet by loging in and out.

What is the DHCP configuration of the ROUTER?
You might have Static IP address assigned from the router itself .

Have you isolated the router?
Reason i am asking is, there could be packet collusions happening anywhere between the dish to the router. Think of ROUTER as a low cost computer. Specifically designed to do route network traffic. Since main purpose of the routers is to be CHEAP, manufacturers try to skimp on everything, even as little as 20gms of aluminium for Heatsink. This isn`t a big issue when the router is new, but as time passes by, heat starts destroying the micro processors. There are other reasons too, bad cabling, chewed cabling, cabling with water seepage, heat affected cabling, router dying, dish not calibrated or calibration gone wrong since it was mounted, due to a cat jumping or just sagging over time, LNB`s alignment changing, LNB dying.

Removing router for testing will be a good thing. Even if for just few days.

Cheers
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Old 15th November 2009, 17:18   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by it_inspector View Post
1) Is your router attached 100% of the time?
Then IP address provided by Reliance will not change, since router never breaks network connection, you just change access to internet by loging in and out.

2) What is the DHCP configuration of the ROUTER?
You might have Static IP address assigned from the router itself .

3) Have you isolated the router?
Reason i am asking is, there could be packet collusions happening anywhere between the dish to the router. Think of ROUTER as a low cost computer. Specifically designed to do route network traffic. Since main purpose of the routers is to be CHEAP, manufacturers try to skimp on everything, even as little as 20gms of aluminium for Heatsink. This isn`t a big issue when the router is new, but as time passes by, heat starts destroying the micro processors. There are other reasons too, bad cabling, chewed cabling, cabling with water seepage, heat affected cabling, router dying, dish not calibrated or calibration gone wrong since it was mounted, due to a cat jumping or just sagging over time, LNB`s alignment changing, LNB dying.

4) Removing router for testing will be a good thing. Even if for just few days.
First of all, thanks for the reply.

1) Yes. Its on all the time.
But here is the catch. Although the router is ON, I am not connected to the net. I connet to the net through my web browser. Simply loging out and logging in must change the IP.

2) NO. I have checked the router setting, they are DHCP enabled, not static.
Just to be more clear, I did try to renew my IP from the router, but it did not change.

3) What exactly is isolated router ? All I can say is that the data cable from dish is connected to the router as IN and the rest are out. The router I am using is from Linksys, so the quality concern generally is not there. The entire cabling was done by me and my father, and I did check it too, its perfectly fine. Another thing after physical examination is the speed that I get. I am consistently getting what I used to get on day one.

4) May be, but here is another thing that baffles me.
Suppose I switch off the mains of the dish. This will automatically switch off the router also as they are given power from the same extension board. So both the router and dish are having no power supply. Then after two hours I switch on both the equipments, but still the IP remains the same.

So I think we can assume that router is not the issue here. One more thing. In the BSNL connection I used, I put in username and password in router itself, so as soon as I switched ON the router, the net was connected. Everytime I would switch off and ON the router, a new IP is assigned.

My friend who still uses BSNL has done it the other way round. He keeps his router ON continously, but logs in through PC. Every time he logs in and logs out, IP changes.

The final blow. My realiance setup was the same since the day it was installed. Earlier with the same setup, the IP used to change when I switched OFF and ON the dish. But that does not happen now.
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Old 16th November 2009, 11:06   #4
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@ Aaggoswami : Probably a good time to upgrade to Reliance Broadband+. It is way faster, look up the other threads where we regularly clock download speeds of 1.5 - 2.5 mbps. Bet it will work out to the same $$$ too.

Since you've started experiencing problems over the last 1 year, and thats about the time that broadband+ was launched, I have a feeling Reliance has started focussing on the new tech. Time for you too?
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Old 16th November 2009, 11:25   #5
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So, you have a router to connect more than one computer at home? The router is the one assigned the IP from reliance point of view.

One more thing is, even if you use DHCP, you can configure the server to give you the same address all the time based on the MAC of your equipment. It all depends on what policies the DHCP server is configured with.

