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Old 9th January 2012, 16:04   #46
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Well Honda cant have the new diesel engine any sooner. They are really struggling in diesel dominant markets like Europe. In UK alone (their European operations and manufacturing base), their sales have fallen by more than 20% in '11, Hyundai/Kia outsell them by 2.26:1.

Also unlike the 2.2 diesel the 1.6 should be made outside Japan, preferably India. Otherwise duties on top of Japanese manufacturing costs will mean a diesel City will be priced close to an Accord!!
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Old 7th March 2012, 14:15   #47
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Honda officially unveils it's 1.6L Earth Dream technology diesel motor @ Geneva Motor Show.
Quote:
The engine is the first in a series of efficient units Honda will roll out under the Earth Dreams Technology banner. The 1.6 diesel – which Honda claims is the lightest engine in its class – is expected to emit 95g/km of CO2 and will be installed in the new Civic at the end of the year. “With our Earth Dream Technology, we aim to be number one in terms of engine emissions within three years,” said Honda Motor Europe president Manuba Nishiru.The new 1596cc unit produces 118bhp at 4000rpm and 30.55kgm at 2000rpm.
More details:: Honda unveils 1.6-L diesel motor - News - Autocar India
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Old 7th March 2012, 16:09   #48
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Specs wise the engine surely looks good for the C segment, but no way it is suited for Civic. With Cruze set for 163 Bhp motor, 118 Bhp motor would be puny for Civic.
Honda should rather plonk this engine in City instead, could be a segment beater. But the 1.6L Earth Dreams engine makes 305.5kgm at 2000 rpm, which is quick but there is no spread over the range. After 2000 rpm, no more torque whereas in Vento 250NM of torque is spread over a range from 1500-2500 which looks much better.

The big question, when will Honda launch it in India?
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Old 7th March 2012, 18:41   #49
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

If Toyota can make do with a 1.4 liter, sub-100 bhp diesel engine for the Corolla, this 1.6 liter motor will do just fine in the Civic.
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Old 7th March 2012, 19:13   #50
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by StarScream View Post
If Toyota can make do with a 1.4 liter, sub-100 bhp diesel engine for the Corolla, this 1.6 liter motor will do just fine in the Civic.
Honda already uses a 2.2 i-DTEC in the UK Civic hatch. Since the UK Civic is actually a Hatch, a 1.6 could work well there. In India however, the 118 bhp 1.5 liter Petrol City would be the correct candidate for this 118 bhp 1.6 liter Diesel engine. What Toyota did with the Corolla Diesel is nothing short of Shameful (IMHO) no offends to the owners.
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Old 8th March 2012, 00:57   #51
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Honda officially unveils it's 1.6L Earth Dream technology diesel motor @ Geneva Motor Show.
More details:: Honda unveils 1.6-L diesel motor - News - Autocar India
wow this is awesome.

With news of petrol price going up further, today morning i was thinking when will Honda get new engine to India. IMO they have to even make a smaller say 1.3L engine and install it in Jazz and make a 1L engine and add to Brio since this is a mass market and people are waiting for a fuel efficient hatch al-beit under powered. Honda will be back with bang to fire the sales chart for sure if they introduce diesel. Hope they wont delay diesel car introduction to india any further. I for sure would have bought a Jazz if it was on diesel.
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Old 8th March 2012, 02:22   #52
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by el lobo 6061 View Post
The big question, when will Honda launch it in India?
From the clues, this engine should debut on the all-new-Civic to be launched by year end(?). It will make into city after that I guess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarScream View Post
If Toyota can make do with a 1.4 liter, sub-100 bhp diesel engine for the Corolla, this 1.6 liter motor will do just fine in the Civic.
Sadly Corolla has flopped big time with the 1.4L sub 100 bhp engine. I would say, it's better NOT to take efforts with such miniscule displacement engines and puny power output in the 15L segment. Total waste of time & money for the company itself.

Frankly I was expecting a detuned 2.2L engine or a 2L engine on Civic with a 140 odd bhp! This 1.6L with 118 engine is a proper fit on the City! They probably could have even claimed a bit of premium for this engine than competition too. Now what will they use in City if this engine goes into a Civic? A further de-tuned version?
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Old 8th March 2012, 10:05   #53
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Sadly Corolla has flopped big time with the 1.4L sub 100 bhp engine. I would say, it's better NOT to take efforts with such miniscule displacement engines and puny power output in the 15L segment. Total waste of time & money for the company itself.
+1.
The Corolla diesel is a flop from Toyota stable. I am sure it would have sold at least twice the amount it is selling now, had it come with a decent 1.8-2L engine.

