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Old 28th August 2012, 16:35   #10996
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My B-I-L is on the lookout for an Android Phone. Requirement is good GPS, intensive email usage, Speakerphone, good battery life (at least a day or more)
He has a year old HTC incredible S which has conked off. So he doesn't want to go for HTC again.
Android preferred. He is not much into rooting and upgrading ROM. Will be on stock for the major part.
Any suggestions?
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Old 28th August 2012, 16:41   #10997
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Originally Posted by nishantgandhi View Post
Err, to each his own, but technically, that's the ONLY way. Considering that Defy (and probably other Moto models too) currently have a great dev support/custom ROMs, and all of it built around 2nd-init, I wouldn't really call it a workaround, but more like a core/foundation module.

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...

@Athani - almost 200k Defy/+ owners have used 2nd-init. Its the only way out
Yes, I'm aware that's the only way out. It's okay for people who are already stuck with their phones. But our friend here is about to buy a new phone. Should it not be recommended that he go for a bootloader un lockable one!

So I really meant 'not satisfactory' in that context.
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Old 28th August 2012, 17:03   #10998
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Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
I hope Samsung will now really put some effort to 'design' their phones and invest some money on it. SE, HTC etc have phones that are unique and these guys aped too much of Apple. F700 story was made up I guess.
.
Not a made up story there was F700 a lot of work was done here in India and it was based on Samsungs internal handset platform which was for featurephones. Anyway I can not speak much on these issues in public forum.

But patents are non tarrif trade barriers US is using them perticularly in pharma and technology sector to maintain it's lead.

Apple is granted patents on things which seem to violate first principle of the patent that claim should be non obvious.

Have a look at this one (U.S. Patent No. 8,248,777) which was granted last week to Apple by US patent office

This is for an viscoelastic material to reduce shock on the mobile device.

In simple words they have patented placing a rubber gasket put on the bezel to reduce shock.
But is this not something found around every windshield in automobile for last 100 years to reduce shocks ( vibrations) ?
Even mobile phones / watches / Cameras which are made water/shock proof use a rubber gasket.

So after 2/3 years when Apple will sue others who tries to make a waterproof /shockproof device and at that time if someone will post that Samsung had a Samsung Marine phone ages ago which used to have rubber gaskets and O rings for water/shock proofing it will look like a made up story

Here is the original link to this patent from US PTO

United States Patent: 8248777

This is not only instance on 22 Jan 2002 they got a patent for transfer of telecommunication commands between Modem and AP using DMA data transfer. Trust me every phone was dual processer since ages and they used a shared memory to transfer data between processors including modem commands , Even before this Nortel switchs from 70s used to be multiprocessor systems with DMA for sending communication between various nodes. Apple got injuction against HTC for this very patent violation from US court.

Last edited by amitk26 : 28th August 2012 at 17:27.
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Old 28th August 2012, 17:47   #10999
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Originally Posted by ninjatalli View Post
@Athani,
Do refer to my earlier post on this - gave a bit of initial review on this.

So, you finally decided to take the plunge and enter into Micromax category, eh...
Well, one weak point that I thought would be resolved by now is the call reception and voice quality.
I am not happy to hear that 2012 models still have the same issue.

Do they provide software to sync/ backup with the computer via USB/ BlueTooth?
I hope they don't expect users to use the age old PC Companion software.
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Old 28th August 2012, 18:00   #11000
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Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Thanks to you all, and the plethora of options thrown out, I am thoroughly confused now. I guess I will take a Time-out and think it over with a cool head.
Welcome again to Team-BHP


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The service is great - ask current owners who have used the service, no? If nothing else, no queues
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Old 28th August 2012, 18:34   #11001
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Not a made up story there was F700 a lot of work was done here in India and it was based on Samsungs internal handset platform which was for featurephones. Anyway I can not speak much on these issues in public forum.

.
I guess you did not read my next post. The story that F700 predated Apple is a made up story, not the phone itself.

I dont know why phone makers are not putting a solar panel on the phone display (atleast behind it). Why are they waiting for Apple to do it first? When Apple patents it, everyone will complain on what so ingenious about it. This is just an example.

