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Old 7th October 2011, 20:16   #16
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram_hyundai View Post
I would rate both MSIL and HMIL on the same band.
The difference between HMIL & MSIL is the way they treat the customers and their attitude towards addresing a customer's complaints.

With HMIL, if you keep raising a concern(i.e steering rattle), they question your sanity!!!! If you complain about poor service quality & worksmanship of the workshop,instead of investigating and looking into the matter, they say you are causing "jhik jhik"!!! The RO works hand in hand with the workshop to hide their workshop's faults and mischiefs. Look into my i20 thread, any lay man can understand the sort of "crimes" the Hyundai Junagadh workshop committed on my car, the car is still struggling with issues because of it!!!! The RO chaps, inspite of their high qualifications, fail to see this.

In case you think mine is an off case, a similar case existed in Vapi. An i20 CRDI came in with repeated rattle complaints to them. Like me, the RO chaps called him a mental case!!!!! The chaps in the RO were avoiding his calls, he then called them from a PCO and guess what? They answered. I really don't want to comment on the kind of firing the RO fellow got after that. Tired of this, he sold off his i20 and bought a Punto and he is quite happy with it.

When I escalated the matter further with Hyundai offices in Mumbai, New Delhi and TN, even they chose to keep mum, not bothering to respond. They even failed to respond when I reported them about the EPS failure in my car. Now they are even failing to respond to the consumer court!!!!!

Then Hyundai came up secretly with a circular to replace steering parts in i10s and i20s( as proved in wildon's thread here on team-bhp).

MSIL has in the past told workshops to take a hike when repeated complaints against them came up. But with Hyundai, it is too much to expect. They will always side with the workshop even if you prove the workshop's misdeeds to them. I could write about the kind of pasting the maruti workshop in Junagadh got from MSIL RO when they had messed up the paint job in the door of our old Swift. But then what is the point, Hyundai will always remain Hyundai - Arrogance personified. They will always blame the customer for the workshop's problems. They will never realise that it is because of the customer that they exist.

Last edited by skanchan95 : 7th October 2011 at 20:27.
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Old 7th October 2011, 20:40   #17
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

My Rankings would be thus :-
Positive
  1. Maruti - Its no mean achievement to sale so many cars every year with consistent A.S.S and little or no niggles . A monstrous task well done- in many ways they remain the benchmark for reliability and hassle free ownership
  2. Hyundai - Hats off to Hyundai . It managed to make a huge dent into Maruti's market share based on reliability and after sales
  3. Honda - Heard loads of good feedback on it - may not be cheap or omni present like Maruti's but makes good cars supported by very efficient service.
  4. Toyota - Good for the cars where they make moolah but Etios has seeded the first doubts . The Etios owners experience of A.S.S has been plain nonsensical and quite a few experience of not-so-hassle-free ownership are surfacing. So big "T" is not so pious "T" after all
  5. Mahindra - Haven't heard too many complaints about their vehicles or A.S.S . Not top notch but gets the job done without too much of a fuss. My closest friend has a Scorpio and thats the feedback he gave me.
  6. Chevrolet - They had their problems but made serious effort to address it and have addressed it for sure
Unreliable or Not Hassle Free or too premature to opine on
  1. Fiat -standalone or tata supported both had huge issues
  2. Ford - Having seen 2 friends suffer at the hands of Ford A.S.S and selling off their cars prematurely , can't really have positive vibes about the brand. Overpriced spares and rip off service costs are the most commonly heard problems which coupled with niggling problems like the ones being faced by Figos make for scary readings
  3. Nissan - Unproven brand in India , would wait for it to launch a major success and the A.S.S to be stress tested like what has happened to Toyota's before dubbing them as reliable.
  4. Skoda - A.S.S is bad and notorious for it, cars are not known to be unreliable though (DSG apart)
  5. Tata - Reliability of cars , build quality are a big question mark at every price point . A.S.S is passable at the best .
  6. Volkswagen - New entrant , too early to pass a judgement on reliability though service centre guys are still too raw to be even compared with those that you get at a Maruti or Hyundai. Being a VW owner I have had no reason to complain about build quality which I am presuming would translate into hassle free ownership
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Old 8th October 2011, 00:22   #18
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

I think only three brands are clearly the benchmarks .

1] Maruti

2]Hyundai

3]Toyota
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Old 8th October 2011, 00:43   #19
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Firstly, do keep in mind that normal owners need not maintain their car as well as those who appreciate their cars more. Many of my friends are happy with their Audis and Mercedes vehicles. However, many of them are disappointed with their Hondas and Toyota's as well. In fact, I too was disappointed with our Corolla in terms of build quality, but not reliability.

In my opinion, the best are:
- Toyota - Reliable and Hassle Free Yes. Not as solid and well built as a European though. However, they seem to be better with their newer cars in terms of feel.
- Hyundai
- Honda - Our Accord was great when it came to reliability and dependability.

