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Old 5th February 2010, 14:47   #1
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Default Which car is safer? A Star ZXI or Ritz LXI?

Safety is an accessory in India. This is what we see in the way manufacturers market their cars here providing safety as an option in their higher end models. This is often a concern for the car buying public who are looking for active safety measures, but does not need to spend for the baggage such as in car entertainment and other creature comforts.

Within a limited budget imagine the car buying public has two options to go for:
Option A) A smaller car with ABS, EBD & airbags
Option B) A larger car without active safety features.

Consider 'option A' as an A Star ZXI with ABS, EBD, Airbags etc and 'option B' as a Ritz LXI. A Star ZXI has better safety features but Ritz is a larger car and maybe better engineered too.

Links pointing to EuroNCAP rating of both A Star and Ritz:
Euro NCAP - For safer cars | Suzuki Alto
Euro NCAP - For safer cars | Suzuki Splash

But please bear in mind that these Euro models have multiple airbags and are not exactly the variants we get here. This is just to give an idea of how both vehicles if equipped with Airbags etc would fare in the crash and Ritz scores better in this regard.

But here, in this post, we are comparing A Star ZXI ABS/EBD/Airbags with Ritz LXI, which car would offer better crash protection? Which car is safer?
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Old 5th February 2010, 15:08   #2
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Structurally, the Ritz should be able to withstand a crash better than the A-Star. Ritz is a heavier car compared to the A-Star. This will aid the Ritz withstand any damage better in turn protecting its occupants.
The active safety features in A-Star are good but not sure if it has side impact sensors for the air bags to open or if it has side air bags etc. So in case of impact from the sides, Ritz stands a better chance due to better build than A-Star.
My $$
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Old 5th February 2010, 15:13   #3
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I'd go with the A-Star on this one. I always prioritize active safety over passive safety. That's where the A-Star scores in this comparison. Furthermore, in this case, its difficult to conclusively say whether the Ritz beats the A-Star in terms of passive safety.

Last edited by McLaren Rulez : 5th February 2010 at 15:15.
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Old 5th February 2010, 15:28   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abhinav.s View Post
Structurally, the Ritz should be able to withstand a crash better than the A-Star. Ritz is a heavier car compared to the A-Star. This will aid the Ritz withstand any damage better in turn protecting its occupants.
The active safety features in A-Star are good but not sure if it has side impact sensors for the air bags to open or if it has side air bags etc. So in case of impact from the sides, Ritz stands a better chance due to better build than A-Star.
My $$
Ritz might be better engineered, i think so too, but we do not know how Ritz would fare against AStar with airbags. We don't know whether passive safety or active safety would save us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
I'd go with the A-Star on this one. I always prioritize active safety over passive safety. That's where the A-Star scores in this comparison. Furthermore, in this case, its difficult to conclusively say whether the Ritz beats the A-Star in terms of passive safety.
I too think active safety provides a better chance of survival.


Why this thread?
Because i want to know which of these cars would provide a higher chances of survival in case of a mishap and to avoid this conversation:-

God: Baccha, why are you here?
Carwala: Because i'm dead sirjeee.
God: Why are you dead?
Carwala: The lorry guy was drunk sirjee.
God: Didn't your car have active safety devices like Airbags?
Carwala: No sirjee.
God: Why?
Carwala: Because i could not afford safety sirjee.
God: Really? You could've bought the smaller car with Airbags if you wanted to.
Carwala: What an idea sirjee! Why didn't i think of that before, too bad i'm here sirjee.
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Old 5th February 2010, 15:42   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankar View Post
Why this thread?
Because i want to know which of these cars would provide a higher chances of survival in case of a mishap and to avoid this conversation:-

God: Baccha, why are you here?
Carwala: Because i'm dead sirjeee.
God: Why are you dead?
Carwala: The lorry guy was drunk sirjee.
God: Didn't your car have active safety devices like Airbags?
Carwala: No sirjee.
God: Why?
Carwala: Because i could not afford safety sirjee.
God: Really? You could've bought the smaller car with Airbags if you wanted to.
Carwala: What an idea sirjee! Why didn't i think of that before, too bad i'm here sirjee.
that was a good one!
Coming to think of it, active safety features are always better. But active safety coupled with passive one like better engineering and build is the winner.
I am not sure of this but when it comes to airbags, unless there is a certain damage/force due to collision they do not engage. Please correct me if i am wrong. If the force is below this limit, we would feel safer in a better engineered car than a poorly engineered car with active safety features. Hence my comment earlier.
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Old 5th February 2010, 15:51   #6
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Ritz is structurally stronger than A-Star. Hence the chances of survival are more in Ritz compared to A-star equipped with airbags.
Remember it all depends on what speed a collision takes place.
Airbags can tolerate a limited specified force and even they may get burst if forces are huge.
In A-star, a frontal collision can reduce injuries to driver and co-passenger because of airbags but if a side or a rear collision takes place, its dangerous.

I have seen a driver of my friends Accent viva car banged a parked truck at 100kmph. Car was smashed completely. But the driver escaped with few bruises. IMO it was the cars structural strength which played a role in reducing impact on the driver.
Airbags would have further provided a cushioning .

OT: Time kharaab hai to airbags bhi bacha nahi sakte.

Last edited by djay99 : 5th February 2010 at 15:57.
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Old 5th February 2010, 16:30   #7
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Like they say there is no replacement to Displacement in terms of engine power, I draw same parlance here. There is no replacement to bonnet length and structural integrity for safety. Longer the bonnet, larger distance between you and the impact and more safer the car.

