Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 27th August 2016, 17:59   #526
BHPian
 
rutvij's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Ahmedabad
Posts: 332
Thanked: 75 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

It seems that by trying to play the numbers game by compromising on quality and premiumness, Honda has missed the changed preference of consumers for premium products. Higher variants of cars are selling in bigger numbers compared to lower variants. Further premium offerings like Creta, Baleno, Brezza, Innova Cresta etc. have become a huge success. Hyundai, Maruti and to an extent Toyota has played the game perfectly.

At present, if I want a premium car I do not have many options. I can't afford to spend 40 lakhs for a BMW X1 but I can certainly spend 15-20 lakhs for Civic / HR-V. Now due to ever increasing prices of Big 3 Germans, there is space under the Luxury Segment. Honda has products that can fill this space. This is the new realty of Urban India and Honda has failed to gauge that.

Last edited by rutvij : 27th August 2016 at 18:05.
rutvij is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 28th August 2016, 01:12   #527
BHPian
 
pixantz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 363
Thanked: 370 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Quite a theory! However -

1. Kindly explain with any factual evidence how Honda had better safety than the 'loaded cars'? We don't have safety ratings for most cars from either brands and it is the Hyundai that offered dual disk brakes, 4 airbags etc in their cars. Honda still hasn't even made airbags and ABS standard on all of their cars!

2. Honda cars are priced on top of each segments. So please explain why there should be a trade-off between quality and features when others seem to strike a balance between both. There is high level of localisation now, so import costs doesn't affect either.

3. Where did this 5- star safety rating come from? Is this recent news? I seem to have missed it completely. Unless of course, you are talking about international variants. As per my understanding, three of their Indian cars will only qualify for zero star since base variants are without airbags, and two will qualify for a maximum of four stars since ESP is missing.
1. Here is one example: http://m.autocarindia.com/article.as...4684&type=News . You can check anywhere and Honda is always up at the top. I was quoting/replying to a post specifically about the City so my post was referring to City mostly and not all the Honda models. In the above link the City fares better than a Vento. For example. There are as much evidence as one may want/seek everywhere. I'm surprised you asked.

2. Exactly. That's what Im saying. You missed the first paragraph of my post I guess.... Only Honda can explain. Everybody is stumped here

3. Same as reply 1
pixantz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th August 2016, 09:27   #528
Distinguished - BHPian
 
CrAzY dRiVeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore / TVM
Posts: 7,417
Thanked: 9,306 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by pixantz View Post
1. Here is one example: http://m.autocarindia.com/article.as...4684&type=News . You can check anywhere and Honda is always up at the top. I was quoting/replying to a post specifically about the City so my post was referring to City mostly and not all the Honda models. In the above link the City fares better than a Vento. For example. There are as much evidence as one may want/seek everywhere. I'm surprised you asked.
Nopes. There is zero evidence since all of these are relevant only to the ASEAN markets.

The previous generation Honda City did score a 5 star rating in the ASEAN NCAP, but -
1. It was made in Malaysia for ASEAN region.
2. Had Electronic Stability Control standard, which is mandatory for a 5 star rating.
3. ISOFIX was standard as well.

These are not standard (or even offered) in our cars so point comparing it above Vento here, when Vento offers ESC in atleast one trim and is crash tested for the Indian variant.

So coming back to the point I made earlier, assuming the build remains the same as ASEAN region, Indian City is eligible for a maximum of 4 stars only. Again, this is upon assuming the build is same, because there is no evidence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pixantz View Post
2. Exactly. That's what Im saying. You missed the first paragraph of my post I guess.... Only Honda can explain. Everybody is stumped here
Not what I understood from your previous post. But fair enough. Thanks for the reply.
CrAzY dRiVeR is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 28th August 2016, 09:41   #529
Team-BHP Support
 
Vid6639's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 13,764
Thanked: 16,897 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
1. Kindly explain with any factual evidence how Honda had better safety than the 'loaded cars'? We don't have safety ratings for most cars from either brands and it is the Hyundai that offered dual disk brakes, 4 airbags etc in their cars. Honda still hasn't even made airbags and ABS standard on all of their cars!
In terms of safety kit, Honda in the older days was the class leader. There was no variant of the older gen City without ABS or airbags. Even the corporate edition with black interiors had ABS and twin airbags. Same case with the Jazz as well, even the lower Jazz trim levels had airbags and ABS.