Neutral towards:
- BMW - No hassles as yet so far, but still to prove itself.
- Ford - The odd failure and parts not in stock, but very happy with my experience overall. Car almost as reliable as our old Honda Accord.
- Maruti - The odd report scares me
- Tata - The newer products are a step ahead, and for the VFM they provide, we haven't had much to complain about in our previous Tata cars.
- Fiat - Our experience has been very good with the Siena and Palio. However, the current scenario is quite different.
- Mahindra
AVOID -
- Mercedes: High failure rate
- Skoda: Here's a story - Our Octavia Combi recently went for a service to the best Skoda dealer in Mumbai. Had a few small issues that needed to be fixed: Water entering cabin, broker headlamp washer, lose ashtray cover, loose rubber beadings. It came back after a while and a service, with nothing except for the service and water leak issue attended. Parts were not in stock, but don't worry, the car had to go back again, as the clutch and gearbox broke down the very next day! Also, the car had problems starting, and would shudder and switch off as though the idle rpm was around 300. Came back after a week, and finally went again recently after over a month, when the parts finally came in stock. When a similar issue of no parts happened with the Fiesta, who's factory is located a few states away, the part was there within a week, along with a written apology and notification of arrival mailed to our company.
VW: Not heard too much, except tons of failures on higher end models. Hopefully apart from higher cost of parts, the cheaper siblings should be more reliable due to less technology.
Audi: Have heard a few negatives about premature failure
Mitsubishi: Had a horrible time with our Lancer. Thankfully, our company assigned it to someone else after a year, and replaced it with the Fiesta.

Ironically, the lower down the list you go, there is a trend of more desirable and appealing cars by those manufacturers who have been ranked poorly.

Last edited by lamborghini : 8th October 2011 at 00:47.
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Old 8th October 2011, 10:38   #20
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

The top 3 for me would be

Maruti
Toyota
Hyundai

Maruti has been the staple diet of the family while i was growing up , my first car was and is a Wagon R which is yet to give me any problems beyond punctures.

Hyundai would have been 2nd except for niggling problems that we had in the last 2 years of ownership of the Santro , nothing major but required the car to be taken for being looked at
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Old 8th October 2011, 16:07   #21
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Here is a somewhat related thread : Brand Perceptions (Perception, Price and Looks : The factors that sell a car)

Here's my list (added some brands to your list):
Thanks GTO, for giving reference to the very useful thread on the forum and for immediately adding great value to the thread by
  1. Creating extremely useful categorization of positive, neutral and negative zones
  2. Giving insight on well-known premium brands


Quote:
Originally Posted by parsh View Post
Seriously, why shouldn't this be a part of the existing thread
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-sell-car.html (Perception, Price and Looks : The factors that sell a car)? That way all the aspects and discussions with respect to the brands would stay at one place and indeed this is related to the Brand Perceptions given various aspects.

My list would be quite similar to....
I agree with you parsh, that it's an excellent thread giving a high-level snapshot of perceptions of various brands. At the same time, reliability is just one of the factors that creates brand perception. I feel that this important, yet intangible, brand-specific aspect deserves a greater light under the sun with a dedicated discussion because it otherwise often remains hidden. Most other aspects of car buying decision process - e.g. looks, feel, ergonomics, space, functionality, ride quality, handling, ground clearance, NVH, build quality, features, seating comfort, price etc. etc. - are tangible and can be readily known, seen, felt and/or experienced. Even FE figures get published beforehand and give an idea of likely mileage of the car. But the aspect of long-term reliability and hassle-free ownership can be borne out only after years of ownership. What better place to get the gist of thousands of year of collective conscious ownership experiences than at a dedicated altar of Team-bhp?!

And thanks for sharing your valuable views!

Quote:
Originally Posted by lamborghini View Post
Ironically, the lower down the list you go, there is a trend of more desirable and appealing cars by those manufacturers who have been ranked poorly.
Thanks for sharing your views, lamborghini. Your last observation makes me think if the market, as a collective entity, is quite intelligent and is somehow fully aware of the reliability aspect of most brands, thereby forcing the brands perceived as poor to dish out more to attract the buyers.
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Old 8th October 2011, 17:33   #22
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

My Top 5 best choices.

1. Maruti.
2. Hyundai
3. Tata
4. Ford
5. FIAT.

I have not used a TOYota till date. Are they really so good I wonder.
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Old 8th October 2011, 19:06   #23
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

Quote:
Originally Posted by souravc View Post
Ford - Having seen 2 friends suffer at the hands of Ford A.S.S and selling off their cars prematurely , can't really have positive vibes about the brand. Overpriced spares and rip off service costs are the most commonly heard problems which coupled with niggling problems like the ones being faced by Figos make for scary readings
Well I dont agree to the Overpriced spares and rip off service costs mentioned above. The spare costs are much lower than ever before because majority of the parts are sourced locally. I own a Ford Figo and have had a Swift in the family, so far the service costs for Figo have been lower than that of the Swift for the same period of ownership. Yes I do agree with the niggling issues faced with the Figo.
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Old 8th October 2011, 19:24   #24
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

My Take

Good Service
1. Toyota : I don't own one, but friends who have always mentioned about them in Superlatives
2. Hyundai : timely, precise, respectful and a joy to visit their service centers.
3. Honda: excellent service and reliable cars. I am always surprised that the City is so cheap to maintain and there's hardly any complaints to take to the service centers. The ridiculously low service costs are a joy.

