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Old 1st August 2011, 19:41   #46
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by pradkumar View Post
The Manza CS is next to impossible. The current length of Vista is 3795 mm. What can they do with 15 cm? Beyond 15 cm, the length will go above 4 metres and cannot qualify for the 10% excise duty of small cars (instead of 22% for large cars).

The length of the older Indica was only 3690 mm, which gave them lot of room to create a compact sedan.
Not sure how did you arrive at the theory of "MANZA CS IMPOSSIBLE". I agree with the part that the Vista is longer than Indica. Since the CS job is not about adding a boot to the car without altering the dimension, I don't understand why is it impossible.

And you have mentioned that older Indica which is 10 cm shorter than Vista gave TATA a "lot of room" to design CS. Frankly can't really find much sense in that line!

And Vista is way too spacious for a hatch [I am 6'2" and was dumbstruck about the space I had in rear even after pushing the driver's seat all the way back]. If they want to create a CS version, they could minimize that space and create a CS which will still be spacious enough. Not an issue at all. Also they can re-design the hatch and still create a boot on it. I don't think its an issue at all.

Last edited by swiftnfurious : 1st August 2011 at 19:43.
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Old 1st August 2011, 20:29   #47
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Not sure how did you arrive at the theory of "MANZA CS IMPOSSIBLE". I agree with the part that the Vista is longer than Indica. Since the CS job is not about adding a boot to the car without altering the dimension, I don't understand why is it impossible..
Could someone please explain to me how the concept of Compact Sedan actually works?? is it that they put a boot on the hatch by just changing the rear, if so then why was nt Maruti able to do it to swift for so long??
I have been thinking about thi for so long that now my head hearts
why was Maruti unable to make a CS for so long??
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Old 1st August 2011, 22:08   #48
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by kaks15 View Post
Could someone please explain to me how the concept of Compact Sedan actually works?? is it that they put a boot on the hatch by just changing the rear, if so then why was nt Maruti able to do it to swift for so long??
I have been thinking about thi for so long that now my head hearts
why was Maruti unable to make a CS for so long??
I believe you understand that the CS versions are done to make use of the lesser duty & savings by bringing the car under 4m with 1.2L petrol or 1.4L diesel engines.

Now the CS will need to have a different metal / body frame other than hatches and the boot is not "just welded" onto a hatch as far as I know.

Dzire never really had a proper competitor to take away the sales and hence they didn't bother to bring in a CS version. They enjoyed the premium paid by the customer. In addition to this, Dzire is not very spacious too. But with the launch of Etios, the competition has grown and Maruti is clear about Etios eating in to its Dzire sales and hence they are trying to bring in a CS version to take on the Etios.
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Old 1st August 2011, 22:22   #49
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by kaks15 View Post
Could someone please explain to me how the concept of Compact Sedan actually works?? is it that they put a boot on the hatch by just changing the rear, if so then why was nt Maruti able to do it to swift for so long??
I have been thinking about thi for so long that now my head hearts
why was Maruti unable to make a CS for so long??
With dezire Maruti had their line running at full capacity, unless they saw/predicted a stiff challenge to their model, they didnt need to change any thing in it. with additional variants they only create a additional backlog of orders for a particular model assembly line. So there was no need for company to introduce CS version of dezire.

As for indica and indigo CS versions there is space liberated by sloping rear windows. (indigo has more slanted rear window where as hatch has more vertical rear window) I believe that roof length might be short in CS versions giving space for slanted rear window and better integration of boot
so I believe that Vista or manza CS might be possible on same lines
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Old 1st August 2011, 23:25   #50
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Now the CS will need to have a different metal / body frame other than hatches and the boot is not "just welded" onto a hatch as far as I know.

Dzire never really had a proper competitor to take away the sales and hence they didn't bother to bring in a CS version.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drsnt View Post
As for indica and indigo CS versions there is space liberated by sloping rear windows. (indigo has more slanted rear window where as hatch has more vertical rear window) I believe that roof length might be short in CS versions giving space for slanted rear window and better integration of boot
so I believe that Vista or manza CS might be possible on same lines
Like to share a few things here.
As swiftnfurious there is no welding together of boot to hatchback to get a CS version. The side body (as it is called) is a single piece which is welded together with other parts to form the chassis.

The side profile is changed to suit the aerodynamics i.e for the easy flow of air.Also the height also is changed to restrict the turbulence and improve the aerodynamics.This applies to the height of the bumper as well.

I am sure there are many other factors also that are considered. ]
Perhaps our fellow bhpians can throw some light

Last edited by figo_mba : 1st August 2011 at 23:28.
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Old 2nd August 2011, 00:05   #51
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

Quote:
Originally Posted by pradkumar View Post
The Manza CS is next to impossible. The current length of Vista is 3795 mm. What can they do with 15 cm? Beyond 15 cm, the length will go above 4 metres and cannot qualify for the 10% excise duty of small cars (instead of 22% for large cars).

The length of the older Indica was only 3690 mm, which gave them lot of room to create a compact sedan.

Pradeep
My dear pal you are getting me wrong.

As you say that the current Vista is 3795 mm long so that gives 205 mm (= 20.5 cm) more than the Vista to reach the 4000 mm mark which means that TATA's engineers still have some scope to design a CS version of the Indigo Manza or a similar kind based on it which in my opinion would look better than the already ugly looking MSIL Swift Dzire (no offense meant).

