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Old 31st January 2012, 18:01   #166
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

Hope this doesn't affect the petrol car users. Somehow I have a bad feeling about this.

With heavy taxes on buying diesel cars, the demand for Petrol will increase if the cars increase coz nowadays hardly anyone buys a car to keep at home. Most of us use it regularly.

More demand >> companies will claim more losses (something which they are always good at) since they have to import more == More petrol price hike.
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Old 31st January 2012, 19:35   #167
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
PSU is govt owned. And govt gets taxes.
Calling diesel sale a loss would be like a businessman opening two shops, running one at profit, one at loss, and even of overall result is profit, crying about loss.
Kindly read up on cost of diesel before taxes. Its around 32rs.
I don't need to read :-) I know already - I think it's even less than 32.

However, on paper this is a loss for the PSU which is offset by oil bonds. The PSUs probably sell the bonds on the market (with probably some discounting) to redeem their losses. Or keep the bonds as a long term investment on their books.

However, the point is that if diesel were not sold at a loss, it would be sold at the same price as petrol. I see no reason for reducing taxes on diesel for consumption in cars - if that's done, the same thing should be done for petrol also.

So there are 2 solutions.

1) Reduce taxes on both petrol & diesel.
2) Tax diesel cars.

Though, I prefer the first solution, I think both solutions are better than diesel for cars costing 25Rs less than petrol for cars.
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Old 31st January 2012, 20:36   #168
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by Altocumulus View Post
More demand >> companies will claim more losses (something which they are always good at) since they have to import more == More petrol price hike.
One can't rule that out entirely, though i feel it may not happen. If owning a diesel car becomes more expensive with the proposed hike, and running a petrol car for say 40+km a day is not practical, then people may look at other options like using a 2 wheeler/Metro/bus etc for their daily commute.
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Old 31st January 2012, 20:45   #169
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by carboy View Post

So there are 2 solutions.

1) Reduce taxes on both petrol & diesel.
2) Tax diesel cars.

Though, I prefer the first solution, I think both solutions are better than diesel for cars costing 25Rs less than petrol for cars.
Solution?
Solution to this.
I do not think its a problem which needs a solution.
For example, many people earning crores pay less tax due to low taxation on capitol gains.
Salaried individuals may want equality there.
Farmers get free electricity in some states, again people may ask for equality.
So diesel costing less than petrol, and diesel car owners getting benefit is not really a problem requiring a solution. Its just something which happens, and to counter that the petrol car owners have the option of buying diesel cars.
I do not believe in the logic of "If my neighbor is happy, and I am not lets make him sad". I believe in happiness for everybody
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Old 31st January 2012, 21:09   #170
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Long back when I was a kid my grandma used to tell me a story of a dog and a bone. The greedy dog had a bone in his mouth but when he crosses a river he sees another dog with the bone and jumps in the river to the other bone too. Now you are all thinking why am it walking about this story. Indian politicians are the dogs who are very very greedy and they only think about how to get all that others own (our hard earned money in the name of taxes) but the only difference is that here they do not end in the river but keep on their antics of looting the general public.

Most of the policies that they have made are only for their own benefits and care nothing about the common people in general. Hope that we will sometime see a better leaders.
Very True.

Again deisel and gas subsidy withdrawal will be a big ticket entry for the opposition in the elections and no party will be ready to bite it.
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Old 31st January 2012, 21:36   #171
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

I doubt if this really going to happen.According to one news channel auto sector has grown only 3% this month or quarter(sorry I forgot). IMO this +ve growth is only due to diesel cars and so coupled with the might of car makers and recession in auto sector, our govt may not go ahead with the move even though there are not many other better options available with our govt.
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Old 31st January 2012, 23:31   #172
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Solution?
Solution to this.
I do not think its a problem which needs a solution.
For example, many people earning crores pay less tax due to low taxation on capitol gains.
That's in the US. In India, many of them are paying even no tax, but stock capital gains aren't taxed after 1 year.

I am all for uniform taxes for all kinds of income.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Salaried individuals may want equality there.
Farmers get free electricity in some states, again people may ask for equality.
So diesel costing less than petrol, and diesel car owners getting benefit is not really a problem requiring a solution. Its just something which happens, and to counter that the petrol car owners have the option of buying diesel cars.
What's the cheapest diesel car in the market currently?