Can you also elaborate on what you mean by logging off, do you disconnect the router then? Net is not the same as your network connection.
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Old 16th November 2009, 12:07   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
@ Aaggoswami : Probably a good time to upgrade to Reliance Broadband+. It is way faster, look up the other threads where we regularly clock download speeds of 1.5 - 2.5 mbps. Bet it will work out to the same $$$ too.

Since you've started experiencing problems over the last 1 year, and thats about the time that broadband+ was launched, I have a feeling Reliance has started focussing on the new tech. Time for you too?
I am currently paying Rs. 850 for this connection. Wired connection is not possible in my area. Hence opted for wireless. I am not aware of Broadband+, but now will search for the same. Thanks for informing me about this. I was totally unaware of Broadband+.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
So, you have a router to connect more than one computer at home? The router is the one assigned the IP from reliance point of view.

One more thing is, even if you use DHCP, you can configure the server to give you the same address all the time based on the MAC of your equipment. It all depends on what policies the DHCP server is configured with.

Can you also elaborate on what you mean by logging off, do you disconnect the router then? Net is not the same as your network connection.
I know this is a catch, but I have checked every way.

1) Suppose that I switch off the dish and router and then switch them on again after 2 hours. Here IMO, the IP must change. But in reality, it does not change.

2) I have tried even with only router being switched Off, but IP remains same. Here I switch off the router and then switch it on after around 15-20 mins. But I get similar IP everytime I try this.

3) Next, I go into router, release the current IP I am having, then renew it. Now IP is supposed to change, but in reality it does not change.

If you have any other way, do tell me. I have tried release and renew IP from router, individually switching off router and then turning it on, switched off and on both router and dish at the same time, but all of these things have failed.

Please note that IP has to be assigned to me when I am providing username and password. The router does not have this, its my web browser. So when I log out, I have released the IP. If my router is playing spoilsport here, then when I just switch off and on my router, and then login through my webbrowser, a new IP must be there.

The point is, earlier my IP used to change everytime I log in log out through web browser.

And even if I am now downloading anthing, rapidshare and hotfile show that a current download in going on with my IP. I check the status of UP + Down from my pc and can confirm that no data is being sent or received.

I check this when only one PC ( that is mine ) is running. No chance of anybody else in my home downloading. Simultaneous browsing is not possible due to speed, so when one is using net, others are informed about the same. And I the only one to do downloads, that mainly include old hindi songs and textures.
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Old 16th November 2009, 12:12   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post

2) I have tried even with only router being switched Off, but IP remains same. Here I switch off the router and then switch it on after around 15-20 mins. But I get similar IP everytime I try this.

similar <> same

So the issue is?

Reliance Netconnect
My Sister in law uses it.

The network speed shows up as either 1X or Hybrid.
Check if you get 1X in the place you plan to use it.

They should be able to arrange for a demo.
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Old 16th November 2009, 17:16   #8
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@ aaggoswami
As I said DHCP can assign the same IP address if configured to do it so. Its done this way in majority of cases.
In some cases the server can remember and assign the same address. So it all depends on the server and how its configured.

I like having the same IP always. Is there a particular reason why you dont like it?
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Old 16th November 2009, 17:25   #9
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Frequent disconnections or at least occassional ones are part of life in India (at least for personal/residential connections as opposed to corporate/leased ones). My brother in UK has a 8 mbps broadband at home for more or less the same cost for my 512 kbps wimax Tata connection and it rarely goes offline. In India, what matters is customer service and quick resolution, and in this regard, I have been surprised by Tata's high quality of service on my wimax connection. Unlike Airtel where a machine makes its best effort to make you hang up. Tata also replies very quickly if you write to their nodal/appellate office. Every company has to have one (TRAI requirement) and you should try that route also.

Last edited by vasudeva : 16th November 2009 at 17:26.
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Old 16th November 2009, 18:28   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
@ aaggoswami
As I said DHCP can assign the same IP address if configured to do it so. Its done this way in majority of cases.
In some cases the server can remember and assign the same address. So it all depends on the server and how its configured.

I like having the same IP always. Is there a particular reason why you dont like it?
1) BSNL does not have this type of configuration. I am now sure that they are assigned in such a way that IP will not change.
What is most irritating is the fact that they never agree to this. Atleast they can inform me that the configuration does not allow for any change in IP.