P.S: The current Indigo CS is 3988 mm in length with a good 380 litres of boot space (but its design looks such that the boot was abruptly cut off).
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Old 2nd August 2011, 11:31   #52
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

Some questions on Indica Vista -
If TATA wanted to target customers pole apart than taxy operators , why did they retained the same name Indica for Vista ? , Why the exterior appearance resembles to that of Indica? , What made them not to go for far better looking designs like i20 , Jazz etc...?
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Old 2nd August 2011, 11:36   #53
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramesh View Post
Some questions on Indica Vista -
If TATA wanted to target customers pole apart than taxy operators , why did they retained the same name Indica for Vista ? , Why the exterior appearance resembles to that of Indica? , What made them not to go for far better looking designs like i20 , Jazz etc...?
Well, the assumptions are, because

1. Indica was their first passenger vehicle and brought a fortune for the company

2. Probably they wanted to retain the resemblences of their best selling vehicle [Indica] so that people recognised Vista as a sibling.

But a lot of guess that these two moves really back fired than helping in the sales of the car.
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Old 2nd August 2011, 12:42   #54
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by drsnt View Post
is there any chances that Vista might come with 90HP multijet. I remember reading on this forum that it's might be on card?
also any inside info on launch of Manza CS?
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Originally Posted by Mark 5 View Post
By giving such a facelift to the the Vista (which looks like the Manza's boot has been chopped off!), TATA is seriously digging the grave for the Vista.

They should have designed something new for the the Vista rather than just copy-paste the front looks of the Manza and keep the rear same (ETIOS-LIVA strategy?).

On the other hand Manza CS is coming you say? Then that's a good news rather and a fitting replacement to the existing Indigo CS I say (If Manza CS is true then Dzire CS will have some stiff competition!).
Quote:
Originally Posted by pradkumar View Post
The Manza CS is next to impossible. The current length of Vista is 3795 mm. What can they do with 15 cm? Beyond 15 cm, the length will go above 4 metres and cannot qualify for the 10% excise duty of small cars (instead of 22% for large cars).

The length of the older Indica was only 3690 mm, which gave them lot of room to create a compact sedan.

Pradeep
Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Not sure how did you arrive at the theory of "MANZA CS IMPOSSIBLE". I agree with the part that the Vista is longer than Indica. Since the CS job is not about adding a boot to the car without altering the dimension, I don't understand why is it impossible.
According to Autocar sources, the Manza CS is coming in 2012. I dont know exactly how they are achieving it but the report on the manza CS in the july 2011 issue of Autocar magazine says that the car will share the wheelbase with the current Manza with the cheaper interiors of the vista. Thereby saving more money on top of the tax savings. Which will translate hopefully to a very attractive price tag.

Other CS models coming (According to autocar) are as follows:

1) VW Up Saloon 2013-14
2) Honda brio Saloon 2013
3) Swift desire 2012 (the new desire will only come as a CS and not a full sized one)
4) Mahindra Verito CS 2011-12.

(All info sourced from Autocar india, Pg 58-59, vol 12, no 11, July 2011)

Last edited by amrisharm : 2nd August 2011 at 12:45.
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Old 2nd August 2011, 12:53   #55
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

[COLOR=black]Chrome lined grille from its cousin Manza looks ridiculous. Instead of improving Tata Motors seem to dig deeper into a hole with these kinds of modification. It is suggested they develop better marketing campaign & tactics rather than doing mindless modifications.[/COLOR]
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Old 3rd August 2011, 16:53   #56
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

New update. Car starts shipping from next week. Available for booking from tomorrow. I am transferring my Vista Aura ABS to Vista VX (it now comes in 4 variants, LS, LX, VX and ZX). Pricing is not out yet, will keep you all posted.

Reasons for choosing this Vs the Aura ABS were:

1. Stay Current
2. Really like the steering mounted controls and ORVMs controls
3. chromification (being an old bullet guy, any more chrome is good for me )
4. I am hoping i will like the new interiors
5. Supposed to have lower vibration levels, cannot comment before i try!

I am disappointed however that it doesn't come in Black!!!
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Old 3rd August 2011, 18:59   #57
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

ICB has posted an report (source Hormazd Sorabjee) that the new Vista is expected in the next week. Here is the link:

Tata Indica Vista facelift coming next week! | IndianCarsBikes.in

The diesel mill is now rated 90 BHP (VGT... I suppose) & there are some changes in interiors & exteriors. Liva & Swift have made Tata act lively & swiftly.
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Old 3rd August 2011, 19:07   #58
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

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Originally Posted by bigvishnu View Post
New update. Car starts shipping from next week. Available for booking from tomorrow. I am transferring my Vista Aura ABS to Vista VX (it now comes in 4 variants, LS, LX, VX and ZX). Pricing is not out yet, will keep you all posted.
Is the car out in the showroom? Any changes to the engine?

Last edited by safari_lover : 3rd August 2011 at 19:08.
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Old 3rd August 2011, 19:27   #59
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

Autocar India says TATA may be considering a race-ready version of the Indica Vista with the FIAT 1.4 TJet engine!

Hopefully, this news is true and it is a road car which is race-ready with a few mods.

EDIT: 90bhp diesel for Vista? Should be a nice gentleman's express-hatch-on-a-budget!

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 3rd August 2011 at 19:32.
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Old 3rd August 2011, 20:52   #60
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Default Re: 2011 Tata Indica Vista face-lift Caught Testing

if the 90 bhp version or T-Jet is plonked into this car, it will need stiffer suspension to handle all those extra power & body roll. The current Vista's suspension is tuned to comfort more than handling and the body roll is evident. Imagine the same car getting more power. I really hope Maruti takes a cue from this and launch the 90 HP Swift.
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