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Old 21st September 2011, 10:22   #31
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

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Originally Posted by Sutripta View Post
Hi,
So what is the truth about why this plan (Porsche taking over VW) was hatched, and by whom?

Regards
Sutripta
Here is a quote from FT.com / In depth - Volkswagen / Porsche For those interested, this article and other links unravel the whole story.

"The benefits of the Porsche merger, to be completed next year, may accrue disproportionately to Porsche’s controlling families – of whom Ferdinand Pich, VW chairman, is a member." - 2010

So both companies are controlled by the "Porche Family", and for all you know this may be a consolidation effort by two public listed companies.
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Old 21st September 2011, 21:37   #32
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

^^^
Unable to read the article as it requires registration.

So what does the FT article say regarding the origins of the deal?

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Old 21st September 2011, 22:21   #33
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

I will try to get some excerpts.

FT discourages "cut and paste", and they insert a standard phrase explaining it. The registration is free, so you can register and read the series of articles.
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Old 21st September 2011, 23:18   #34
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

^^^
Registering for one article/ topic? No thanks, I'll pass.

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Old 21st September 2011, 23:55   #35
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

A couple of observations, some may seem irrelevant, but be kind enough to indulge me:

[] A meeting happened between Bernanke & King(FedRes and BkofEngland). Both these gentlemen are hoping and trying for a wee bit of inflation, a tiny wee bit , but inflation nevertheless. Meaning even more tighter money. Meaning higher int rates. Now the consequences of such a development.

[] Leveraged take overs will not make as much competitive sense esp if sales volumes start contracting across the board.

[] Japan is a very closed business environment. They do not accept outsiders with open arms. Assuming VW launches a hostile bid and the Japs close ranks, VW will find it hard it hard to offload their stake in Suzuki and will NOT be able to augment their holding. So it is not as if they r not at risk.

Declining sales volumes. Existing shareholders become hostile. Exit route not all that clear in case one is needed. VW s just talking tough like a typical bully. Pretty daft if one looks at the macro level picture.
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Old 22nd September 2011, 09:25   #36
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

Even if VW take over Suzuki, it will be a disaster as VW can get very heavy handed and may not get the best out of suzuki.Witness BMW takeover of Rover
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Old 22nd September 2011, 23:56   #37
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

whatever, vw group has been a good brand engineer. look at what it has done to skoda and seat. They were not great brands before coming under vw group. On the other hand, for brands like lamborgini and bugatti it has maintained the exclusivity and dna . Audi as a luxury brand , and porsche as a luxury sports brand, all has distinct identity.
infact to non-enthusiast, all are unrelated.

the point is even i such a thing happens-vw takes over suzuki-nothing is going to change by way of their products. Except maybe for vw diesels in suzuki cars. BTW, who cares for suzuki cars except in India and Japan?

Last edited by mxx : 23rd September 2011 at 00:00.
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Old 23rd September 2011, 09:58   #38
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

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whatever, vw group has been a good brand engineer.


They have branded well to make each arm - VW / Seat / Skoda / Lamborghini / Porsche / Audi to look exclusive; distinct and totally un related to one another. Such a success need to be attributed with the Global Major dreams of VW group. They are in a way progressing better compared to the other majors.

Last edited by bblost : 23rd September 2011 at 10:42. Reason: Fixed the quote and removed font tags. Please do not copy paste from other editors. Thanks.
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Old 23rd September 2011, 10:36   #39
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

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Originally Posted by mxx View Post
whatever, vw group has been a good brand engineer. look at what it has done to skoda and seat. They were not great brands before coming under vw group. On the other hand, for brands like lamborgini and bugatti it has maintained the exclusivity and dna . Audi as a luxury brand , and porsche as a luxury sports brand, all has distinct identity.
infact to non-enthusiast, all are unrelated.

the point is even i such a thing happens-vw takes over suzuki-nothing is going to change by way of their products. Except maybe for vw diesels in suzuki cars. BTW, who cares for suzuki cars except in India and Japan?
Agreed 100 % . V W has make sure that what ever brands they acquire continue to work independently as a separate business unit. I guess In Japan also, Majority of the people buy toyota's / Honda's. Would be interesting to see their status In Japanese market wrt to sales
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Old 23rd September 2011, 12:11   #40
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

Well, it appears that life comes to a full circle is true in case of Maruti, considering the fact that VW were the frontrunners at the time the Indian Small car project was planned by Late Mr. Sanjay Gandhi....

Jokes apart, I do not feel that Maruti will loose anything because VW acquiring (as few of the brothers have pointed out), & even Suzuki will also gain in the long run (refer the success of Bugatti, Audi, Seat & all other VW Group companies). To put to rest the fears of all Maruti Suzuki fanboys & shareholders (light hearted banter... please forgive me of you feel offended), the company is big in India because the A.S.S. setup that it built on Govt. of India's shoulders & I believe Indian operations will be a shot in the arm for VW (in its aim of becoming biggest auto manufacturer) if Indian sales of (prospective) subsidiary-Maruti are added to its balance sheet.