With the Brio, Amaze, Mobilio they started going on this no safety path.

And the older City was seriously far superior than the competition which is why it did so well.
Vid6639 is offline   (10) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 2nd September 2016, 11:34   #530
Distinguished - BHPian
 
RavenAvi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Flying Around
Posts: 4,103
Thanked: 16,389 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Overdrive reports that Honda is working on an all-new seven-seater compact SUV which will be unveiled at the sixth Philippine International Motor Show (PIMS) on September 14-18, 2016, at the World Trade Center Metro in Manila.

Developed by Honda's R&D facility in Thailand, this all-new compact SUV will cater primarily to the Asian markets and will be a practical, budget-friendly offering with 3 rows of seats, yet will come with spacious interiors and best-in-class safety features.

If Honda decides to bring this to India too (to grab a share of the ever-growing compact SUV crossover pie), it is speculated to be positioned in a lower segment than the Honda BR-V and go up against the likes of the Ford EcoSport, the Maruti-Suzuki Vitara Brezza and the Mahindra TUV300.

Quote:
Honda states that the seven-seater SUV will answer the needs of practicality and functionality, and will be a budget-friendly offering which will not compromise on design and features. From the official statement it is clear that the upcoming SUV will be positioned in the entry-level range.

The highlight of the new SUV will be its rugged design, higher ground clearance and stylish alloys, mentions Honda in its official statement. The company also claims that the new SUV will have a spacious cabin with seven seats in a three-row seating arrangement. It will also come with the best-in-class safety features, claims Honda.
RavenAvi is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 2nd September 2016, 11:44   #531
Distinguished - BHPian
 
smartcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,246
Thanked: 4,782 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
If Honda decides to bring this to India too (to grab a share of the ever-growing compact SUV crossover pie), it is speculated to be positioned in a lower segment than the Honda BR-V and go up against the likes of the Ford EcoSport, the Maruti-Suzuki Vitara Brezza and the Mahindra TUV300.
This part doesn't make sense. Honda BR-V is already competing with the likes of Ecosport, Brezza and TUV300 - since the entry level BR-V starts at Rs. 10 lacs on road. BR-V is already a "budget" offering. I wonder how much lower they can go.

There is room for a 7 seater SUV based on the Jazz platform for Asian markets though.
smartcat is online now   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 08:13   #532
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: --
Posts: 7,767
Thanked: 10,660 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Honda -ARV is the next experiment from Honda to crack the C/SUV segment?

Honda India : The Way Forward-honda4metrecompactsuvrear.jpg

Quote:
Targeted at the Asian market, the new sub compact SUV can be based on the Jazz platform. Styling will be similar to that of the CRV and BRV to keep the family look. Rear view of the BRV was one of the better angles on the car, so expect something similar, on a smaller scale.
To be shown at the Philippines Auto show shortly.

Source

Last edited by volkman10 : 15th September 2016 at 08:17.
volkman10 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 08:57   #533
Distinguished - BHPian
 
vb-san's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: S'pore/Thrissur
Posts: 4,459
Thanked: 3,084 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Honda -ARV is the next experiment from Honda to crack the C/SUV segment?
Isn't that the picture of a Honda Vezel?
vb-san is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 11:12   #534
Distinguished - BHPian
 
RavenAvi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Flying Around
Posts: 4,103
Thanked: 16,389 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by vb-san View Post
Isn't that the picture of a Honda Vezel?
That's a picture of the Honda HR-V, taken in Australia.

The new 7-seater compact SUV, to be unveiled at the 2016 PIMS, is supposedly based on the HR-V.
RavenAvi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 11:26   #535
Distinguished - BHPian
 
smartcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,246
Thanked: 4,782 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
That's a picture of the Honda HR-V, taken in Australia.

