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Old 14th April 2012, 14:20   #1
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Default Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Mods - I am creating a new thread to discuss the specifics of the claim for my car and the issues surrounding it. If you find that the thread has to be moved around to some other place / merged with another one please do that. I believe that due to specific information and issues faced, a new thread is very much needed.

Hi Everyone,

I am creating this thread to:

1. Make everyone aware of the way of working of Bajaj Allianz. This might be the way of working of the assigned surveyor, lets wait for the outcome so that I can understand the whole way of working.

2. Get suggestions from you all to understand my right and my options and way forward in the current scenario where my expectations and the resolution by the insurer are poles apart.

To start with the history - I met with an accident on 26th of Feb around 7:30 - 8:00 AM in the morning where the car (My 3 years old Accent GLE IDV 4,18,000) went down the road at reasonable speed and overturned damaging the body shell. There was no damage to the engine, transmission, passengers, third party property or people. There were very minor injury to occupants like scratches and bruises.

Post the accident, the villagers helped to straighten the car and get all of us out of the car. After settling down and relaxing for 10 -15 mins, I called up the Bajaj Allianz call center and informed about the accident. As I was not sure of the place to get the car required, it was a temporary claim. I asked specifically whether I can move my car and if they need any inspection or police verification, the call center guy confirmed that there is no need to do so and I can move the car to any authorized service center of my choice. I organized and got the car shifted to Hyderabad to my regular service center.

I registered a permanent claim by providing the location to get the car repaired and a surveyor was appointed. The surveyor inspected and ascertained that the loss is very high and will need another (External?) Surveyor to inspect it. The second surveyor inspected the car and asked for an estimate to repair the vehicle. This complete process took 3 weeks.

The estimate included body shell replacement costing something around 2.5 Lakhs and the total repair cost was 3.55 L. As the repair cost was more than 75% of the IDV, I and the surveyor talked about total loss.
The surveyor here said -
1. The repairs costs are too high and he will check for a cheaper option.
2. He suggested to only replace the side shells not the complete shell.
3. When I asked him about the possibility of the car being structurally correct after only side shell repair, he said that it is not his part of confirm the quality of car.
4. On this I mentioned that when the insurer is deviating from the suggested repair approach by the expert (authorized showroom), they should have a scientific base to confirm the repair quality being at par with the one suggested by the ***.
5. He confirmed that the quality will not be at par with replacement, but it will be cheaper for the insurer and he will go with the cheapest option.
I did not agree to this logic and he suggested that he will work on the file and forward it to his boss. I agreed to this.

when i did not hear on the progress for more than a week, i got the contact of another person (probably his boss). This person was a very supportive guy and listened to everything and said that he will check will update me on the progress and options. He called me the next day and informed that they are trying to get a quote on the salvage and will get back to me on the best way out in a day or two. I waited for a week and called back again. They said that they are working on the best deal they can find. Post that there was a family issue with this guy and he said he will get back to me ASAP. He stopped responding last week to all phone calls and emails.

Yesterday, I received a call from the ***, mentioning that they have received a go ahead to repair the side shells. I mentioned that I am still in talks with Bajaj Allianz and asked them wait till I hear from them.

Called up the surveyour2 again yesterday evening, he said that the scrap value was 80K and the repairs were costly so they will approve only side shell repairs which is not acceptable to me. Now - I had talks with some scrap dealers who were willing to buy the car for 2-2.4L easily. This claim of 80k did not sound true and sounded more of of a delay tactic.

I have raised a complaint with Bajaj Allianz on their website. Its almost 2 months and I am not sure how long this will take to settle. Will keep you all posted on the progress.

Please pass you advice and suggestions.

Thanks in Advance.


PS : All is not lost. With the new complaint raised on the website, I am hoping that the issue will be resolved amicably. I also believe that these are tactics employed by the people who might have their bonus/ commission linked to $$$ they save and they are willing to take all the short cuts and risk lives to save some money, but for a large organization few 100Ks don't make much difference and they will be more worried about their responsibility and would take the right decision without endangering people. I am hoping that this reaches to someone higher up who can visualize the bigger picture and assess what all is at stake.

Will keep all the progress updated here.

