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Old 22nd February 2015, 00:54   #196
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Default Re: Question about salvage deduction

Yes i did notice it says salvage in the claim form. It definitely does not say salvage in the only document i got from them - the 2 page certificate. Whether this is standard practice or not, I don't care - but from a strictly legal perspective, if they don't clearly tell me, and get my acknowledgment signature etc, they cannot charge me.



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Originally Posted by bbyf16 View Post
glad to hear you're ok. I'm guessing that you have a soft copy of your insurance policy. I'm guessing here, usually when I have insurance with bajaj or tata aig, they email me the policy which is that two page document saying policy valid from now to then. If I then call up and say I want a hard copy, they actually send a booklet. In case of reliance, they appear to call it policy wordings, https://www.reliancegeneral.co.in/in...ate-car-pw.pdf Now I haven't gone through the document, as I'm a bit short on time here but if you seriously want to know, why not pop into a reliance general insurance shop tomorrow or call them up and say you want to insure an imaginary car or whatever. Right now you have with icici but you don't like their 10% salvage fee, do you also charge salvage, if so, how much. That way you can find out if the body shop/surveyor is lying to you or not. But like you said, the tank is still usable, and you're getting it at a fraction of the cost, why not? of course thats a decision only you can make.

Lastly, before I go, I did take a look at the reliance general claim form, https://www.reliancegeneral.co.in/Do...aim%20Form.pdf, please note, it does say "Claim amount shall be subject to the policy terms and conditions and there shall be deduction for depreciation, excess, salvage etc. as laid down in the policy
terms. Please go through the policy document"

Hope that helps.
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Old 22nd February 2015, 01:51   #197
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Default Re: Question about salvage deduction

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Originally Posted by MrSDey View Post
Yes i did notice it says salvage in the claim form. It definitely does not say salvage in the only document i got from them - the 2 page certificate. Whether this is standard practice or not, I don't care - but from a strictly legal perspective, if they don't clearly tell me, and get my acknowledgment signature etc, they cannot charge me.
please don't take this personally, but I like to play devil's advocate so i'll pick at your argument. Hopefully it might help you when you go to see the insurance people, once again, don't take it personally.. When you mention legal perspective, do you have a legal background? The second you paid them and a policy was issued to you, whatever their policy wordings are/were, are enforceable. That is the concept behind a contract or any such transaction. They are giving you services and you are paying them money. It isn't their fault if you never took the time to read the policy wordings or what have you. To think of it in a lighter vein, think back of all the times where you have clicked I agree to EULA (end user license agreement) for software. Have you actually read the document? If it says somewhere in that 47 page document that they have a right to search your computer for pictures and upload it to a website, it's not their fault you never saw it. Now could you argue that it goes outside the purview of the software and therefore malicious intent, yes, in theory, but I digress.

Now coming back to you again, read your policy, the one you have with you. Somewhere above their signature and below limitations of use, there will be a section called important notice. Now I pulled up both my icici policy and bajaj for this, so it might only apply to them. I don't know unless you share the bottom half of your policy, but it declares the endorsements that are applicable to this policy under IRDA and also a disclaimer. If you actually have nothing that says anything regarding policy wordings or kindly refer to so and so for complete terms and conditions, then you're in the clear. Otherwise...

I don't intend to make this a debate, I'm just letting on info.
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Old 22nd February 2015, 02:14   #198
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Default Re: Question about salvage deduction

Yes, I have a legal background, although I am not a lawyer. Worked in law firms as researcher, although not in India.

Attached my policy document - the only thing I have with me.

I have read my policy document that was given to me by the insurer. It does not mention "salvage" at all. It says compulsory deductible is 100/-, and the policy is zero dep. If the policy had mentioned "salvage deduction 15%" the whole discussion would have been moot.

Now, it may quite well be that the policy certificate and the policy document are separate entities. However, I have not received any policy document apart from that 2 page certificate. Ignorance of law is not an excuse, but this isn't legislation, this is a contract. How would you agree to a contract if certain clauses of a contract are kept hidden from you?

No offense taken, always welcome constructive discussion. Believe many people face this issue. Anytime I am asked to cough up 10-15k without being previously clearly told about it, I think I am being conned.

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Originally Posted by bbyf16 View Post
please don't take this personally, but I like to play devil's advocate so i'll pick at your argument.
======
If you actually have nothing that says anything regarding policy wordings or kindly refer to so and so for complete terms and conditions, then you're in the clear. Otherwise...