The new 7-seater compact SUV, to be unveiled at the 2016 PIMS, is supposedly based on the HR-V.
Honda unveiled a new 7 seater compact SUV at PIMS allright. It looks like this -

Name:  WhatsAppImage20160914at9.49.27AM.jpg
Views: 1020
Size:  86.7 KB


http://www.carbay.ph/en/car-news/hon...-2016-21158534
smartcat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 11:32   #536
Distinguished - BHPian
 
RavenAvi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Flying Around
Posts: 4,103
Thanked: 16,389 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
Honda unveiled a new 7 seater compact SUV at PIMS allright. It looks like this
I saw that. The BR-V was on the list of Honda unveils for PIMS already.

This particular mini-compact SUV has been developed specifically by their Thai R&D facility. It's supposedly smaller than the BR-V, yet has enough space to seat 7, and is based on the HR-V.

It will be Honda's smallest entry-level SUV (could be sub-4m), and will break cover at the PIMS.
RavenAvi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 11:47   #537
Distinguished - BHPian
 
smartcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,246
Thanked: 4,782 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

I seriously doubt the accuracy of the last Overdrive article (7 seater CSUV positioned below BRV) and this latest indiancarbikes.in article (sub-4m CSUV). However, a Jazz Cross launch cannot be ruled out.

I hope I don't have to eat the my own words - but PIMS is already underway, and its unlikely Honda will pop something out of the hat in last 2 days of the event.
smartcat is online now   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 11:49   #538
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: --
Posts: 7,767
Thanked: 10,660 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
I However, a Jazz Cross launch cannot be ruled out.
CUV based on Jazz is the WR-V, coming in later part of 2016!

Link

Last edited by volkman10 : 15th September 2016 at 11:50.
volkman10 is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 12:45   #539
BHPian
 
Vigkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 601
Thanked: 974 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Too many RVs from Honda. I do not understand the thought process of a company like Honda. I definitely do not think they understand the market. Honda was never aggressive enough to open up with a new segment like Toyota with Innova or Renault with Duster or Ford with Ecosport or even Mahindra with XUV 5OO. When they saw the CSUV market open up, they had to get a pie.

What did they have?

They have a competent high quality vehicle HR-V / Vezel based on the Jazz platform - the same platform used for City also.
They have a market that has opened up for expensive - but feature rich CSUV like Creta.
They have an excellent 1.5 L petrol i-Vtec and a decent 1.5 L diesel i-Dtec.
They have competent auto boxes - a modern CVT and a traditional 5 speed Torque converters - either of which can be mated to the i-Vtec readily.

What do they do?

They spend all the money and effort to build a pseudo-SUV BR-V - which is a re-skinned and slightly modded Mobilio - which the market had rejected outright.

Why Honda Why?

Did they try to be aggressive and create a 7 seater CSUV at the price range of crossovers? But Brio platform was never wide enough to seat 3 comfortably in the rear. Milking it too much will not pay much. Too late - but I wish they have realized it at least now.

With Creta selling so well and having set the base, it will be VERY VERY tough for HR-V / Vezel to beat it or come close - if and when it comes to India. Especially with Honda slowly and steadily losing its fan base - myself included.
Vigkey is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th September 2016, 14:21   #540
Distinguished - BHPian
 
vb-san's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: S'pore/Thrissur
Posts: 4,459
Thanked: 3,084 Times
Default Re: Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by RavenAvi View Post
That's a picture of the Honda HR-V, taken in Australia.
Isn’t the Vezel and HR-V the same? Here in Singapore the Thailand made HR-V is sold via authorized dealer, and parallel importers get the Japan made Vezel – and the latter is selling in big numbers.

-----------

But really, why should Honda look to bring something smaller than the BR-V and pack 7 seats into that? IMO, they should really try and bring in the HR-V and Civic and stop trying luck with the super low cost models.
vb-san is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Nissan India : The Way Forward GTO The Indian Car Scene 149 29th November 2016 14:06
Volkswagen India: The Way Forward vb-san The Indian Car Scene 361 23rd November 2016 08:35
Honda JAZZ, FEB-2010 Sales 233. What's the way Forward for HONDA ? sanagg1 The Indian Car Scene 378 10th October 2010 16:03


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 00:01.

Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks