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Old 6th July 2011, 10:51   #16
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Thanks for the update Sid, all were waiting for this confirmed date only. I'll contact my dealer as thinking about replacing my A-Star soon. Need to decide between verna fluidic and fiesta. somehow the new fiesta is not a looker like Verna, but this is just my personal view.
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:01   #17
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Quote:
Originally Posted by gshanky View Post
Inspite of all the reasoning and add the performance of the sold ARIAs on the ground, the sales are just not picking up. So, the reason for bad sales could be the combination of the following

1) Higher price - as in the price itself is not higher. But relatively the consumer does not want to spend Rs. 14-17 lakhs for a TATA vehicle

2) The looks of ARIA does not differentiate much from Innova inspite of TML positioning ARIA as a crossover

3) AWD is not really considered important to justify a lakh and half more

4) The consumer is still hungover with the brand value of Toyota and considers TML as just a vfm vehicle maker

TML could have aggressively marketed the product from now until the festival season, but chose to go with the cheaper variant instead. However knowing that the pure variant was never launched, launching the 4X2 variant now after launching the 4X4 variants seem like some sales/marketing strategy gone bad.
Agree with your reasons. But it is clear that TML wants to position the Aria as a premium vehicle and not a cheap one. Even with the upcoming 4x2 versions they are positioning the Aria as more of a premium MUV rather than a cheaper alternative to the Innova.
BTW, I see lot of ads on TV/print/net for the Aria, these days, mainly concentrating on the features. Could well be the build up to the launch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
Well, Life's not fair

none of the Tata higher end cars are selling well. I am afraid just 1L less is not enough to entice anyone going for a Toyota to look at Tata. Mahindra tried that with Xylo, and they actually are a better selling brand compared to Tata when it comes to 10L+ SUVs.
It is clear from the reviews so far, from the owners and even the magazines that the Aria is a much better product vis-a-vis the Innova. The only problem people saw was in the price. Now TML is addressing/correcting this. Let's wait for some time before declaring it is not enough or people won't buy the Aria for Innova!
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:10   #18
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
It is clear from the reviews so far, from the owners and even the magazines that the Aria is a much better product vis-a-vis the Innova. The only problem people saw was in the price. Now TML is addressing/correcting this. Let's wait for some time before declaring it is not enough or people won't buy the Aria for Innova!
But why can't TML make their products a bit lighter hence more efficient and reliable? They themselves know that and thus are afraid to mention kerb wait of their vehicles.

Personally I would have bought Safari had it been lighter by 300Kg than the current one.
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:38   #19
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

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Originally Posted by MAS View Post
The launch of 4 x 2 Aria was expected. Tata seems to have missed out the bus once again with this small reduction in prices.
Since when has a 1.5L reduction become a "small reduction in prices"? The 60k price cut in the over-priced and under-featured Honda City was much feted, and this is more than double that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by gshanky View Post
1) Higher price - as in the price itself is not higher.

However knowing that the pure variant was never launched, launching the 4X2 variant now after launching the 4X4 variants seem like some sales/marketing strategy gone bad.
As safari_lover stated, they were positioning the Aria as a premium vehicle, and took the low sales on the chin. Now that the brand image is built, they've cut prices just enough to entice new buyers who couldn't afford the original 4x4 models away from the Innova by highlighting the strengths: safety and features.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
Well, Life's not fair
Neither is business, and we'll have to wait and see if this is good business strategy or turns out bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
Agree with your reasons. But it is clear that TML wants to position the Aria as a premium vehicle and not a cheap one.

It is clear from the reviews so far, from the owners and even the magazines that the Aria is a much better product vis-a-vis the Innova. The only problem people saw was in the price. Now TML is addressing/correcting this. Let's wait for some time before declaring it is not enough or people won't buy the Aria for Innova!


Maybe not as good in handling as the Innova, but certainly comfortable and well built. But the biggest hurdle is convincing people that Tata can match Toyota in A.S.S. That's something they'll have to show rather than preach.

Ps. Very interested in the pricing of the new Fiesta!!
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:47   #20
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
Let's wait for some time before declaring it is not enough or people won't buy the Aria for Innova!
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeluM View Post
Neither is business, and we'll have to wait and see if this is good business strategy or turns out bad.
Thats of course the obvious part, we will know soon enough if the 1.5 Lacs is sufficient or not. I feel its not, you two feel it is, we can agree to disagree. We will know in 2 months
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Old 6th July 2011, 11:52   #21
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

At 1.5 lak less just for the removal of 4 wheel drive system makes a lot of sense to the majority of the buyers. It should be lighter more fuel efficient and better handling than the 4x4 version. Since there will be no front wheel axle the steering also will be lighter. I have driven the 4x4 varient at 150 kmph and the straight line stability and NVH levels were so good it doesnt feel like a TATA at all!
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Old 6th July 2011, 12:32   #22
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajay0612 View Post
But why can't TML make their products a bit lighter hence more efficient and reliable? They themselves know that and thus are afraid to mention kerb wait of their vehicles.

Personally I would have bought Safari had it been lighter by 300Kg than the current one.
Agree with you. They need to send their vehicles through a weight reduction course I think all of their vehicles are heaviest in their respective segments!!
Having said that, IIRC, the Aria was already about 300Kg lighter than the Safari, and now with the removal of All Whell Drive it will weigh lesser.