Further to dispel fears of some, I believe it would pave way to better bodywork, turbo-petrol engines & even bigger + better diesel engines (as compared to puny 1248cc Fiat derived Multijet) for the Maruti buyers. VW & other group companies can always benefit from parts sharing, shared manufacturing facilities, common suppliers & widest A.S.S..

Probably this would help selling a bigger Suzuki Car/SUV successfully one day.
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Old 23rd September 2011, 19:03   #41
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

It seems the VW-Suzuki drama is heating up. Heres the latest chain of events:
  1. VW claims that Suzuki violated their tie-up agreement by sourcing engines from rival Fiat.
  2. Suzuki Chairman and CEO Osamu Suzuki sends a letter addressed to VW CEO Martin Winterkorn demanding that the Germans retract the statement, gives a deadline of SEPT-30 to do so . He says ‘VW's notice and press release hinder our effort to develop attractive new products and significantly disparage Suzuki's HONOR’.
  3. Suzuki claims it consulted VW about buying Fiat diesel engines in January and both parties accepted it at the time. Suzuki says it turned to Fiat after engines offered by VW failed to meet Suzuki's ‘specifications’. Suzuki also claims it was denied access to much of VW's technology, despite earlier expectations for technology sharing.
  4. VW responds to the letter saying that Suzuki's complaints that its honor has been breached were ‘Theatrical’. VW repeated that Suzuki has to ‘Correct’ the alleged contract violation due to its purchase of diesel engines from Fiat.
  5. VW has said it doesn't plan to sell or reduce its stake in Suzuki. The German company has offered no comments on rumors of taking over Suzuki.
The squabbling looks more childish than some of the ones we have on Tbhp forums!!

sources:
http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...309229870/1271
http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...110929948/1317
Suzuki demands VW retract accusation - FT.com

@ Sutripta,

The VW takeover plan was hatched by Wiedeking and Harter, Porsche's CEO and CFO respectively. It also had the blessing of Wolfgang Porsche. The plan arises from the fact that Porsche was a niche player and did not have sufficient volumes to develop future technologies/platforms (hybrids, SUVs etc...). They would be safer being a part of VW than a vulnerable independent company!!

If you are interested in reading about this heres the best article I could find -
International Business Review - Wharton Business School - The Porsche VW Saga

Last edited by shortbread : 23rd September 2011 at 19:05.
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Old 23rd September 2011, 21:50   #42
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

^^^
Thanks for the link.
What happened to Harter?
What is the opposite of a pyrrhic victory?

Regards
Sutripta

Last edited by Sutripta : 23rd September 2011 at 21:53.
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Old 23rd September 2011, 22:17   #43
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

Harter left with Wiedeking in July'09 and received a goodbye cheque of 12.5 mill Euros!!
I believe both of them are presently undergoing investigation by German authorities for market manipulation and credit fraud relating to the failed VW take over attempt.
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Old 24th September 2011, 13:42   #44
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

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Jokes apart, I do not feel that Maruti will loose anything.
Don't know about that but i can tell you for sure that the biggest gainer if this takeover happens, will be HYUNDAI-India!!
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Old 24th September 2011, 15:58   #45
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Default Re: VW could buy Suzuki outright!!

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Don't know about that but i can tell you for sure that the biggest gainer if this takeover happens, will be HYUNDAI-India!!
I partially disagree with you, & this is why I posted that Maruti Suzuki will be the biggest gainer. The reason for this are two fold - firstly, Maruti authorised dealers are double the nearest competitors & there is an even bigger gap when it comes to A.S.S.. Secondly, Hyundai cars are not considered good handlers (this may not be a big factor back North, where I live, but, as we move Southwards, the enthusiasts are not a happy lot with Hyundais' handling).

This is where a bigger diesel engines in a SX4, GV & Kizashi (& not a one size fits all approach) can matter & draw customers to Maruti Suzuki dealerships.

However, I do agree that Hyundai is the biggest gainer in the last past decade mainly at cost of Maruti, primarily because of reluctance of Suzuki management to introduce new-gen powertrains & models in India. Take the example of Santro which was launched when Zen (carb) was the must have car for middle class, & the former easily got past the latter because of its advanced MPFI engines, power-steering on all models, tall-boy design (that liberated more room & obviously boot-space), goodies & other nick-nacks. By the time MPFI Zen was launched, it was too late, tastes had changed & the performance of the older carb Zen was still better over the MPFI Zen, not to forget the not so impressive facelift of the Zen.
I fear that the addictive shove/ push that drivers got in old diesel Swift, which is not so prominent in new Swift & the mere Rs.50K difference of i20 may drive customers to i20. & one must not forget that there are other cars like Figo, Vista, Polo, Punto, etc. as well.

Overall, the situation is not at all gloomy for Maruti in any scenario because of the fan following.
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