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Old 11th February 2009, 17:30   #271
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In Muneem's defence:

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Originally Posted by Ravveendrra View Post
7. driving vehicles in stock recklessly and without regard to the manufacturers instructions regarding running-in,
Fiat has no running-in period prescribed for its cars, as officially confirmed by fiat officials. There is none mentioned in the manual as well.

He was not disobeying any instructions. He was simply confident of his company's "no-running-in required" philosophy.
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Old 11th February 2009, 21:32   #272
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...Nor is the maximum speed, in itself, of great consequence, but, even though running-in periods (In my childhood, there were stickers in rear windows: Running In, Please Pass) pushing a new car with hard acceleration does not bode well for its engine. It is not good for the tires, which need to get bedded in, and also the brakes.
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Old 11th February 2009, 23:26   #273
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I am a newbie here, and would not presume to be an authority on cars. I bought my Matiz SD in '98 against good advice from well meaning folks, and drove it happilly for ten years till 2008, when I sold it because I decided to buy a Fiat Palio Sport 1.6.

I also own a Scorpio base model bought in 2003, again against good advice. It is a good vehicle too.

I had problems with both vehicles, both minor and major. Some were corrected, some were not.

When I decided to buy my Palio Sport, I looked up on the net, including here (and the info I read here helped me a lot in making my decision, includingthe warning that though the car is a good one, the lack of good after sales service is a great drawback)

Though I am not an adventerous person, I am willing to take minor risks so I bought the Sport.

Because i was prewarned, I went in with an open mind. So after the first service, when the engine power seemed to have dropped a bit, I accepted the service person's statement that they had not adjusted anything. Also when the Fiat started dropping into Limp Mode at high speeds, I accepted their justifications, and waited for my second service when they had promised to change the fuel injection pump.

After the second service last week, even though the pump was not changed, I accepted my car because they had changed the filters and I thought the problem may have been solved.

On reaching home, because there was an awful rattle under the hood, I called my service advisor and he promised to collect the vehicle, after I refused to take it to some local workshop for repairs as he suggested. But as noone came after five days, I called the owner of the dealer centre, and my car was collected last Monday 9th Feb.

The driver understood the problems, was polite and courteus. There were only two snags on his drive back to the service centre. Instead of taking on right turn, and then a left turn, he kept taking right turns and landed up where I picked him from the bustand, only he drove around 55 Kms, before he realised his mistake. Luckily for me the Limp Mode acted up as I had warned him, and he got to experience it for all of 85 KMs, on his drive back. So now my car is in the dealer's workshop waiting for a new fuel injection pump, because the 4 nos. they had in stock is over.

My rattle was corrected, it was due to a loose nut on the steering end, they said, and because I don't know which nut, and which nut loosened it, and why that nut loosened that nut in the first place, I am glad the nut has been tightened, because I was going nuts about that loose nut.

Hopefully I should get my sport back in a week.

Last time, I got it back with permanent grease stains on my fabric seats, and a few dabs on the plastics too. I wonder where they will place the decorations this time.

I am mildly worried about the new worries that my car will bring me this time, because I suspect I got the Limp Mode after they unnecassirily fiddled with the ECU at the first service, and the loose nut must have come after they aligned the steering wheel.

I expect the fuel pump replacement to an important kind of work, so the more serious the job, the greater the new fault ought to be.

But honestly, I expected all this, though not all this much...

Still and all, I love the car, it scoots well, it handles wonderfully, it leaves the competition so far behind, I often need to slow down to let them catch up so's we can continue the 'catch game' on the highways (if I don't stall, because it then becomes extremely embarassing, and downright dangerous too, because it is no fun when when your engine takes a hike when you are going from 120 to 130)

The suspension is great on the test roads that my state government has provided all over. My local bosy has been kind enough to leave last one kilometer of road to my house untarred for the last forty years, so I can actually test my vehicles on a real dirt road everyday. The Fiat rides well on the stones, the rubble etc. It handles deep mudholes excellently in the monsoons too.

There are these permanent minor noises in the car, but if turn the music loud enough, you won't hear them.

