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Old 14th March 2006, 12:33   #16
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If you go by the mass market, more people are into fuel economy and comfort, before performance. Indica is offering both FE and comfort at a hard to beat price. I drive an 800 and when I bought it in 2002, I paid more for it than I would have to pay for an Indica base A/c model now. So, I am sure prices will fall to levels we consider rock bottom, and then they will fall further. In India, what drives the market is volumes, not prices. I was in Shimla and further uphill in November last, and as we moved from Chandigarh towards Shimla, the frequency of Optras and Corollas fell until the commonest cars were 800's. It still is extremely popular in small town India. And as the standard of living improves outside of the Metros, people will get off their bikes and get into the first car available, which will have to be the cheapest one available.
So, I think, while ultimately, the 800 will have to be phased out, Tata will play a big part in the mass car of the next 8 to 10 years.
Also, I wish more and more Indian manufacturers come out with standard cars that we can all feel proud of. Maybe, initially with a little help from their Italian friends? I wouldn't mind driving visiting NRI relatives and friends in a peppy "Indian" hatchback.
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Old 14th March 2006, 12:49   #17
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Another really good marketing stuff from Hyundai. They want people to think of resale value in 2010 for car's bought now itself.....by telling they will be number 1 in 2010.... Check out all their recent new car's ...will know really where they are heading.....

For sure TATA would compete with maruti for top seat in low cost car's provided they extract more technical details using their partnership with FIAT.
But Luxury segment in india would be again ruled by Honda and Toyota for another decade or 2.

Last edited by ksethuram : 14th March 2006 at 12:53.
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Old 14th March 2006, 12:49   #18
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With new engines coming before end of this year, I doubt the "nothing innovative" tag.
As for other innovations, how many manufacturers give you a bad fuel warning indicater in the car? I think Xeta has one to warn drivers if they fill in adulterated fuel
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Old 14th March 2006, 13:07   #19
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Default Dont write Hyndai off:Consider these!!

1. Hyundai exports a lot of cars. Hence dont just see the sales figures in India. Due to plant capacity constraints, they might not focussed as agressively on the local markets. Once their second plant is ready, lets see what they unleash.

2. With Verna, (whose inside volume is more than Honda Civic), they have the best of Accent and Elantra. It will do away with the bad looks and low seating of Elantra, while retaining the trims + other stuff like ABS, EBD etc. etc from Elantra. I think they have a hot seller in Verna and it will sweep the market. Their spares are the cheapest. Dont believe me. Just drop by to the nearest Hyundai service and look at the charts. Santro to getz to accent to elantra, prices dont change too much.

3. New version of Santro due to come out in 2007.

4. New version of Getz due to come out sometime soon.

Dont write Hyundai off in the 1-10 lakh segment. They will strike with a bang. They havce the guts to invest(like they did when they came to India) unlike some other manufacturers who dump their cars here with minimal or no modifications.

In the greater than 10 lakh segment, I agree, image will make a difference but here we are talking of volumes I guess.
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Old 14th March 2006, 13:53   #20
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Hyundai has confirmed the launch of sonata diesel by end of this year according to deccan chronicle
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Old 14th March 2006, 15:28   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979
With new engines coming before end of this year, I doubt the "nothing innovative" tag.
As for other innovations, how many manufacturers give you a bad fuel warning indicater in the car? I think Xeta has one to warn drivers if they fill in adulterated fuel
Look at the dated designs of Tata. How many more years are they going to sell the Safari and Sumo in its current form ? or do they want to follow the Ambassador product life cycle model ?

I am all for buying Indian but if the company is producing dated lack lustre products that have not stood the test of time then I will not touch them.

I hope they are going to have new car designs to put these new engines into.

As for the bad fuel thing. Does it tell you before you fill up or after the event ? If it is after the event then what use is that. Will anyone actually drain their fuel tank ? At most all you will do is not use that fuel station again.
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Old 14th March 2006, 15:37   #22
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Compared to maruti, tata still has newer designs.
As for safari sumo, the new platform is going to be here in 2007, so are the new engines.
As for the bad fuel thing, such a device may protect you from expensive repairs by warning you in advance.
And going by your argument, what good are safety features which get activated after an accident. they should activate before them, right?
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Old 14th March 2006, 18:26   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979
Compared to maruti, tata still has newer designs.
As for safari sumo, the new platform is going to be here in 2007, so are the new engines.
As for the bad fuel thing, such a device may protect you from expensive repairs by warning you in advance.
And going by your argument, what good are safety features which get activated after an accident. they should activate before them, right?
I look forward to the new Safari and Sumo.

Sure should activate during the accident just like a fuel detector should tell you before you waste 1000RS filling the tank up and then another few hundred getting it drained and cleaned.

No good having a head on crash and the airbag inflates a minute later. Same with the fuel thing, it should be designed to tell you before you have filled the whole tank up, how many people are going to drain the tank and clean it out it ?
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Old 14th March 2006, 18:37   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subbarp
Verna, (whose inside volume is more than Honda Civic)
Sez WHO??????