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
I do not believe in the logic of "If my neighbor is happy, and I am not lets make him sad". I believe in happiness for everybody
FWIW, I am not really affected by Petrol Prices. I drive CNG.

But I find it really silly that people driving a Mercedes are getting subsidized fuel while a guy driving a petrol Nano isn't.
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Old 31st January 2012, 23:58   #173
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

If the govt wants to impose additional levies on cigarettes , then it should allow the people to grow weed .. The poorer sections will benefit .

Whoever thinks the govt is right when it comes to imposing additional levies on cigarettes just because he .she does not smoke then they are really absurd with their point of view .

Are cigarettes , liquor , petrol , diesel the only ways to earn tax ?

Note From Team-BHP Support-Team: Using correct punctuation will go a long way in ensuring that the quality of posts on Team-BHP is maintained. Please take the time to use correct punctuation while keying-in your post. Thanks.

Last edited by suhaas307 : 1st February 2012 at 01:47. Reason: See note in post :)
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Old 1st February 2012, 01:00   #174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greatmana2000
If the govt wants to impose additional levies on cigarettes , then it should allow the people to grow weed .. The poorer sections will benefit .
Eh, what twisted logic is this? Grow weed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatmana2000
Whoever thinks the govt is right when it comes to imposing additional levies on cigarettes just because he .she does not smoke then they are really absurd with their point of view .
I smoke and I think they are right in raising sin taxes, because higher taxes reduce consumption. And we all know that smoking in injurious to health.
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Old 1st February 2012, 01:40   #175
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by greatmana2000 View Post
.. then it should allow the people to grow weed ..
Note from Team-Bhp Support: Let's keep the discussion limited to the subject at hand, i.e. taxes on cars and cigarettes. Kindly avoid comments that may be incendiary or deviate the thread from its main purpose. Thanks.
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Old 1st February 2012, 07:40   #176
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So diesel costing less than petrol, and diesel car owners getting benefit is not really a problem requiring a solution. Its just something which happens, and to counter that the petrol car owners have the option of buying diesel cars.
And petrol car owners have spent less for their car - a point easily forgotten.

So if govt raises diesel prices, will they ask car manufacturers to reduce price of diesel cars ? No ! It's just a ploy of the govt to raise more money from public, announce more schemes, and hence get more opportunities to earn.
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Old 1st February 2012, 08:38   #177
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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And petrol car owners have spent less for their car - a point easily forgotten.

So if govt raises diesel prices, will they ask car manufacturers to reduce price of diesel cars ? No ! It's just a ploy of the govt to raise more money from public, announce more schemes, and hence get more opportunities to earn.
Diesel engines are more expensive to manufacture as compared to similar petrol engines, hence diesel cars are more expensive. They are not expensive because diesel is cheaper than petrol.

By your logic, the more money one spends buying a car, the cheaper he should be provided with fuel.
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Old 1st February 2012, 08:46   #178
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by carboy View Post
Diesel engines are more expensive to manufacture as compared to similar petrol engines, hence diesel cars are more expensive.
Not completely, @carboy ! I never said price them the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by carboy View Post
They are not expensive because diesel is cheaper than petrol.

By your logic, the more money one spends buying a car, the cheaper he should be provided with fuel.
That's extending logic
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Old 1st February 2012, 09:53   #179
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

Hi All,

I have a novice question.

If I scurry now and buy any of the diesel car before budget, will I be saving the proposed 80k duty on new diesel cars?

Also, what about the used car market? definitely people can sell their diesel cars at a higher price than they bought it, what am i missing here?

Thank You,

Krishna
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Old 1st February 2012, 11:49   #180
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Default Re: Govt plans to impose additional levies on cigarettes and diesel cars

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Originally Posted by carboy View Post
Diesel engines are more expensive to manufacture as compared to similar petrol engines,
A 5 kva Mahindra genset (Diesel) costs about the same as a 5 kva Honda genset (Petrol), so basically it's more like the companies fleecing more from customers on pretext of diesel.
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