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Old 3rd October 2008, 11:56   #1
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Default Is Vista Saffire worth buying ?

For last few days, I am eying Vista but also waited for A-star. After yesterday's news that A-star would be of 4 Lac Ex.showroom, having limited budget, I dont think I should wait for A-star.

I have seen two ownership reviews of Vista. Both having Qudrajet Aura.

Having limited budget, I want to go for Saffire Terra. So, having the following questions in mind.
1. Since saffire is the fiat engine, is it safe to assume that the FE would be of Palio. Will it be atleast 12 ? This is an important issue for me.

2. Terra is not having Techo Meter. Is it necessary to achive higher FE ? Can it be added as an accessory ?

3. I also want to go for CNG after sometime. Xeta had problems with CNG. What is the opinion about CNG on Fiat's engine ? Any advice from Palio owners on this ?
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Old 3rd October 2008, 14:02   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bridge View Post
2. Terra is not having Techo Meter. Is it necessary to achive higher FE ? Can it be added as an accessory ?
I had the same question, in general, about tachometer. However, fellow member Viper has told me that unless your driving style is not absurd, or unless you are inclined towards racing or performance sports, tacho is not completely necessary. Of course, if you wish, you can add it as an after market accessory. Price ranges from Rs 1000 (Pricol basic)-Rs 5000 and above (AutoMech with shift light)

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Old 3rd October 2008, 14:35   #3
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1. Though the safire has the FIAT engine, it will be mapped differently as it is in the Palio. Mileage of 10-12 kmpl should not be unachieveable

2. It is not mandatory to have a tacho meter for better FE. The FE will completely depend on your driving style. The tacho will just help you to see how hard or low the engine is revving. Hearing the grunt of the engine as you accelerate is enough.

3. Go for LPG if you are planning to convert. The CNG doesnt work too well with FIAT. I have a LPG Fiat Palio. Works absolutely fine
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Old 3rd October 2008, 15:06   #4
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I would NEVER advise the Saffire. I mean the engine is designed for a lightweight car - think the 800 kg segment. This will be as good/bad as the palio 1.1 and will give useless fuel averages.

Tacho is irrelevant. You can keep a thumb rule of speeds for each gear. Though its the #1 nice to have item.

Fiat engines work just fine on CNG. Whenever you'd visit delhi, kindly stop by at a CNG station. You'll get the real picture. Alot of gas is said everywhere but even on tbhp fiat CNG owners are very few and far between. Most of the negatives about CNG are from LPG owners

In the family, have seen some seen 130k+ across three CNG vehicles. The closed loop kits are quite decent. But again, the alto CNG sucks in half clutch traffic because of reduced low end torque (rev it well and very little loss in power). I can bet that the Saffire on CNG will be a non-starter. That's why the 1.4 Xeta CNG was WAY more fun than the 1.2 Xeta on CNG.

Go for a Santro (omigosh, did I say that?). I suspect they may have some options for retrofitment under warranty later once Reliance starts supplying CNG nationwide. Else buy the WagonR (lovely torque curve) - Delhi has thousands of WagonR CNG cabs and not ONE Estilo CNG cab - for a very simple reason - low end torque.

And for the love of God, buy a sort of fun to drive car. So that whenever youcan take it out on weekends you have some fun. Else within pune city anything on four wheels is as slow (last visited july 07, dont think its improved!)

Last edited by phamilyman : 3rd October 2008 at 15:08.
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Old 3rd October 2008, 15:15   #5
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Shortlist a few cars within your budget - including the Vista Saffire. Do a Test drive and buy the one you like the most!
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Old 3rd October 2008, 20:07   #6
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This is my first post on the Team-BHP. Got hooked to it while researching for my first new prospective car a week back and since then have almost read all posts on Indica Xeta. Having decided to go for Xeta GLX 1.4 after seeing threads recommending the Xeta, I was disappointed when I found the model has been discontinued

Now I am eyeing the Vista Saffire Aura with an OTR price of <4.5 Lac in Ahmedabad, though stretching over my budget. Was searching the forum for specific reviews on Saffire however could not find any till this post.

Inclination for Saffire being on account of comfort/space, however have no clue on performance, though wanted a 1400 cc engine of Xeta GLX. The review on the Vista Qudrajet being positive in terms of comfort, improved quality, good performance, etc; I am tempted that Saffire though being a petrol version might prove to be worthwhile, however I do understand that these two are not to be compared as the fundamental technology and engine are different.

However, looking at the above posts, I am still looking for reasons in favour of Saffire.

My preference being Petrol>Comfort/Space>Performance>FE all of this for a budget of 4.5L

Being my first car and not much driving experience, would appreciate any help on the above
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Old 3rd October 2008, 21:49   #7
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Quote:
Now I am eyeing the Vista Saffire Aura with an OTR price of <4.5 Lac in Ahmedabad, though stretching over my budget. Was searching the forum for specific reviews on Saffire however could not find any till this post.
IMO, for less than 4 lacs(OTR) one more choice is Indica DLS, as u were looking for xeta. average mileage-18-20kmpl
u can avail 25000 cash discount last month and probably extend till yearend.
it truly VFM.
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Old 4th October 2008, 00:10   #8
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WDB, I would recommend the Spark to you if you'd be a city person.
Decent car - lovely rear seats/suspension - revvy/decent within city - ok on highways though no OEM CNG provision afaik.

and please remember, there's very very less safire testdrive on tbhp. Everyone is raving about the quadrajet only - not even TDI
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Old 4th October 2008, 08:48   #9
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Benkey2

In fact I was able to locate a white Xeta GLX 1.4 at one of the dealer and the dealer was also willing to offer good discount as it was the last of the lot and I felt he wanted to get it out of his yard, though tempted, I decided otherwise. ‘DLS’ or you mean ‘GLS’. Anyway then lost interest in the Xeta as I felt it is now more from the old generation vehicle.