Civic with a 1.6L and 118 bhp wont be as bad, but it would still be pale in comparison to the 2L engines out there.
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Old 8th March 2012, 14:19   #54
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Better late than never I suppose.

Honda enjoys a good equity here in India. Trouble is that by the time they are able cash in to the Diesel boom here, the boom per se may well be past.

On account of all these proposed diesel car taxes etc, people may well migrate back to petrol over the next couple of years.

It all depends whether consumers want to spend money up front for diesel variants OR spend it through running costs on the petrol variants. If the tax proposed comes true and is too high,we may see some migration to the latter category of consumer behaviour.
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Old 8th March 2012, 15:06   #55
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Since the 1.6 is also an i-DTEC engine, have they updated the 2.2 version also?
And will they introduce that in Accord and CRV in India?

Since this Earth Dreams Technology is used in Petrol and Diesel engines, what is this technology? Some catchy name for efficient engines I guess.

Last edited by srishiva : 8th March 2012 at 15:08.
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Old 8th March 2012, 21:37   #56
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

Quote:
Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
Honda officially unveils it's 1.6L Earth Dream technology diesel motor @ Geneva Motor Show.
Quote:
... The new 1596cc unit produces 118bhp at 4000rpm and 30.55kgm at 2000rpm.
More details:: Honda unveils 1.6-L diesel motor - News - Autocar India
Quote:
Originally Posted by el lobo 6061 View Post
Specs wise the engine surely looks good for the C segment, but no way it is suited for Civic. With Cruze set for 163 Bhp motor, 118 Bhp motor would be puny for Civic.
Honda should rather plonk this engine in City instead, could be a segment beater.
~~~~~~~~~
But the 1.6L Earth Dreams engine makes 305.5kgm at 2000 rpm, which is quick but there is no spread over the range. After 2000 rpm, no more torque whereas in Vento 250NM of torque is spread over a range from 1500-2500 which looks much better.
30.55kgm for a 1.6 litre diesel is serious torque!

Even the much appreciated 1.6 litre engine of the Fluidic Verna produces 26.5. The Optra/Cruze with their 2 litres produce 31-33kgm.

I would expect this to be very fuel efficient as well. Kudos to Honda.

Honda vs Vento on engines -
We don't have the torque/power curves of Honda to really comment. the peak torque of 30+kgm is at 2000. Would not be at all surprised if it was higher than the 25.5Kgm of the Vento across most of that 1500-2500, while being higher at 2000RPM. Would also not be surprised if the Honda didn't have that exciting surge of the Vento. Let us wait and watch.

Any idea if these figures are with a turbo? If not, then with Turbo, it could make it a lot sweeter and appropriate for the Civic; a FE based tuning for the lighter Honda City.

Last edited by Poitive : 8th March 2012 at 21:40. Reason: Typo, addition about Vento surge
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Old 8th March 2012, 21:41   #57
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by Poitive View Post
Any idea if these figures are with a turbo? If not, then with Turbo, it could make it a lot sweeter and appropriate for the Civic; a FE based tuning for the lighter Honda City.
It should be right? I guess they will have an FGT and that's why all those torque at 2000 rpms! Could be wrong though!

I was thinking all CRDi engines will have a turbo. The choice is whether to have an intercooler or not?
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Old 8th March 2012, 22:26   #58
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

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Originally Posted by swiftnfurious View Post
It should be right? I guess they will have an FGT and that's why all those torque at 2000 rpms! Could be wrong though!

I was thinking all CRDi engines will have a turbo. The choice is whether to have an intercooler or not?
I think you would be right @swiftnfurious mate. Almost surely right, especially since it is supposed to have low emissions. I think I got a bit overexcited with those engine specs.

Can't say about the FGT or VGT. The site doesn't mention anything.

It seems like a promising engine; especially for the City!
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Old 9th March 2012, 10:59   #59
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

This is getting exciting. The current generation Civic with the new oil burner will outsell the Corolla Diesel many times. Great going Honda

I hope they put this engine in the Jazz and give us a crazy little pocket rocket
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Old 9th March 2012, 11:58   #60
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Default Re: Honda to focus on diesel engines, small compact cars for India

with 1.6 surpassing the excise duty benefit limit, don't think Honda can offer it to City. So, this move can only benefit the Civic.

Looks like, City and Jazz diesel is still a distant dream.
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