Average Experience
1. FIAT: everyone badmouths the A.S.S - but i found them to be quite OK
2. Maruti : My experience with 800 more than a decade back wasn't good. I am guessing they should have improved much since then. 800 was my first car, and it was a decent car to own in College a decade back - but i never wanted a Maruti since then.

Bad A.S.S
1. Ford: My immediate family had a Ford Escort. Enough to scare me away from Ford for many decades. But now we are giving them another chance as my Bro bought a Fiesta.
2. Skoda: great cars but will never buy them due to horror stories here.

Keenly Looking for Feedback
1. VW?
2. Nissan?
two good brands who can do very well in India if they get their service model in tact.

Last edited by SkyWalker : 8th October 2011 at 19:26.
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Old 8th October 2011, 19:32   #25
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I will take the results with a pinch of salt,on this thread . I have been to FIAT / TATA & Maruti A>S>S and i will rate FIAT better than 2 others . Maruti no doubt is easily available everywhere but i feel success has gone on to their heads with their take it or leave it attitude

people at FIAT has taken care of mine car excellently so far , where i will stay neutral for TATA

Last edited by .sushilkumar : 8th October 2011 at 19:33.
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Old 8th October 2011, 23:00   #26
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

Quote:
Originally Posted by .sushilkumar View Post
I will take the results with a pinch of salt,on this thread . I have been to FIAT / TATA & Maruti A>S>S and i will rate FIAT better than 2 others . Maruti no doubt is easily available everywhere but i feel success has gone on to their heads with their take it or leave it attitude

people at FIAT has taken care of mine car excellently so far , where i will stay neutral for TATA
I agree. I am happy with the service offered by Fiat till this moment. I have been to Hyundai Service too for my Getz. My experience with Fiat Service is way ahead than that of Hyundai.
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Old 8th October 2011, 23:24   #27
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My experience with my present car has been very satisfactory, HMP, Chennai has taken good car of my Elantra GLS. I feel I have gotten lucky with this car. I have never looked beneath the bonnet of the car except for 'Ayudha Pooja'. My OEM battery lasted for 5.5 years (haven't checked my battery, till then). My car is on OEM tyres (needs a change). I have done the Kumbakonam run twice, without breaking into a sweat due to its ground clearance of 185mm could carry silly speeds in places where roads were only rubble. On a trip to Kodai, The front end of my car beached over a cement bag (only at parking speeds luckily) had to be jacked up and bag removed and continued as if nothing had happened to Kodai and back. I service my car once a year at the most being a sparingly run petrol. I don't scrub and clean and pore over it with wax and shampoo, but looks good and hides its age very nicely because it's parked securely. It's as it was delivered some 6 years back, no seat covers, nothing. My service costs haven't crossed say 20K rupees till date in my 6 years of ownership. My only expense (besides service) has been fuel. I'm not changing this car in the near future and my next car will also be a Hyundai. Even after discontinuing production they have a separate service advisor for Elantra and treat you well, though I visit them only once a year the service advisor remembers me and my car, that gives a feeling of confidence that my ride is in safe hands when at service.
I'm not here to rate brands but for me Hyundai is the best and this from owning Hyundai's for the last almost 12 years (Accent, before the Elantra). The cost of the first three services was truly free at Rs.0, no consumables were charged for.

Last edited by Durango Dude : 8th October 2011 at 23:31.
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Old 8th October 2011, 23:48   #28
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

I have owned cars from two brands only. An ikon that has made me swear not to go back to Ford anytime soon. However, the Omni & Swift have ensured that I will seriously consider Maruti for any car that I purchase in the future.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Durango Dude View Post
The cost of the first three services was truly free at Rs.0, no consumables were charged for.
You mean that they actually changed the oil, filters etc and did not charge you for it ? Did you buy a service pack or something from Hyundai or the dealer ?
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Old 8th October 2011, 23:53   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy View Post
I have owned cars from two brands only. An ikon that has made me swear not to go back to Ford anytime soon. However, the Omni & Swift have ensured that I will seriously consider Maruti for any car that I purchase in the future.





You mean that they actually changed the oil, filters etc and did not charge you for it ? Did you buy a service pack or something from Hyundai or the dealer ?
No, Elantra was on a fire sale and got it for a good deal at some 9.3L OTR all inclusive, came with a 1 year comprehensive and 3 year added warranty (that was standard with Elantra then), but I was lucky to have been in this golden era, I think consumables are charged now, then I wasn't charged. For a D segmenter how lucky can you get and this was the only car to come with Traction Control at that point of time in this segment for this price.

Last edited by Durango Dude : 8th October 2011 at 23:58.
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Old 8th October 2011, 23:56   #30
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Default Re: Reliability and hassle-free ownership: Perceptions of popular car brands on Team-

From my personal Experience
Quality of Service & Customer Interaction

1) Honda
Maintaining NHC VTEC is cheper than Hyundai Santro
2) Hyundai
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