Phamilyman

Well yes, majority of the time on roads would be within the city, though not much as it would be more for family drives and weekend outings. Brands other then Tata and Maruti are not on my radar as I have a notion (maybe wrong) that the spares of the other brands are more costly. And on a one on one comparison, felt that Tata offer more then Maruti. I thought that Safire provided better space then Spark. Being from typical middle class family, I do see my vehicle being loaded by relatives. However my research is totally theoretical and appreciate your recommendation, will try out the spark, someone in the family has in-fact bought one.
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Old 4th October 2008, 21:52   #10
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Thanks phamilyman for such an insightful answer. Though I liked vista a lot , now I am dropping the idea of safire and Quadrajet is anyway, out of my reach. As suggested by you, now I am serious on Santro.

I did a comparision between Safire and Santro. Safire's Output is 65PS @5500 rpm vs. Santro's 63@5500. Safire's torque is 96 nm @ 3000 rpm vs. Santro's 9.8 kgm/3000 rmp. So almost the same. So I was wondering that why you suggested Santro to Safire and I found the answer here - Safire's Kerb Weight is 1075 Kgs Vs. Santro's 854 Kgs (Manual Transmission). The difference of 221 Kgs is making it sluggish and would be even more sluggish on CNG.

On the same lines I tried to compare Xeta 1.2 with Santro.
Output - Xeta : 65.3 PS @ 5000-5200 rpm Vs. Santro's 63 @ 5500
Torque - Xeta : 10.2 kgm @ 2600 rpm Vs. Santro's 9.8 kgm/3000 rmp
Kerb Weight - xeta : 995 Kgs Vs. Santro's 854 Kgs

Though the difference of 141 Kgs, my guess is if CNG goes with Santro, it should go with Xeta too. But I think CNG on Xeta had some problems.

I am now comparing Xeta with Santro because my wife wants a 5 seater. Otherwise I can blindly go for Alto :-)

Still confused over, Santro, Xeta, Alto :-)

, along with economy, I am also looking for comfort and joy to drive.

You are recommending spark to WDB, but Spark has a very little boot space and I doubt it can accommodate and CNG tank. I guess, being in Ahmedabad, WDB would prefer to have that option open.

Last edited by Rehaan : 5th October 2008 at 17:04. Reason: Max 2 smileys per post. Please read the Team-BHP rules before continuing.
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Old 4th October 2008, 22:02   #11
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Originally Posted by iceman7 View Post
3. Go for LPG if you are planning to convert. The CNG doesnt work too well with FIAT. I have a LPG Fiat Palio. Works absolutely fine

I used Maruti 800 for 3 years on LPG and saw the prices zoomed from Rs. 21-22/Ltr to Rs. 35/Ltr in 3-3.5 years. With govt. having almost no control on Auto LPG and companies are revising the price every month (and now-a-days even less) I dont think a new Auto LPG kit makes sense.
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Old 5th October 2008, 15:53   #12
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I love the new Indica Vista, but will not recommend it with the puny petrol. It is way underpowered by itself, how the performance will be with 4 people + luggage is anybodys guess. That small engine is simply not meant for such a large hatch.

Depending on your budget, the Alto, Santro, Spark, i10 and Swift are amongst the best petrol hatchbacks one can buy.

@ Bridge : I agree. LPG doesn't make as much sense as it used to.
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Old 6th October 2008, 12:52   #13
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Those wanting to fit CNG should consider the Palio 1.6 too. Loads of power and torque to give decent performance even in CNG mode. These days hefty discounts too are available. Of course the spares are expensive and Fiat doesn't honour warranty on converted-to-CNG cars.
It may also be worthwhile to look at a second hand Palio 1.6 for conversion.
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Old 6th October 2008, 13:13   #14
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Don't ever go for xeta with LPG/CNG, even though xeta comes with factory-fitted LPG.
CNG kits from shrimanker-bedini are pathetic and will make more visits to workshop than any other cars.

if you want economy, LPG is a better option. Even though prices are about Rs. 35, the running and maintenance cost is at least less than a diesel car and you being used to LPG M800 over the years, should be satisfied with it.

Hence, only 2 options you must consider as per your aforementioned criteria-

Wagon R DUO
Santro ECO


both come with factory installed 22-litre LPG toroidal tanks which are safe, legal and do not put much pressure on engine. Plus, boot space is still there.

Palio and that to a used one, with CNG can be expensive on maintenance.

anyway I am posting 2 pics of wagon r LPG wit the boot open and the space utilized even with the LPG cylinder.
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Last edited by sidindica : 6th October 2008 at 13:22.
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Old 6th October 2008, 13:51   #15
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Fiat had announced in May 2008 that CNG Palio would be launched in early 2009. It's not clear whether the kit would be factory fitted or aftermarket. No manufacturer offers factory-fitted CNG as of now. It's also not clear which engine would be offered.

Fiat India plans CNG variant of Palio by early next year - The Financial Express

Posts tagged CNG fiat palio at AutoblogGreen
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