Regarding the lots of comments on dealer bad ways and manufacturer carelessness, I wouldn't want to make comments, but just to make a statement on the current thread, ....

there are many honest dealers, and many honest employees, lack of information, and inefficient systems should not be construed as cheating.

I could gripe about TVS and about Mahindra and about Scorpio, but I have griped to the proper people and the proper time, and they have always responded positively. So also with my Matiz.

Positive response and correct redtification is another matter, because though attempts were really made by them, I think, my problems persist.

So I have learned to accept these situations, where nothing is perfect

Exp[ecially in a Fiat. Buy it only if you want it and fully knowing you will get a lot of imperfections for the fanatstic performace. But after buying it don't gripe, because that is how it is!!
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Old 12th February 2009, 02:20   #274
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Man! That was one hell of a post. An amazing creation I should always keep in mind.
Many things you have told are true facts and that's how cold things are.

Good to see people who understand the reality and doesn't shy in spewing it out.
"Buy it only... But after buying, don't gripe..." golden words.

Btw, Punalur? Do you know a black Petra in your neighborhood?
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Old 12th February 2009, 11:26   #275
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Wonderful post Tomthump!

Welcome ot T-Bhp. Enjoy your stay here!
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Old 12th February 2009, 11:37   #276
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All those that preached about "Pride in one's job" and such stuff might find it useful to look at how they discharge their duties before pointing fingers at others, which is so easy. As is said, "Take the log from your eye, before attempting to remove the splinter from someone else's eye".

And @Raveendra, though tedious, I guess it is much more easier to type out a huge list of non-relevant points rather than acknowledge the problem presented by the thread starter.

I wash my car(s) myself, every single time, for the past 24 years. But that does not mean, I would wash the cars at the organisation I work for. Unless it is part of my job description, and I don't see washing cars being part of a car salesman's job description, atleast in India.

Last edited by supremeBaleno : 12th February 2009 at 11:41.
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Old 12th February 2009, 16:22   #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomthump View Post
I am a newbie here, and would not presume to be an authority on cars. I bought my Matiz SD in '98 against good advice from well meaning folks, and drove it happilly for ten years till 2008, when I sold it because I decided to buy a Fiat Palio Sport 1.6.
Which dealer do you go to? Have you spoken to FIAT direcly about your issue. Sure they would take up things with high priority.
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Old 12th February 2009, 16:36   #278
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Tomthump - it has been quite an experience for you with Palio. Hope your issues are sorted out. This clearly shows that FIAT service and spare parts availability has remained bad even after the TATA tie-up.
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Old 12th February 2009, 16:48   #279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DieselFan View Post
Tomthump - it has been quite an experience for you with Palio. Hope your issues are sorted out. This clearly shows that FIAT service and spare parts availability has remained bad even after the TATA tie-up.
Whoa! I have been trying hard to stay away from this thread, but don't you think you are generalizing bit too much for whole Fiat and its A/S/S based on this one specific incident? And, does it count if 10 Fiat owners jump on this thread and say that they have been getting excellent A/S/S? Both would be far from truth.
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Old 12th February 2009, 19:03   #280
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@TomThump, excellent post dude. Exactly what i have been also trying to say. Fiat makes good cars but their A.S.S. is not at all great. Of course every manufacturer may have issues with A.S.S. but somewhat Fiat has more!!

btw from where do you get your vehicle serviced?which tata-fiat dealer?because i will be returning to kerala in some time and i want to know where to give my sport for service
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Old 12th February 2009, 23:27   #281
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Hi Speedzak, thank you for the generous appreciation, but I am sorry I have not seen your black Petra.
Mu brother in Cochin has a silver Petra, Petrol though.

Thank you to you too kb100

Gemi, I called Fiat when I was unable to reach the dealer at all his phone numbers, including the number they stuck on the windshield.
I tried the dealer website, but the site was not renewed so no help there either.

So I checked the Fiat site, and called Toll free on customer care first, then the service helpline.

They gave me the number of the dealer, but agin Zilch!

Finally I remembered and called the sales person who booked my order and delivered the car at my house, driving it all the way from the dealer.