I don't intend to make this a debate, I'm just letting on info.
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0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!-ins1.jpg  

0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!-ins2.jpg  

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Old 23rd February 2015, 01:32   #199
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Default Re: Question about salvage deduction

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Originally Posted by MrSDey View Post
Yes, I have a legal background, although I am not a lawyer. Worked in law firms as researcher, although not in India.

Attached my policy document - the only thing I have with me.

I have read my policy document that was given to me by the insurer. It does not mention "salvage" at all. It says compulsory deductible is 100/-, and the policy is zero dep. If the policy had mentioned "salvage deduction 15%" the whole discussion would have been moot.

Now, it may quite well be that the policy certificate and the policy document are separate entities. However, I have not received any policy document apart from that 2 page certificate. Ignorance of law is not an excuse, but this isn't legislation, this is a contract. How would you agree to a contract if certain clauses of a contract are kept hidden from you?

No offense taken, always welcome constructive discussion. Believe many people face this issue. Anytime I am asked to cough up 10-15k without being previously clearly told about it, I think I am being conned.
hi there, have taken a cursory look at your documents and as far as I can see, on ins2 (above insured name : "I have read and understood the salient, features, terms and conditions of the policy as stated in the brochure".... Also, below the statutory warning it says "for detailed terms and conditions (policy wordings) governing this policy, kindly refer to our website.) On ins1, above important notice, it says "Subject otherwise to the terms, conditions, and exclusions of the reliance two wheeler policy."

At the end of the day, us going back and forth like this doesn't really solve anything. i'm linking another teambhp thread where the person is being charged salvage by reliance. Perhaps that would help you out. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...sk-me-197.html (Automobile Insurance Queries? Ask me). Best of luck.
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Old 26th February 2015, 23:30   #200
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

Hello everyone...
i just went through the entire thread (Although i skipped last two pages ) as i'm on the verge of buying a Maruti Ciaz ZXI.
Ex-Showroom Price Rs 8,95,000/-
Insurance Amt Rs 19,000/-
Add On Bumper to Bumper Rs 7200/-

Is this a decent bargain?? After going through this thread & on advice of a dear friend, I wanna go for this Zero Dep Add-on. Though i haven't got the quote for Zero Dep Add-on.
My kind of driving involves Self-Driven, Not much of city traffic. Requesting for valuable advice from all esteemed BHP'ians..
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Old 27th February 2015, 08:08   #201
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Originally Posted by sandeep959 View Post
Is this a decent bargain?? Though i haven't got the quote for Zero Dep Add-on.
Bumper to bumper add on cover is another term used for zero depreciation. You have been quoted for that already. The total of 26K approx is decent based on the IDV i.e ex showroom cost.

Is this quote from the dealer or from online? Who is the Insurance co? I would suggest try doing a comparison online with other Insurance co to get understand how much benefits does this Insurance co have over others or vice versa.
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Old 28th February 2015, 11:07   #202
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

I am about to renew my Zero Depreciation policy with Bharti-Axa and found that no other insurer offers all of the benefits offered by them:

1. 100% repayment on replaced depreciated part
2. Avail repairing costs of fiber, glass, rubber and plastic parts.
3. Vehicle covered up to 5 years from the date of registration.
4. 200000/- insurance has been covered for the owner driver.
5. Third party person coverage is unlimited.
6. Third party property coverage is up to 7.5 lakhs.
7. For Zero depreciation there is no depreciation on painting.
8. Engine coverage is of 100% for the accidental case.
9. 100% repayment on theft, fire and total loss on IDV.
10. Unlimited no of claim for Zero Depreciation Coverage.
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Old 28th February 2015, 11:53   #203
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

Presently I'm in the process of buying a new car. I've heard of 0 dep insurance before but this is the first time I'm going to avail it. But I have a few doubts is my mind. It'd be nice to clear these doubts before I start bargaining with the insurer.

1. In zero dep insurance, will the IDV remain constant in 2nd year, 3rd year and so on. Say the initial ex-showroom i.e. the IDV is 9.5L. Normally what we see is the insurance co.deduct 10% fixed depreciation every year. So in the 2nd year the IDV will come to around 8.6L and so on. Will it be the same in zero dep as well? If so then how will they give 100% coverage for damaged parts?

2. Is there any limitation of number of claims in a year? I mean is there anything like the first two claims in a year will get zero dep benefit and any claim beyond that will attract depreciation as usual?
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Old 28th February 2015, 12:08   #204
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

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Originally Posted by Carpainter View Post

1. In zero dep insurance, will the IDV remain constant in 2nd year, 3rd year and so on. Say the initial ex-showroom i.e. the IDV is 9.5L. Normally what we see is the insurance co.deduct 10% fixed depreciation every year. So in the 2nd year the IDV will come to around 8.6L and so on. Will it be the same in zero dep as well? If so then how will they give 100% coverage for damaged parts?