BTW, may be the next Safari/Merlin will meet your requirement of 300 Kg less in weight

Last edited by safari_lover : 6th July 2011 at 12:34.
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Old 6th July 2011, 14:13   #23
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Tata must do a brave price correction on ARIA across the variants.
1.5L for 4x2 is too little given the base version doesnot sport alloy wheels and other lack of features of middle and higher variants.

What is Uniquely special now about Tata's ARIA 4x2 in comparison with Toyota's Innova? this will be the first question as the significator feature 4x4 is removed.

It is an opportunity to place base ARIA 4x2 with competitive pricing to let it play a effective MUV competition with Innova and earn decent volume selling.

Common TATA, don't do a pricing blunder on 4x2 ARIA like the bad interior+features blunder to kill the Grande!
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Old 6th July 2011, 14:40   #24
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

One of the major reasons why Tata vehicles are comparably heavier is because of their high crash safety standards they maintain. If I remember correctly, when I saw the first ever review of the Safari in Auto India (late 90s!!) I remember reading that each of the twin side impact bars on the door weighs nearly 9kgs!!!

No other Indian manufacturer are so stubborn when it comes to this topic, something which Mahindra struggled with the Scorpio especially the disappointing crash test in Australia and followed by their struggles to certify the Scorpio for the US.

Ladder frame chassis do not absorb and dissipate energy as well as a monocoque thus needing additional bulk. The X2 platform was designed to meet far higher safety standards than the Safari and also the Aria is wider, longer, better equipped than the former. Yet its approximately 200 kgs lighter. Take a comparable ladder frame 4x4 UV from any of the competitors stables Fortuner, Pathfinder, Endeavor, they all fall in a similar weight range.

While we all know and repeat the stories of Tata quality one area where they don't skimp is the most important and primary safety feature of a car, a Strong Structure. Kudos to them for that.
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Old 6th July 2011, 14:41   #25
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

I don't think the launch of 4x2 Aria is going to help its sales. The Aria just doesn't have the brand value or the product appeal. I think Tata should have instead come out with a C segment car pitted against the Verna, Vento, Fiesta etc and priced it lower than the competition. It made much more sense especially with the Fiat MJD in hand.

I hate the rear bumper of the Fiesta. Autopsyche, please come to the rescue.
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Old 6th July 2011, 14:59   #26
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

The Aria actually uses many weight reduction techniques it ends up again close to the Safari 4X4 wt due to the added technology and features - 6 air bags for example are not really as light as air There is such a lot of this stuff in the Aria that it all adds to wt be it the 17" alloys, the all leather seats, the satnav, the reverse camera, the sensors, the really thick and multiple layers of sound insulation etc. The 4X2 will ofcourse be lighter.

The main thing is that inspite of the wt it corners and pulls really well.

Though it is great to own one, at times like this wish I could comment seemingly more neutrally without having that tag.

Think this is a good move by TATA. Yes TATA would love the numbers but it also wants the correct image, and atleast that aspect is getting take care of well with the Aria. The numbers are better this month and they have relaunched their advt. campaign so lets see. The Safari too was not a hit from the start and it is the 2.2 dicore version that has sold the best. It sells lesser than the Scoprio but then variant to variant it also cost about 1L more on a landed cost basis.
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Old 6th July 2011, 15:12   #27
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Quote:
Originally Posted by shortbread View Post
Take a comparable ladder frame 4x4 UV from any of the competitors stables Fortuner, Pathfinder, Endeavor, they all fall in a similar weight range.
Kerb weight Data suggests otherwise:
Tata Aria - 2160Kg (Pride variant)
Fortuner - 1955Kg
Endeavour - 2014Kg (even though it is longer and has much more powerful engine)
Innova - 1675Kg (Top variant)

Quote:
While we all know and repeat the stories of Tata quality one area where they don't skimp is the most important and primary safety feature of a car, a Strong Structure. Kudos to them for that.
One does not need to use iron bars to impart strength. There are lighter alloys which can do better job :-). IMO the excessive weight is primarily the result of inefficient design.
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Old 6th July 2011, 15:20   #28
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

I have read every one point of views on the Aria, Before its launched. After Official Review As well as various ownership reviews.

One point is for sure, this is a great car without many niggles.
The sales are low but as per the market expected by a 15lac + car in india.
Now would it not make sense for Tata to better the product rather then devalue their product?
I mean, improve all the gaps consistency, better the quality standards on parts used, better the steering feel, improve the driving dynamic & ergonomics. But keep the price unchanged.
That would actually build the TATA brand rather then reducing the price and taking a few things off a good car...

The Aria is a beautiful car, just a bit higher priced for the complete package. Hence improve the package and the price becomes VFM...

Last edited by rajchetan : 6th July 2011 at 15:24.
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Old 6th July 2011, 16:46   #29
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

@ Ajay 0612,

We are comparing this with manufacturers who have been in the game far longer than Tata. But I do agree they are 5-10% lighter (except for the Nissan), albeit the Innova is smaller and does not have a 4x4 drivetrain. That said it is progress from the Safari days. Name an Indian manufacturer who can pull of the same?!!

Its not iron they use, its steel. No doubt there are lighter alloys, why there's even carbon fiber. But at what cost, how many consumers are willing to shell out more money cause the company uses weight saving materials?!!
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Old 6th July 2011, 16:55   #30
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Default Re: Tata Aria 4X2 launch next week; Fiesta launch on July 10th

Weight management would be no longer a problem as Jaguar uses aluminium chassis and has the know-how to help Tata in this regard as well. They need to make a tight chassis without adding to the bulk.
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