2) IP misuse.
a) When I am downloading something from file hosting site, the file hosting site will show my downloads to be around 1GB where as my PC has done only 700MB. And that too I check from commnad prompt, not any software, so this reduces the chances of error. 50-60 mb is given, but not 300mb.
b) When I try to download from hotfile, it clearly mentions that one download is going on, where as in reality, nothing is being downloaded.

In both ( a ) and ( b ) I make sure that nobody has used either rapidshare or hotfile. Mostly the other PC have not even connected to the net.

Something is wrong as I am told that a download is currently going ON. So I feel that if at all the IP is changed it would benefit me atleast from safety point of view. Considering the slow download speed, I dont download large files and for other stuff like movies, I use torrent. But safety is an Issue I assume.

Sometimes, I am automatically logged out which must not happen and recently my IP was banned at one site as I downloaded more textures than the limit they have. That whole day I was appearing in interview at A'bad and visited the site only at night.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
Frequent disconnections or at least occassional ones are part of life in India (at least for personal/residential connections as opposed to corporate/leased ones). My brother in UK has a 8 mbps broadband at home for more or less the same cost for my 512 kbps wimax Tata connection and it rarely goes offline. In India, what matters is customer service and quick resolution, and in this regard, I have been surprised by Tata's high quality of service on my wimax connection. Unlike Airtel where a machine makes its best effort to make you hang up. Tata also replies very quickly if you write to their nodal/appellate office. Every company has to have one (TRAI requirement) and you should try that route also.
If I am not getting an explanation on this from reliance, I will inform TRAI on this. Certainly this is not the type of service I expect.
I have used TATA VSNL earlier, and they tried to gobble up a cheque that was given for monthly payment. They demanded our accounts statement, and eventually it resulted into physical brawl which was then later resolved after they accepted the mistake. Tata in here is not very customer friendly.

I have till now used :
1) BSNL
2) Sify
3) Tata VSNL
4) Reliance
5) BSNL
6) Airtel dialup ( through mobile phones )
7) Reliance

Reliance has been the best till now along with sify. I want to continue as its most reliable in my area, but some fishy things are happening with IP.
Waiting till a few more days now.
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Old 16th November 2009, 23:06   #11
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@aaggoswami,

I think you are facing this problem because of a setting at the ISP end. In Windows Server, there is a sticky option in the DHCP which permits you to have the same IP even after it is switched off for couple of days. In my corporate network this is the followed practice.

Rcom also uses a private network to manage its connections. Does it start with a 97.* or 118.* kind of IP addresses? then its pretty much similar to a corporate kinda of networking. Back while in Infocomm, this was the norm and was also followed for the rconnect/netconnect wireless data network. Doubt if that thinking would have changed.

One way to protect your Ip is to have an additional firewall which can keep incoming connections at bay. Eset Smart Security is the most robust one around.

One more thing. The connection depends on the RF radio frequency which keeps getting switche d on or off depending on the network priorities. Try doing a pin -t server option. The connection will be kept alive and prevented from going into RF dormancy. BUT it will hog the bandwidth.

Ping me if I can help you better.

Last edited by longford : 16th November 2009 at 23:09.
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Old 16th November 2009, 23:26   #12
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aaggoswami,

There is an easy way out for both issues:

1. Static IP
2. DNS server not working


Static IP:

Reliance WiMax now works on static IP. IP is bound to MAC address of antenna. Router / PC play NO role.

Pay slightly more and change connection type to "commercial" from "home user". This way you get to use PPPOE and net would start working like BSNL. i.e. IP will be assigned when you "dial in" the PPPOE connection. This would be a new virtual interface that would be different from LAN / WiFi on PC.

You can setup this in Linksys as well (if your connection is commercial).

DNS Server:

Install treewalk DNS or start using OpenDNS. You would no longer rely on reliance DNS.


Talk to some student in CS or IT branch, they should be able to help you out.
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Old 17th November 2009, 22:35   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longford View Post
@aaggoswami,

1) I think you are facing this problem because of a setting at the ISP end. In Windows Server, there is a sticky option in the DHCP which permits you to have the same IP even after it is switched off for couple of days. In my corporate network this is the followed practice.