2. Is there any limitation of number of claims in a year? I mean is there anything like the first two claims in a year will get zero dep benefit and any claim beyond that will attract depreciation as usual?
1) Yes, the IDV calculation works in the same way as in regular policies.
2) Almost all Insurers limit zero dep. claim to 2 per policy year except Bharti-Axa which has no limit on number of zero dep. claim
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Old 28th February 2015, 13:21   #205
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

my verna fluidic car was banged up on one complete side by my brother. fortunately i have a zero dep policy from tata aig. the bill i am told will be around 4700...2000 for file charge + 1050 for consumables and 1600 for vat on labor(13000 labor charges.. total bill was 36K)
i am a bit doubtful if this labor cost should be borne by me or not. has anybody paid such amount before? i am going to call the customer care as well to clarify. please advise.
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Old 1st March 2015, 00:09   #206
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

Never been asked and paid any such charges under zero dep. policy claim as VAT or consumables. Only fixed claim charges of 2k.
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Old 2nd March 2015, 05:48   #207
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

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Never been asked and paid any such charges under zero dep. policy claim as VAT or consumables. Only fixed claim charges of 2k.
Thanks for the response. I spoke to the guy and told me that my friend never had to pay any amount as VAT for labor.
He spoke to the surveyor again and then called me back saying that surveyor Informed him that they stopped collecting that labor VAT 1 month back and will soon stop it altogether so need not pay that.

I paid 2K for file charges and 900 for consumables which is what I expected. Consumables are not covered in zero depreciation policy unless there is an add on cover for the same.
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Old 2nd March 2015, 08:15   #208
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8. Engine coverage is of 100% for the accidental case.
Is this the case or have your bought the engine protect add on cover along with the zero depreciation add on cover. These days most of the Insurance co offer most of the features you mentioned with an exception for one or two.

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Originally Posted by Carpainter View Post
1. So in the 2nd year the IDV will come to around 8.6L and so on. Will it be the same in zero dep as well? If so then how will they give 100% coverage for damaged parts?

2. Is there any limitation of number of claims in a year?
Generally IDV needs to be calculated based on the current ex showroom rate of the model/variant times the depreciation rate in %. But during renewals, Insurance co and the dealers/agents quote IDV as 10% of last year's IDV which is theoretically wrong. Zero dep add on cover cost depends on the OD premium which in turn depends on the IDV. So lesser IDV, lesser would the zero dep cost.

No of claims in a year without zero dep add on cover is unlimited. However few Insurance co continue this offer for Policies with zero dep add on. Some restrict the no of claims when zero dep add on is bought. See post#202 (Same page) posted by PedalToFloor where he has mentioned that Bharati Axa provides unlimited claims when zero dep add on is bought.

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the bill i am told will be around 4700...2000 for file charge + 1050 for consumables and 1600 for vat on labor(13000 labor charges.. total bill was 36K)
That labour charges is insane. Can you post the complete break up of the repair estimate? I would like to know what is this File charge costing Rs 2000/-. Is this the compulsory deductible you are referring to??
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Old 2nd March 2015, 08:23   #209
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

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That labour charges is insane. Can you post the complete break up of the repair estimate? I would like to know what is this File charge costing Rs 2000/-. Is this the compulsory deductible you are referring to??
The final bill was 2900 with 2000 for compulsory deductible as file charge since the car is 1600cc and 900 for consumables. Got the labor VAT removed after I questioned the legality behind it and that none of my team-bhp firends have paid it

The actual bill to insurance company was 36K which included 2 doors replaced, electronic side view mirror replaced, front and rear fender repaint and front bumper change. I dont have the detailed invoice as the car is in delhi(m in BLR) and had my bro pick it up who actually caused the damage in the first place.
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Old 2nd March 2015, 08:55   #210
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Default Re: 0% Depreciation Insurance - It really worked for me!

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Originally Posted by mani_jeenu View Post
The final bill was 2900 with 2000 for compulsory deductible as file charge since the car is 1600cc and 900 for consumables. Got the labor VAT removed after I questioned the legality behind it and that none of my team-bhp firends have paid it

The actual bill to insurance company was 36K which included 2 doors replaced, electronic side view mirror replaced, front and rear fender repaint and front bumper change. I dont have the detailed invoice as the car is in delhi(m in BLR) and had my bro pick it up who actually caused the damage in the first place.
Hope your car is back from all the works.
The labour charge is covered 100% in all insurance policy, be it comprehensive or Zero-Dep.
Your surveyor was trying to gouge more money out of you, since you questioned, he backed off.
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