Last edited by MrinalSinha : 14th April 2012 at 14:22. Reason: Removed Font tags
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Old 14th April 2012, 16:24   #2
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrinalSinha View Post

The estimate included body shell replacement costing something around 2.5 Lakhs and the total repair cost was 3.55 L. As the repair cost was more than 75% of the IDV, I and the surveyor talked about total loss.
The surveyor here said -
1. The repairs costs are too high and he will check for a cheaper option.
2. He suggested to only replace the side shells not the complete shell.
3. When I asked him about the possibility of the car being structurally correct after only side shell repair, he said that it is not his part of confirm the quality of car.
4. On this I mentioned that when the insurer is deviating from the suggested repair approach by the expert (authorized showroom), they should have a scientific base to confirm the repair quality being at par with the one suggested by the ***.
5. He confirmed that the quality will not be at par with replacement, but it will be cheaper for the insurer and he will go with the cheapest option.
I did not agree to this logic and he suggested that he will work on the file and forward it to his boss. I agreed to this.

Called up the surveyour2 again yesterday evening, he said that the scrap value was 80K and the repairs were costly so they will approve only side shell repairs which is not acceptable to me. Now - I had talks with some scrap dealers who were willing to buy the car for 2-2.4L easily. This claim of 80k did not sound true and sounded more of of a delay tactic.
What was your first approach on the repairs part? I mean you sent your car to the authorized Hyundai workshop or a Private Bodyshop?
The reason is that the surveyor has some vested interests in earning a quick buck with the bodyshop. 80K for an Accent surely sounds fishy.
As you mentioned that you have a 2-2.4L offer from other scrap dealer, I am sure this is a 'setup'.
Why cant BA (Bajaj Allianz) pay you the scrap value of the car rather then approving only the side shell repairs?
And where is your agent in the picture here? He/She should be the one who has to bail you out of this mess!
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Old 14th April 2012, 18:12   #3
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Very sorry to hear of your accident Mrinal. I hope by Gods grace, all of you are safe.
Regarding your query, I guess there is no outstanding loan on the car as of now. The best thing should be for you to get the Side shell repaired, then sell off the car as a used car. Will give you peace of mind from the thought of whether the repaired shell would cause problems in the future. With the resale value (Which I estimate would be maybe some 2.99 Lakhs as per carwale), buy another pre-owned car.
Another option is to check on Linked-in for some senior officials from Bajaj Allianz, and shoot off mails to them with your issue. They will surely respond or pass it on to responsible people.
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Old 14th April 2012, 18:55   #4
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Thanks for your replies guys!
@KkVaidya
The car was straightaway taken to ***. There is no private workshop involved. The Car was in mint condition before the accident so i am definitely loosing a lot even after the Total loss payout (if it happens), but I am fine with that as legally and contractually i am entitled to it, nothing more.

Moreover, scrap is not my issue. This is something which is with the insurer to take care of. I have paid my premium to get my dues when the situation arrives and I dont understand why should I settle for the scrap value at all.

Did not understand the Agent thing at all. Please explain.

@hrman
There is no outstanding amount for the car at all.
Why shall I not try to get my just dues, which is definitely either the shell replacement or the total loss. Why shall I pass on a defective car to someone. I had offers of 4.6L to sell the car weeks before I met with an accident and most probably would have sold it in March at that price. The car was, to quote most of my near and dear ones and the ***, better than an ex showroom car, immaculate condition, no scratches absolutely clean inside out, great AC, great mileage, no rattles, very decent music system (thanks to T-Bhp suggestion). I, per the contract, am asking for the repairs to bring it back to the same condition as it was before the accident, nothing more. I have already decided a replacement and am looking for a good Pre-owned Cruze to cater to my car needs. Hopefully I am going to close this week.

I am wrong is expecting what I paid the premium for? Why should I accommodate to something which is not per the contract?
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Old 16th April 2012, 11:20   #5
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Mrinal,

Very sad to hear about the accident. Hope you will continue your fight for justice with Bajaj. This is surely bad news for all those who endorse Bajaj Allianz - and sadly I too bought my car insurance from them.

Delaying tactics to frustrate someone - hoping he will givein to lower demands - who is already bearing the brunt of the accident is not called for.

Try to contact the top management asap if repeated efforts from you did not resolve this.

Cheers

VW
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Old 16th April 2012, 12:24   #6
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Weekend i renew my insurance with Bajaj Allianz and Monday morning i see this thread, looks like Bajaj Allianz is a bad choice for getting car insured. Is there a way to raise the complaint against them in Consumer forum or the likes would using some of the information provided in this thread help (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifti...-you-do.html)? (Heard of pgportal.gov.in? About time you do)

My personal experiences with a single claim (over last 5 years) i had with them was rather smooth, i must add.
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Old 16th April 2012, 14:48   #7
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrinalSinha View Post
Please pass you advice and suggestions.
Thanks in Advance.
Hello Mrinal Sinha,

It is indeed good to know that all the passengers are absolutely safe, despite serious damage to car.

