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Old 24th October 2016, 15:35   #16
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

@ravivarmav and @naikameya

This post was originally posted in another topic where a 1.18lakh km run car started giving serious problems just after evaluation. Obviously no one would revv an engine to redline and hold for 15 minutes. I was talking about a theoretical situation.

However, engine has to be revved at high rpm in neutral while evaluation of car, especially in a high mileage cars to check noises from engine or abnormal smoke.
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Old 24th October 2016, 15:50   #17
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

Correct to a certain extent but old cars have to be carefully driven and without that behaviour would just keep going along for several thousand km more. What you are saying is like "this is a healthy eighty year old man so to test his health I will make him run a 100 meter sprint".

If he takes a gentle walk he will probably live to a hundred years but if you think he is usain bolt and make him run a 100 meter sprint he will drop dead of a heart attack in front of you.

Last edited by hserus : 24th October 2016 at 15:52.
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Old 24th October 2016, 16:00   #18
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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Originally Posted by fazayal View Post
However, engine has to be revved at high rpm in neutral while evaluation of car, especially in a high mileage cars to check noises from engine or abnormal smoke.
Slightly but i thought a small addition to the info needs to be shared regarding this.

Agreed but if i am not mistaken, this will be done by raising the rpm in a slow manner to high rpm, holding it there for few seconds and then let go. Vs point blank revving engine to rev limiter like the street side romeo would do to attract attention

What i mean to say is there are tests that are needed, and steps by which it can be done without causing undue stress.
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Old 24th October 2016, 16:08   #19
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

What about a buyer's perspective? A first time buyer looking for his/her first 2nd hand car? With no knowledge about hundreds of ways to get cheated? This is a market afterall, and the buyer has to take informed decisions. whoever tries to influence his/her decision for their own benefit will lose trust more often than not in the long run.

If car dealers/evaluators are looked down as cheaters, it is because of the fact that the dubious ones who cheat- way outnumber those who do not, and it has been the case for way too long.

Take the case of real estate rental market (not the new sale one). The owner as well as the tenant know that the dealer/broker is there to just search for the right flat and arrange for a meeting between owner and tenant. and the brokerage is fixed in most of the cities. No one complains (though there still are some brokers who try to influence). Tenants have to evaluate the flat and the rentals on their own.

used car market is very very subjective in terms of evaluation. And bargaining is often as bad as one has to do in a local flea market. Hence, even after bargaining successfully, a customer would feel that he/she would have got a better deal if they have bargained better.
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Old 24th October 2016, 16:35   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post

Slightly but i thought a small addition to the info needs to be shared regarding this.

Agreed but if i am not mistaken, this will be done by raising the rpm in a slow manner to high rpm, holding it there for few seconds and then let go. Vs point blank revving engine to rev limiter like the street side romeo would do to attract attention

What i mean to say is there are tests that are needed, and steps by which it can be done without causing undue stress.
Correct. When I sold my Indigo, the person who bought it, tested its engine health by revving it slowly up to 4000 rpm, and checked if any smoke is emanting from the dipstick area, and from the exhaust.

Thereafter he took a short test drive in city where he frequently changed gears. He drove it at very low speeds. He tested the gear shifts by that.

Is it correct to assume that the piston ring health is determined by this smoke coming from dipstick area method, for all cars?
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Old 24th October 2016, 19:25   #21
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

My heart skipped a beat when i read about the high rev for 15 minutes. Rather not sell my car even if it has reached the end of its life!
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Old 24th October 2016, 20:24   #22
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Default Re: Smoke & oil from tailpipe after Nexa showroom test-drives my Verna

Very nice post Fazayal. Thanks for bringing some perspective to the whole story. Do you have a network of mechanics that you can rely on to give you deeper insights into cars coming into the market? The reason I ask is because I have always believed in building a relationship of trust with your mechanic. Kind of like having a family doctor.

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Another thing. I believe most of the people in this world are good.
Specially the line above is like a breath of fresh air in a world filled with mistrust and paranoia.
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Old 25th October 2016, 10:59   #23
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Honestly, it's the same everywhere else. Even in developed countries, buying or selling a used car can be a painful process if you don't know what you are doing.
With all due respect, I disagree there. I sold two cars while I was in Australia and I must say that the process there is a lot more simpler and the cars are also more trustworthy. Before selling the car, the seller has to get a 'road worthy certificate' from a garage that's approved by the government. Then the garage will keep the car for at least half a day (depending upon how busy the garage is). They normally go through every detail of the car and then give the road worthy certificate to the owner.

The roadworthy check includes many finer details and even details such as all the tyres have to be from the same manufacturer etc. If in case any repairs have to be carried out, that will be done before the seller gets the go ahead to sell the car. After that, the aesthetics of the car mean more than the reliability of the engine etc. Thereby making the process a lot more transparent and I believe that the above process makes the job of the evaluator and the buyer a lot more easier.