Apple is successfully integrating existing technologies into a package and others are following it. They might introduce the touch logic embedded in the LCD on iphone5 too and will probably get it from one of the Android phone manufacturers. it I find that being useless as big manufacturers who themselves patent numerous (and frivolous) things.

But I guess these are OT here and am out of this.

Last edited by srishiva : 28th August 2012 at 18:35.
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Old 28th August 2012, 18:54   #11002
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Just spent a few days in Singapore. On putting a local SIM into my Defy+ I was horrified to find that I had to enter my motoblur password before the phone would open up to me. Password? No idea. Luckily I had web access and my gmail password, and was able to get around that.

Having forgotten all that, exactly the same thing happened to me at Chennai aiport on way home. Oh, what an utter pain! At least, this time, I only had to unpack the password when I got home. It is a good thing I didn't need urgent phone use before then.

How to dump this Motoblur thing? I was not thinking of flashing anything else other than the standard system.

At least I don't travel or otherwise change SIMs very often, but that also means that I'll have forgotten this next time I do, and it'll catch me out again.
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Old 28th August 2012, 18:54   #11003
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Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
I guess you did not read my next post. The story that F700 predated Apple is a made up story, not the phone itself.

I dont know why phone makers are not putting a solar panel on the phone display (atleast behind it). Why are they waiting for Apple to do it first? When Apple patents it, everyone will complain on what so ingenious about it. This is just an example.

Apple is successfully integrating existing technologies into a package and others are following it. They might introduce the touch logic embedded in the LCD on iphone5 too and will probably get it from one of the Android phone manufacturers. it I find that being useless as big manufacturers who themselves patent numerous (and frivolous) things.

But I guess these are OT here and am out of this.
One or two phones with solar panels were in the market sometime back. Seems they were not successful. To acquire an appreciable battery charge, they needed to be left in the sun for a pretty long time. I wonder how they didn't get baked into a brick (literally) in the Indian sun. Or maybe they did and thats why they failed?

Last edited by Raccoon : 28th August 2012 at 18:56.
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Old 28th August 2012, 20:00   #11004
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Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
I guess you did not read my next post. The story that F700 predated Apple is a made up story, not the phone itself.
No Sir , A good number of Engineers I know personally worked on it. This was before iPhone was launched. It was touch screen phone but did not had downloadable apps support as it was basically a featurephone. I am bound by newly signed security rules at my company so can't give more details. Anyway does not make any difference to anyone you may continue to hold the view you like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
I dont know why phone makers are not putting a solar panel on the phone display (atleast behind it). Why are they waiting for Apple to do it first? When Apple patents it, everyone will complain on what so ingenious about it. This is just an example.
Are you sure ? Samsung Blueearth S7550 was launched in 2009.
Similarly Coltan is a miniral mined in Central Africa which is used in SSD used in electronics this was threatening habitet of Gorillas. Samsung came up with Green SSD without Coltan.
Similarly Nokia was pioneer in packet based video much before facetime.
Company which is in forefront of mobile cloud is not Apple with iCloud but company infamous for not innovating that is microsoft with Azure and office 360.

Point is that not every company realized the benifit constant innovation propoganda and also they did not know power of advertising through news and making news by suing. Apple has innovated definatly in this regard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Apple is successfully integrating existing technologies into a package and others are following it. .
What they are integrating is none of my concern but what for they have got patent at times is non-novel , Under US Laws contesting a patent and invalidating it is a long drawn process ( 5-6 years as you can see from efforts of GOI and CSIR to invalidate turmaric and neem patents in USA ) so if you get patents on trivia and sue others you have 1/4 lifecycle of exclusivity even eventually it gets invalidated after long drawn legal process.

I hope you do know that basic condition of patent is it should not be obvious to person well versed in the art.
Actually speaking last year injuction against HTC was really shocking because it was for a technology patent which is basis of multiprocessor computer system since 70s and earliest multi processor systems were telecom equipments so patent was for 20year old existing art.