Now, coming to your Car, the IDV is Rs. 4,18,000. Firstly you make up your mind as to what do your want to do with your car? I mean would you like to get it repaired or you want to go for Total Loss & get the IDV from Insurance Company.

I went through almost the same incident couple of months back & the link to my experience is here: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...loss-case.html (My Experience with Royal Sundaram Insurance (Total Loss Case))

If the body shell is damaged & it needs to be replaced, I would personally suggest to go for Total Loss & buy a another car. Because it would be only after a couple of months or years, you will come to know how good the job of replacing the Body Shell is done.

Firslty schedule a personal meeting with Surveyor & check what is his share of Repair Estimate? Say if Bajaj Allianz's share is Rs. 1.8 lacs or more & you are getting Rs. 2 to Rs. 2..4 lacs from scrap dealers, then ask them to go for Total Loss Case, because in this case company is getting a benefit, whenere they have to shell out more than Rs. 1.8 lacs for Repairs, while in Total Loss case, their liability is maximum Rs. 1,78,000 (4,18,000 - 2,40,000).

Also there are many threads here on T-BHP, but just to keep you updated, if you are negotiating for Total Loss, just stick to demand of getting Full IDV back.

Please feel free to post your specific queries before / after meeting with Suryevor here.

Thanks,
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Old 17th April 2012, 10:05   #8
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jignesh View Post
Hello Mrinal Sinha,

It is indeed good to know that all the passengers are absolutely safe, despite serious damage to car.

Now, coming to your Car, the IDV is Rs. 4,18,000. Firstly you make up your mind as to what do your want to do with your car? I mean would you like to get it repaired or you want to go for Total Loss & get the IDV from Insurance Company.

I went through almost the same incident couple of months back & the link to my experience is here: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...loss-case.html (My Experience with Royal Sundaram Insurance (Total Loss Case))

If the body shell is damaged & it needs to be replaced, I would personally suggest to go for Total Loss & buy a another car. Because it would be only after a couple of months or years, you will come to know how good the job of replacing the Body Shell is done.

Firslty schedule a personal meeting with Surveyor & check what is his share of Repair Estimate? Say if Bajaj Allianz's share is Rs. 1.8 lacs or more & you are getting Rs. 2 to Rs. 2..4 lacs from scrap dealers, then ask them to go for Total Loss Case, because in this case company is getting a benefit, whenere they have to shell out more than Rs. 1.8 lacs for Repairs, while in Total Loss case, their liability is maximum Rs. 1,78,000 (4,18,000 - 2,40,000).

Also there are many threads here on T-BHP, but just to keep you updated, if you are negotiating for Total Loss, just stick to demand of getting Full IDV back.

Please feel free to post your specific queries before / after meeting with Suryevor here.

Thanks,
Thankyou Jignesh! I have been through your thread and I have taken a lot of inputs from there. I am clear on my thoughts, but the issue is slightly different. Bajaj Allianz is not willing to foot the bill for shell replacement, they want to get side shells replaced. They have sent an work approval to the *** for shell replacement and complete body painting except bonnet and boot.

What pains me is that the way they inspected the car yesterday. The BA represntative took exactly 30 secs and half a round around the covered car to agree to the Surveyour that he will aprove only side shell. He also communicated clearly that he is not responsible for quality of the car post repair. He mentioned it clearly that I can do whatever I want, but he will not approve the shell.

With the shell out of the equation the repair cost wont relate to total cost. My bigger worry is that they do not have a way and they are not interested in assessing the damage. they go by there gut feeling.

What are options here?

They offered me to "Net off Salvage" where I have to find a buyer, as they are unable to find a salvage buyer, and they will see what best they can add to the buyers price. All in all I am saddened by the way things have progressed. I feel I am getting cornered.

Last edited by MrinalSinha : 17th April 2012 at 10:25.
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Old 17th April 2012, 10:51   #9
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrinalSinha View Post
Thankyou Jignesh!
What are options here?
They offered me to "Net off Salvage" where I have to find a buyer, as they are unable to find a salvage buyer, and they will see what best they can add to the buyers price. All in all I am saddened by the way things have progressed. I feel I am getting cornered.
Hello Mrinal,

Thank you for the appreciation.

Firstly please don't feel sad & cornered. We are here to help & guide you, please be assured & confident to defend your rights (& best Interest).

The Insurance companies do best to keep their share of the repair cost to minimum. Afterall they are here to do business (& make profit).

Now, my first suggestion once again is to get the amount of Repair Estimate approved by the Insurance Company. I am sure the repair Estimate will be more than Rs. 1,50,000 considering the side pannel replacements, Glass replacements, Denting, Paintaing & other parts replacement.