2) Rcom also uses a private network to manage its connections. Does it start with a 97.* or 118.* kind of IP addresses? then its pretty much similar to a corporate kinda of networking.

3) One way to protect your Ip is to have an additional firewall which can keep incoming connections at bay. Eset Smart Security is the most robust one around.
1) Exactly that is what I want to tell Reliance that something is improper at their end. They just say that
a) I am confused.
b) I am not sure what is the problem I am facing.
c) I am wasting their time.
d) I am lying.

All the above four are few things I heard from CC ( Customer Care ) executive.

2) It starts with 123.* But thinking is not changed for sure.

3) Fact is, even once I have shut down the dish and PC, then again I try after 15-20 mins, I am given same answers by hotfile and Rapidshare and other limited download sites. I am sure that something fishy is going on since long at ISP end. This is problem I am facing since last one year.

I have tried Ubuntu and Fedora both, and things remain are the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay View Post

4) There is an easy way out for both issues:

1. Static IP
2. DNS server not working


Static IP:

Reliance WiMax now works on static IP. IP is bound to MAC address of antenna. Router / PC play NO role.

Pay slightly more and change connection type to "commercial" from "home user". This way you get to use PPPOE and net would start working like BSNL. i.e. IP will be assigned when you "dial in" the PPPOE connection. This would be a new virtual interface that would be different from LAN / WiFi on PC.

You can setup this in Linksys as well (if your connection is commercial).

DNS Server:

Install treewalk DNS or start using OpenDNS. You would no longer rely on reliance DNS.


Talk to some student in CS or IT branch, they should be able to help you out.
4) I called reliance helpline and they have confirmed that Wimax is on dynamic IP. I have heard this for 5-6 times from their technical department. The way IP remains constant, anybody will think its static, but the technical deaprtment says its Dynamic. Moreover I get 24 lease for IP. And then again 24 hours for similar IP only.

Now that was theory part.

You are absolutely correct. The IP is assigned by MAC address. After digging deeper into this I realized this fact. My web browser, pc and router have nothing to do with this.

What if I set for PPPOE with my current plan ? I have that option in the router.

About DNS, I think of using OpenDNS. Reliance is weird. There a few options for this in router itself. Will explore that.

@GTO and BBlost :
I checked out all the options you have listed. I was almost in for 1500 rs. Platinum plan, but here came the issue. The net connection is shared by everyone. Although simultaneous work is not done, we have another problem. We have invested some money by buying the router for Reliance. We gave the router we bought for BSNL to someone else who was in need for it more than us. And then bought the router we are using. Also a lot of cabling ( cat 5 ) was done and I mean really a lot.

Now dad is against purchasing a new device and there is not a very large amount of net usage.

I am now trying to mess with router by cloning the mac address, and PPPOE.
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Old 17th November 2009, 23:25   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
I called reliance helpline and they have confirmed that Wimax is on dynamic IP.


Now that was theory part.
Wimax does assign IP dynamically. What happens sometime is you are a single user in a given cell. This happened with me and for 4 - 5 months I always got the same IP. That is because IP Pools are allocated to cells.

You can telnet to antenna and change cell.

run "sh bs" command on antenna and post the result here. Keep in mind that antenna is a PC running linux (and fully hackable ).

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
I am now trying to mess with router by cloning the mac address, and PPPOE.
PPPOE wont work on consumer plans. And do try changing MAC address of WiFi router.



Overall, don't worry about IP and download limits based on IP. Just create an Windows XP VM and use "CRYPTLOAD" for downloading. DO NOT use it on actual PC.
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Old 17th November 2009, 23:50   #15
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@aaggoswami

Hi ,i dont know much about networks ,but am sure due to wind or something the dish direction must have changed slightly and that may be the problem as wi max works on micro wave platform..please correct me if am wrong,the the technicians for out side work are mostly outsourced,and they should come to your place to check the issue.

Do one thing mail to this ID
corporatecare@relianceada.com with relevant details am sure you will get response let me know even if you don't get response.
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