I do not personally consider the present issue serious enough to take it the the manufacturer. I am a chainsaw dealer, selling and servicing my machines. We always try to do a good job, but often inspite of the care we take, there are instances where small corrections need to be done again. But as we alwys recheck before handing the saw to the customer, we can do a good job.

The customer is often not knowledgeable about the complaints or the proper service procedures, and though we correct the complaints, unless we take time to check other components too, which job we do not get paid for because it was not asked for by the customer,the customer may have to return after a short while. We take pride in our work, so we take pains to do things properly in the first instance itself.

So if I were to have a customer call my principal about a shoddy work, as seen from his point of view, that would leave me unhappy because I was not given an opportunity to correct it (though this has never happened to date Likewise, I need to give leeway to my car dealer too. Let him try to sort out the problems. Once I am convinced he cannot or will not do it, only then do I need to make an issue of it.

So I will leave the dealer name blank for the time being...

DieselFan, not withstanding anything I mentioned above, I agree with you. But in my dealership I experience this all the time. I place an order for spares, but I don't get all of them, because everything is imported, and my principal is not perfect either so there are time lags. To avoid them, I am forced to stock large numbers of expensive slow moving stuff. I can do it as an individual, but I cannot really see how a dealer with hundreds of cars sold, can afford to stockpile vague spares in the unlikely event of having a need for them. It is much safer to request the customer to wait a while till the part comes. Not a perfect system I agree, but with an honest approach, and with a supportive principal it helps.

Carfreak, As I said, I will name the dealer later if my car faults are sorted out. I can then honestly tell you he is good. Till then, you have to ask someone else here. Why don't you ask Gemi? He would be THE expert for you on that.

People have told me that the Maruti Swift has a Fiat diesel engine, that the new Indica has it too, also naturally the Fiat cars. Tata and Maruti must have found a good thing to go for that.

I often hear people say that Fiat made a mistake by giving Fiat to the Tatas to sell, because for Tata it is their own cars which is important. Maybe the Fiat folks have a reason for that, because they would also look at all aspects too.

I am not making excuses for Fiat or their dealers, because I have done my share of screaming, bustling out of service centres and writing snide letters and e-mails to car companies, but finally I realized my aim should be to get my vehicle back in a better condition and screaming at your dealer is less efective than the soft approach. The hard act can always be brought in later if needed, but why bother for such small issues?
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Old 13th February 2009, 01:14   #282
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Excellent post Welcome to T-BHP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomthump View Post
Exp[ecially in a Fiat. Buy it only if you want it and fully knowing you will get a lot of imperfections for the fanatstic performace. But after buying it don't gripe, because that is how it is!!
Being a Ikon owner I can't agree more!
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Old 13th February 2009, 09:21   #283
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Well weighed post, TomThump.

Neutral, Non-biased and sharp enough to convey the message.
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Old 13th February 2009, 11:20   #284
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omg!! disconnect the odo and send it for a test drive!!what if some one in the show room wanted to go for a long drive and dint have a car.. disconnect the odo and put on a fake registration plate and lets go to goa tomorrow.
This is really pathetic from Tata and fiat's side.Thanks muneem for shedding light on us,this gives us an idea what happens in most dealerships.
Fiat did a big mistake by choosing Tata as their partner in india.Instead of murdering their image here they simply should have wrapped up and walked out of here.
This is kinda a warning to all new car buyers not only Fiat but others.
Btw i have fitted a remote locking system on my palio 1.2 nv without much problem.
it was purchased in dubai.
GTO i think you should put this little point in your thread related to predelivery when taking a test drive check if the ODO is running or not if not on the test vehicle there is something fishy going on.

Last edited by vinaydas : 13th February 2009 at 11:28.
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Old 13th February 2009, 11:32   #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital Vampire View Post
Well weighed post, TomThump.

Neutral, Non-biased and sharp enough to convey the message.
I agree. TomThump - Your posts have been possibly the most balanced posts here, and I think you are absolutely spot on in giving the dealer a chance to address your concerns before escalating it.

I hope your car gets fixed properly and you have many years of driving pleasure with her.
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