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Old 19th January 2012, 20:03   #46
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by romeomidhun View Post
Are you saying all the sales of Swift, Ritz and DZire are from Diesel models? Consider the split as 80-20, the total Diesel numbers will be around 30-32K.
True - stand corrected!
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Old 19th January 2012, 23:24   #47
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

Some clarity is sought here on the matter.
Maruti already makes these multijet diesel engines at its Manesar plant. Right? By Maruti I also mean Suzuki Powertrains.
This 1 lac engines are to be supplied by Fiat India which is jointly owned by Fiat and Tata.
Come to think of it. So does this mean that in some cars of the same model the engine will be by Maruti/Suzuki and on another FIAL made ones.
Will the customer get the option to choose his engine? Remember the day when colour TVs were launched in India, people used to choose Japanese picture tubes over Korean ones.

Last edited by rajeev k : 19th January 2012 at 23:31.
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Old 20th January 2012, 09:56   #48
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

@Rajeev, All engines would be branded DDis. So, there's no question of choosing which engine is from whom. They all would be made to the highest quality control that TATA-FIAT + Maruti would be maintaining.

That brings me to a question - Does a Merc owner ever ask, I want my car's engine from Germany and not from Force Motors!
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Old 20th January 2012, 11:12   #49
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

So does that make the Maruti Swift a better car compared to the Fiat Punto? It has the same engine, less weight, better A.S.S., better resale value, smoother clutch and gearshift.
For me, the Swift lacks exclusivity and I really don't like the looks. The issues with a Punto don't bother me but and in all probability I will still go ahead and buy a Punto.

My question is about market response and perception. One of the things I hear Fiat owners tell Maruti owners is how superior their Fiat engine is. That divide just got plugged.
At least, the Swift makes better sense to the head now. The Punto is still a matter of the heart.
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Old 20th January 2012, 11:32   #50
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by vinya_jag View Post
1 lakh engines. If Fiat makes a clean 20K per engine in terms of Indian Rupees, (Wild guess), it still would amount to 40M$ per year in terms of revenue. Thats straight profit, but is that not Paltry.

Selling a car would simply be more profitable if they can manage it I guess. Its not selling alone that counts, but maintaining the car for its life would add a lot to their bank accounts. [Correct me if I am wrong]. Only if Fiat felt this more than we all did :(
I know someone, who shall not be named working for Fiat. And he is involved with diesel engine tech being sold to other companies. Acc to him, Fiat makes cool 50-60K for each diesel engine Maruti sells.

There is win win for Fiat with more Diesel cars rolling out of Maruti plants.
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Old 20th January 2012, 15:06   #51
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

is this includes the 997 cc engine for the diesel wagon R, i hope that engine is the scaled down version of the fiat national diesel engine
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Old 21st March 2012, 09:02   #52
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

Can this be the reason for the new recommendation of engine oil and service intervals from Maruti?
I got my swift delivered last week, and the recommended oil is 5W40 (same as punto) and the first oil change is now at 10000kms. Earlier Maruti used 15W40 for DDiS engines.
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Old 21st March 2012, 09:47   #53
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by jingaboysr View Post
Can this be the reason for the new recommendation of engine oil and service intervals from Maruti?
I got my swift delivered last week, and the recommended oil is 5W40 (same as punto) and the first oil change is now at 10000kms. Earlier Maruti used 15W40 for DDiS engines.
Even the older ones requires oil change only at 10K, IIRC.
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Old 21st March 2012, 10:08   #54
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by Ashley2 View Post
Even the older ones requires oil change only at 10K, IIRC.
The oil change is still at 10k for all swift DDis. It is only the first oil changes that has been changed to 10k for swifts manufactured from December 2011/january 2012
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Old 21st March 2012, 10:19   #55
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by rajeev k View Post
Some clarity is sought here on the matter.
Maruti already makes these multijet diesel engines at its Manesar plant. Right? By Maruti I also mean Suzuki Powertrains.
This 1 lac engines are to be supplied by Fiat India which is jointly owned by Fiat and Tata.
Come to think of it. So does this mean that in some cars of the same model the engine will be by Maruti/Suzuki and on another FIAL made ones.
Will the customer get the option to choose his engine? Remember the day when colour TVs were launched in India, people used to choose Japanese picture tubes over Korean ones.
The engine being sold in the Swift earlier were not Fiat engines. They were Maruti manufactured engines where they had taken the design from Fiat under licensing to manufacture the same. The vista on the other hand comes with Fiat engines and gearbox due to joint venture.

Now Maruti has ordered engines directly from Fiat probably to meet the high demand. So whichever vehicles get these engines would be the original vehicles with the actual fiat multijet manufactured engines and not Maruti manufactured engines.

Dunno if customers would get to know more on this as they will sell everything under the same branding. But original Fiat engine would always be good to have in your car.
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Old 21st March 2012, 10:30   #56
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

Just because MSIL is buying engines from Fiat, does not mean that all Suzuki cars will have Fiat-made engines. As far as I know, MSIL will also continue to manufacture the engines. They struck the deal with Fiat either because they do not have enough capacity at their plant to produce enough engines to meet the demand, or they have contractual obligations to limit the number of engines produced.

So, how can you determine which company manufactured your engine? How can you determine whether to put 15W40 or 5W40 oil?
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Old 21st March 2012, 10:48   #57
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

Maruti has changed the engine oil to synthetic(5W40) in all vehicles after a particular VIN. They now recommend synthetic regardless of whether the engine was manufactured by Maruti or FIAT.
I was puzzled at this change, since the new swifts which came out last year had the regular mineral oil (15W40), why the sudden change to synthetic. Might be that Maruti might have contractual obligations for using FIAT recommended oil for FIAT manufactured engines, and decided to recommend it for all new vehicles.
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Old 21st March 2012, 11:02   #58
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

I have visited the FIAT engine plant at Ranjangaon & seen the high quality levels to which they manufacture their blocks & heads. And the main HMC machines they use are Heller - which are reputed to have one of the highest process capabilities in the HMC world.

The only difference possibly would be the state of tune, engine control mapping, etc. But I think Maruti would specify exactly what they want.

Anyways - the proof of the pudding is in the eating. When the engines come out in the field we will get the answers.

Last edited by sridhar-v : 21st March 2012 at 11:05. Reason: spelling correction
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Old 21st March 2012, 11:26   #59
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

The engines - to be specific should have same part numbers for child parts, between Suzuki power train made Fiat engines and the Fiat made Fiat engines.
There will be no quality level difference and customers need not worry on what engine is fitted in new cars.
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Old 21st March 2012, 11:37   #60
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Default Re: Maruti seals deal with Fiat to source 100,000 diesel engines per year

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Originally Posted by Ashley2 View Post
The engines - to be specific should have same part numbers for child parts, between Suzuki power train made Fiat engines and the Fiat made Fiat engines.
There will be no quality level difference and customers need not worry on what engine is fitted in new cars.
Hello,

Won't there be some difference because the two factories use different machines?

As Mr.Sridhar-V has pointed out, Fiat factory uses some brand of machine which is highly reputed. What if Maruti does not use the same machinery at its plant?

Ideally : no difference

Practically : there will be difference

Thank you
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