Last edited by amitk26 : 28th August 2012 at 20:25.
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Old 28th August 2012, 20:10   #11005
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Originally Posted by Raccoon View Post
One or two phones with solar panels were in the market sometime back. Seems they were not successful. To acquire an appreciable battery charge, they needed to be left in the sun for a pretty long time. I wonder how they didn't get baked into a brick (literally) in the Indian sun. Or maybe they did and thats why they failed?
Well they were possible as featurephone where battery consumption is low but with multicore processors with clocks exceeding 1Ghz and apps running all the time solar cell efficiency does not match up.

Second reason is markt did not incentivise these products though they were not costly.
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Old 28th August 2012, 20:47   #11006
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
Actually speaking last year injuction against HTC was really shocking because it was for a technology patent which is basis of multiprocessor computer system since 70s and earliest multi processor systems were telecom equipments so patent was for 20year old existing art.
Way back in 2001 I worked on chips with multiprocessors and DMA and sharing memory arcitecture.
ITs a very obvious design.
Apple is taking obvious things, adding "on a touch screen device".

Another case is slide to unlock.
Slide to unlock bolts have been there probably as long as the wheel. Just because its a touchscreen device, its a new patent.

Imagine if Apple was a car company.
Their first patent would be
"Design of a round cylinderical shape, to permit a container to move with propulsan".
So they would patent the "application" of a wheel in an automobile, and then complain. Why did samsung not use square wheels, and their fanboys will scream in unision
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Old 28th August 2012, 20:49   #11007
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
No Sir , A good number of Engineers I know personally worked on it. This was before iPhone was launched. It was touch screen phone but did not had downloadable apps support as it was basically a featurephone. I am bound by newly signed security rules at my company so can't give more details. Anyway does not make any difference to anyone you may continue to hold the view you like.

Are you sure ? Samsung Blueearth S7550 was launched in 2009.
Similarly Coltan is a miniral mined in Central Africa which is used in SSD used in electronics this was threatening habitet of Gorillas. Samsung came up with Green SSD without Coltan.
Similarly Nokia was pioneer in packet based video much before facetime.
Company which is in forefront of mobile cloud is not Apple with iCloud but company infamous for not innovating that is microsoft with Azure and office 360.

Point is that not every company realized the benifit constant innovation propoganda and also they did not know power of advertising through news and making news by suing. Apple has innovated definatly in this regard.

What they are integrating is none of my concern but what for they have got patent at times is non-novel , Under US Laws contesting a patent and invalidating it is a long drawn process ( 5-6 years as you can see from efforts of GOI and CSIR to invalidate turmaric and neem patents in USA ) so if you get patents on trivia and sue others you have 1/4 lifecycle of exclusivity even eventually it gets invalidated after long drawn legal process.

I hope you do know that basic condition of patent is it should not be obvious to person well versed in the art.
Actually speaking last year injuction against HTC was really shocking because it was for a technology patent which is basis of multiprocessor computer system since 70s and earliest multi processor systems were telecom equipments so patent was for 20year old existing art.
In any suit for patent infringement,, the Defendant can counter sue for revocation of the patent on any of the available grounds.

Whether Apple should have been granted patents is immaterial. Even if it's argued that they should not have been granted the patents Samsung ought to have raised the issue. Samsung either did not counter sue or counter sued and did not succeed. So however much people here may dislike Apple (myself included), they won this fair & square.
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Old 28th August 2012, 21:13   #11008
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So however much people here may dislike Apple (myself included), they won this fair & square.

I would say Apple won is square but not fair. US courts, US company fighting against a non American company, and we don't have to guess who would win knowing American mentality.
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Old 28th August 2012, 21:16   #11009
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Originally Posted by Gadgetfreak View Post

I would say Apple won is square but not fair. US courts, US company fighting against a non American company, and we don't have to guess who would win knowing American mentality.
Ah, that's just your prejudice. Vodafone recently won a multi billion dollar tax appeal in the Indian Supreme Court - against the mighty Government of India, no less. You'll find instances of foreign companies winning law suits in US Courts. Business as usual.
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Old 28th August 2012, 21:19   #11010
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Ah, that's just your prejudice. Vodafone recently won a multi billion dollar tax appeal in the Indian Supreme Court - against the mighty Government of India, no less. You'll find instances of foreign companies winning law suits in US Courts. Business as usual.
Ya I agree it could just be my assumption but this is what is being discussed across all threads to, so I am not the only one talking about this.
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