Last edited by FlyingSpur : 26th October 2016 at 13:40. Reason: Broken quote tag fixed.
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Old 25th October 2016, 11:06   #24
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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May be a good process in future would be to share the tests that will be done with the customer and if the customer is not happy he could walk away from it. A simple "no objection to testing" could also be given by customers after reviewing the tests to be done so it clears you of possible damages and at the same time gives a chance to the customer about what will be done to his car. Also, it could be made mandatory for the customer to be with his car so he knows if the car was really abused or just died with just a slight pressure beyond normal. All this process would go a long way to educate both sides.
Need of the hour. This would go a long way in avoiding unwanted hassles. Also, the customer can be in the car during the evaluation and can ask for terminating the evaluation when needed.
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Old 25th October 2016, 12:17   #25
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

Sorry for using inappropriate language, but used car evaluators are the most unethical and cannot be relied at upon at all, i find this post only worthy of gaining sympathy and not of any use at all.
Have you seen used car valuators at luxury car showrooms, they give prices that are laughable, i was quoted 3.75 lakhs for my genuinely 32.5k driven captiva 2009 model, i have ready buyers of double that amount, they do not drive the car, they abuse it.
Used car valuators are not even diploma holders in mechanical engineering and they came to teach me about braking and suspension systems.
just for example, i was quoted 1.75 lakhs for my ritz 2010 in dec 2014 at 60k, guess what, sold it at 2.25 lakhs in jan 2016 at 71k.
See the sellers side of the story and then we'll compare
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Old 25th October 2016, 12:41   #26
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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Originally Posted by dhruvritzed View Post
Sorry for using inappropriate language, but used car evaluators are the most unethical and cannot be relied at upon at all, i find this post only worthy of gaining sympathy and not of any use at all.
Have you seen used car valuators at luxury car showrooms, they give prices that are laughable, i was quoted 3.75 lakhs for my genuinely 32.5k driven captiva 2009 model, i have ready buyers of double that amount, they do not drive the car, they abuse it.
Used car valuators are not even diploma holders in mechanical engineering and they came to teach me about braking and suspension systems.
just for example, i was quoted 1.75 lakhs for my ritz 2010 in dec 2014 at 60k, guess what, sold it at 2.25 lakhs in jan 2016 at 71k.
See the sellers side of the story and then we'll compare
That's because used car evaluators are employed by dealers; not to evaluate the cars but to evaluate how much money can be made through that car. They are money evaluators, not car evaluators. I don't think there are any independent car evaluators in India, all are either employed by used car dealers or are dealers themselves. Clearly, there is money in that business, that is why we have thousands of used car dealers in India - the more you cheat the more you earn.

However, it has nothing to do with the education qualification (the diploma part). The best evaluator for your car can be the road side mechanic (who might not even be diploma holder).
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Old 25th October 2016, 12:46   #27
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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Originally Posted by Nav-i-gator View Post
That's because used car evaluators are employed by dealers; not to evaluate the cars but to evaluate how much money can be made through that car. They are money evaluators, not car evaluators. I don't think there are any independent car evaluators in India, all are either employed by used car dealers or are dealers themselves. Clearly, there is money in that business, that is why we have thousands of used car dealers in India - the more you cheat the more you earn.

However, it has nothing to do with the education qualification (the diploma part). The best evaluator for your car can be the road side mechanic (who might not even be diploma holder).
I quoted diploma because he was trying to get all technical with me, also they also gain in return for the high margins sought by the dealers.If they find the job so tough and to fret over, better to leave it entirely.
Anyway it's a job that'll disappear over time with app based service records and better transparency
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Old 25th October 2016, 12:50   #28
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

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Originally Posted by dhruvritzed View Post
Sorry for using inappropriate language, but used car evaluators are the most unethical and cannot be relied at upon at all, i find this post only worthy of gaining sympathy and not of any use at all.
Have you seen used car valuators at luxury car showrooms, they give prices that are laughable, i was quoted 3.75 lakhs for my genuinely 32.5k driven captiva 2009 model, i have ready buyers of double that amount, they do not drive the car, they abuse it.
Used car valuators are not even diploma holders in mechanical engineering and they came to teach me about braking and suspension systems.
just for example, i was quoted 1.75 lakhs for my ritz 2010 in dec 2014 at 60k, guess what, sold it at 2.25 lakhs in jan 2016 at 71k.
See the sellers side of the story and then we'll compare
They are there for business, not for charity or goodwill. If they buy at high prices, how will they ever make money? Also one should take into consideration other things like holding costs which includes space it occupies till it gets sold, additional depreciation till the time it gets sold, additional part changes that might be required later, room for evaluation errors. They need to keep a wide margin gap because Indian sellers will negotiate anyway. For example, in your case he quoted 3.75 while a common man buyer might be buying it at 7.5 from you. Now if he would have given you even 6 or 6.5, you would have negotiated to bring it to 7 which leaves him with margin of 50k minus additional costs he will need to bear later. Now he will say 3.75 so that after negotiation it can be brought up to only about 4.5 or so so that he is remains in a comfortable zone. Rule of any business.
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Old 25th October 2016, 12:53   #29
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

Check how he's quoted the private seller's to be so rude and unadjusting, just go to any showroom and see these guys' attitude, you'll get my point, i'd rather not sell my car at all than sell to them
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Old 25th October 2016, 13:02   #30
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Default Re: The other side of the story: A used car evaluator's perspective

Quote:
Originally Posted by dhruvritzed View Post
Sorry for using inappropriate language, but used car evaluators are the most unethical and cannot be relied at upon at all, i find this post only worthy of gaining sympathy and not of any use at all.
Have you seen used car valuators at luxury car showrooms, they give prices that are laughable, i was quoted 3.75 lakhs for my genuinely 32.5k driven captiva 2009 model, i have ready buyers of double that amount, they do not drive the car, they abuse it.
Used car valuators are not even diploma holders in mechanical engineering and they came to teach me about braking and suspension systems.
just for example, i was quoted 1.75 lakhs for my ritz 2010 in dec 2014 at 60k, guess what, sold it at 2.25 lakhs in jan 2016 at 71k.
See the sellers side of the story and then we'll compare
You are painting everyone with the same brush. Isn't it unfair?

The used car evaluator gives the price of the car considering many constraints like funds available, ready customer for a particular model, current stock situation etc.

If you like the price you can do the deal. If you don't like it you are free to reject it. There is no force. There are many used car dealers and now websites where you can sell your car. Customer can decide where he wants to go.

I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering btw. Does it matter?
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