Say the repair estimate is Rs. 2,00,000 & your share is Rs. 50,000 which means that Insurance company's share is Rs. 1,50,000. Now get a written quote from scrap buyer, who is ready to pay Rs. 2,40,000 for your damaged Car. Subsequently ask the Insurance Company to go for "Constructive Total Loss" where they will pay you Rs. 1,50,000 (their share of Repairs) & you keep the car in 'as is" condition. Once this is approved sell the Car to scrap buyer for Rs. 2,40,000, which means you get Rs. 4,00,000 for your car (which is very close to IDV of Rs. 4,18,000).

But above suggestion is based on assumption of Repair estimate of Rs. 2,00,000. Please let us know the exact details & we will able to guide you further.

Thanks,
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Old 17th April 2012, 18:14   #10
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Thanks a lot Jignesh! Your post was indeed very pleasing. I am actually working on the same lines and I am in process of getting quotes from scrap buyers. But this is eating up lot of mental peace. On one hand, I am looking to sell a car and on the other to buy a car .

As the current estimate which is not approved and is given for body shell the total repair cost is 355000/-. The shell is costing upwards of 2L and they are not approving it for the obvious reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankjha1806 View Post
Weekend i renew my insurance with Bajaj Allianz and Monday morning i see this thread, looks like Bajaj Allianz is a bad choice for getting car insured. Is there a way to raise the complaint against them in Consumer forum or the likes would using some of the information provided in this thread help (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifting-gears/111325-heard-pgportal-gov-about-time-you-do.html)? (Heard of pgportal.gov.in? About time you do)

My personal experiences with a single claim (over last 5 years) i had with them was rather smooth, i must add.
Mayank, I missed your post! I too had no issue with the claim handling for a small repair. But this one is killing me. I had an insurance to take me out of any deep mess like this. The small repair is good to have feature not the primary reason to take own damage insurance.

Last edited by MrinalSinha : 17th April 2012 at 18:30.
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Old 17th April 2012, 18:26   #11
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrinalSinha View Post
Thanks a lot Jignesh! Your post was indeed very pleasing. I am actually working on the same lines and I am in process of getting quotes from scrap buyers. But this is eating up lot of mental peace. On one hand, I am looking to sell a car and on the other to buy a car .
I understand the current state of your mind. But the most important thing for you (& me, in my case) is that the passengers of the Cars are absolutely safe. Nothing else matters more than safety & well-being of our loved ones & the ones who are travelling with us.

Just one tip that I got from the Insurance Surveyor: Get a written quote from Scrap Buyer (Salvage Buyer in Insurance Terms) & also when receiving payment, either take Cash or Demand Draft from him. If if insists on giving you cheque then release the Car only after amount is credited in your Bank Account.

Thanks,
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Old 17th April 2012, 20:11   #12
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrinalSinha View Post
They offered me to "Net off Salvage" where I have to find a buyer, as they are unable to find a salvage buyer, and they will see what best they can add to the buyers price. All in all I am saddened by the way things have progressed. I feel I am getting cornered.

This is ridiculous.
You need to contact IRDA and report this nonsense.

It's not your business to worry about this.
You are covered for full IDV and they WILL HAVE TO honor that.
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Old 18th April 2012, 09:30   #13
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

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Originally Posted by anandpadhye View Post
This is ridiculous.
You need to contact IRDA and report this nonsense.

It's not your business to worry about this.
You are covered for full IDV and they WILL HAVE TO honor that.
Thanks for supporting my views in this endeavor. I am in process of escalating the matter to next level in BA. I will definitely go to IRDA if it doesn't gets resolved.
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Old 18th April 2012, 10:49   #14
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

Sorry to know about this incident. Whatever be the case, i would strongly recommend that you dispose of this car as it will never be in its original condition especially after if only the side body shells are repaired and not the complete structure shells.

After such a repair, the car will not behave normally and will feel even more lighter to drive ( Accent is light even by original standards)

Get a full estimate from BA and then get a scrap value estimate as well and go for the best figure. BA has to honor the IDV value at any case and dont let them off the hook and tell them you will go to any extent if your claim is not honored properly.

Btw, getting it scrapped and pocketing the money would be simplest and hassle free. If you get it repaired and try to sell it, it may not get sold as those repairs may come to light to any prospective buyer.
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Old 18th April 2012, 12:04   #15
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Default Re: Issues with Bajaj Allianz - Total Loss Vs Forced partial repair.

I think you should stop looking for scrap dealer, etc.
You are the customer that the insurance company have covered and they should do the job. Why are you taking a soft stand?
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