Having said that I am also of the opinion that no car in the world is safe. It is the bloke behind the wheel who makes a car safe or unsafe.
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Old 5th February 2010, 16:39   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankar View Post

But please bear in mind that these Euro models have multiple airbags and are not exactly the variants we get here. This is just to give an idea of how both vehicles if equipped with Airbags etc would fare in the crash and Ritz scores better in this regard.

But here, in this post, we are comparing A Star ZXI ABS/EBD/Airbags with Ritz LXI, which car would offer better crash protection? Which car is safer?
Lets look at the following cases

1. The cars are going to crash head on

Safe Car (A Star)

Head on collision is a little better in a car with ABS/EBD Air bags since the driver gets the chance to see what is coming and he applies brakes and locks them in panic ABS/EBD is useful here.

The speed of the car will be reduced (atleast marginally) so lesser impact.

The airbags open up giving you a soft cushion effect, which will fairly minimize the number of injuries to both the driver and co passenger.

Big Car (Ritz)

When this car driver panics and locks brakes, he will lose control of his car even before crashing, during the crash they will be plunged forward towards the impact source (Inertia) which may lead to more serious injuries to the head (Important part of body).

2. The cars are hit from the rear

If the driver applies brakes then EBD and ABS will help him control the A Star
Where as the Ritz will be skidding forward Which is more dangerous

3. Side Impact

Here geometry of the chassis decides.

Quote:
Originally Posted by abhinav.s View Post
Structurally, the Ritz should be able to withstand a crash better than the A-Star. Ritz is a heavier car compared to the A-Star. This will aid the Ritz withstand any damage better in turn protecting its occupants.

The active safety features in A-Star are good but not sure if it has side impact sensors for the air bags to open or if it has side air bags etc. So in case of impact from the sides, Ritz stands a better chance due to better build than A-Star.
My $$
Heavier car does'nt necessarily mean safer car, It depends on the frame and rigidity of the car

For example Racing cars are light weight yet they survive unimaginable crashes..
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Old 5th February 2010, 18:14   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r@CYR@y View Post

2. The cars are hit from the rear

If the driver applies brakes then EBD and ABS will help him control the A Star
Where as the Ritz will be skidding forward Which is more dangerous
Ritz, though seems it was hit from the rear by some Lorries, still running well without any problem. So, Ritz is better in this regard
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Old 5th February 2010, 18:27   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r@CYR@y View Post
Heavier car does'nt necessarily mean safer car, It depends on the frame and rigidity of the car

For example Racing cars are light weight yet they survive unimaginable crashes..
Agreed that Heavier car does not mean a safer car but the point behind my post was about the build and structural rigidity in case of Ritz which might be higher compared to A-Star!!
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Old 5th February 2010, 18:45   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romeomidhun View Post
Ritz, though seems it was hit from the rear by some Lorries, still running well without any problem. So, Ritz is better in this regard
That depends on the intensity of impact, Consider a fully loaded truck smashes into a parked car at 70kmph? Different conditions different results..

Quote:
Originally Posted by abhinav.s View Post
Agreed that Heavier car does not mean a safer car but the point behind my post was about the build and structural rigidity in case of Ritz which might be higher compared to A-Star!!


You think that the rigidity may be higher, but facts are also important.

P.S.
I have already mentioned this point in my previous posts.
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Old 5th February 2010, 20:10   #12
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You may call it rigidity, I call it crashworthiness but we're talking about the same thing. Basically, the higher score of the Ritz in the Euro-NCAP test probably means it is structurally better. However, that is an airbag equipped Ritz which was used. So it can be concluded that an airbag equipped Ritz is better than an airbag equipped A-Star. But when one has airbags and the other doesn't, things get hard to judge.
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Old 5th February 2010, 20:22   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
You may call it rigidity, I call it crashworthiness but we're talking about the same thing. Basically, the higher score of the Ritz in the Euro-NCAP test probably means it is structurally better. However, that is an airbag equipped Ritz which was used. So it can be concluded that an airbag equipped Ritz is better than an airbag equipped A-Star. But when one has airbags and the other doesn't, things get hard to judge.
This is exactly why the confusion started. If both AStar and Ritz had got the same rating for EuroNCAP there wouldn't be no confusion, and i would've assumed the AStar ZXI to be safer than the Ritz LXI.

But since EuroNCAP has a new rating system post 2009 and Ritz and Astar was tested in 2008 and 2009 respectively can we directly compare both car's ratings?
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Old 5th February 2010, 20:47   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sankar View Post
But since EuroNCAP has a new rating system post 2009 and Ritz and Astar was tested in 2008 and 2009 respectively can we directly compare both car's ratings?
I do not know when the two cars were tested but if they were tested under different criteria, then you can't compare them. I'd still say the A-Star is the winner. ABS and airbags together should trump the Ritz's possibly better structure.
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Old 5th February 2010, 20:52   #15
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What a discussion? Most Indians would say, put a Ganesh idol on the dashboard. It will ensure safety better than any airbags or EuroNCAP tests.

However, on a more serious note, I think its mere speculation as to which one will fare better in the face of a head on collision. There are way too many variables in an accident and whatever people express here is just their personal opinion not scientific research.

Important thing is to belt up and drive safe. Indian roads and driving conditions are amongst the worst in the world and its a miracle that we dont see more fatal accidents here.
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