And what were they smoking when they said so? The new Accent can be compared favourably to the Fiesta, thats about it. Dont even THINK of anything more. They would be shooting themselves in their foot if they didnt replace the old accent with the new one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
new accent cannot touch indigo anytime
Since the old Accent has been 'touching' the Indigo on quite a few occassions, I dont see why the new one shouldnt continue to exhibit such touching behaviour....

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
getz doesnt sell well
It doesnt sell as much as the Swift, but it does sell more than the Esteem or the Ikon - both of which are comparable in price to the Getz. I wouldnt call that bad at all - especially when you consider the fact that the Ikon is Ford's mainstay in India

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
tata sumo sells more than sonata and terracan added togather.
Whats the comparison???? If you want to carry out such ridiculous comparisons the Chevy Tavera sells more than the Octavia, Laura and Superb - does that mean Chevy is better than Skoda?????

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
terracan hardly sells 50 units a year
200 units from April to November 2005. Verify your facts before you start throwing statements around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
tata with a good c+ segment car can easily take hyundai by the horns.
There you go with your sweeping statements again....just one C Segment car would be enough to 'beat' a manufacturer that has a presence all over the world in every segment except super-luxury???? Get real.

Before we start comparing Tata to Hyundai, lets remember that Tata is essentially a 2-platform manufacturer with ONE Indica.go.marina platform and ONE Sumo/Safari/207 platform. Their strength is in diesels, but this is one area where Hyundai have left most of the other manufacturers in the world far behind much to everyone's surprise.

If there is any manufacturer that is capable of taking the number one crown IN INDIA from Maruti, it has to be Hyundai. Unless Toyota starts taking India seriously - their model range is big enough to kill everyone else in the market if they start taking this market seriously.

Last edited by Steeroid : 14th March 2006 at 18:55.
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Old 14th March 2006, 21:07   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid

Since the old Accent has been 'touching' the Indigo on quite a few occassions, I dont see why the new one shouldnt continue to exhibit such touching behaviour....



It doesnt sell as much as the Swift, but it does sell more than the Esteem or the Ikon - both of which are comparable in price to the Getz. I wouldnt call that bad at all - especially when you consider the fact that the Ikon is Ford's mainstay in India



Whats the comparison???? If you want to carry out such ridiculous comparisons the Chevy Tavera sells more than the Octavia, Laura and Superb - does that mean Chevy is better than Skoda?????



200 units from April to November 2005. Verify your facts before you start throwing statements around.



There you go with your sweeping statements again....just one C Segment car would be enough to 'beat' a manufacturer that has a presence all over the world in every segment except super-luxury???? Get real.

Before we start comparing Tata to Hyundai, lets remember that Tata is essentially a 2-platform manufacturer with ONE Indica.go.marina platform and ONE Sumo/Safari/207 platform. Their strength is in diesels, but this is one area where Hyundai have left most of the other manufacturers in the world far behind much to everyone's surprise.

If there is any manufacturer that is capable of taking the number one crown IN INDIA from Maruti, it has to be Hyundai. Unless Toyota starts taking India seriously - their model range is big enough to kill everyone else in the market if they start taking this market seriously.

1) The old accent has been a good product. It had the capability to beat indigo at times. the new accent surely sucks. smaller shape and size. Try to fit yourself inside at the rear and then let me know if it has capacity to beat the indigo. hyundai cannot beat indigo in value and that can be the only way the new accent can beat Indigo.

2) money wise shouldnt the elantra be compared with the baleno then? Compare apples with apples. Swift sells more than getz. So does Indica. but the problem is tata has just one model to fight two.

3) I have not made a comparision here. When taking the whole company's unit sales we need to include all the cars from all segments. Tata doesnt have a d segment luxury car and a luxury SUV and hyundai doesnt have an MUV. SO to just show where bulk of the sales lie for each company I have made a comparo. Hope the logic gets through.

4) I agree to my mistake. It was a typo. That was supposed to be 50 units a month.

5) Logic my boy, logic :- Let me make this simpler. going ahead with point 3) tata still doesnt have c+ segment car to compete with hyundai's Elantra. If tata brings out a c+ segment car then that will most probably be a market leader or atleast beat elantra's sales by a margin. Here I mean it will take hyundai by the horns in the C+ segment.Hope its clear to you.


Overall my only say is tata needs to bring out models in segments where they dont exist.

Last edited by devarshi84 : 14th March 2006 at 21:11.
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Old 15th March 2006, 09:55   #26
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During my stay abroad, i had opportunity to test drive lot of cars.

And comparing all the cars, korean cars, including hyundai, sucks. Even the quality and safety aspects, make it even worthless. It is only good when compared to chinese manufacturers like Geely.The only positive point is, that it is cheaper option.

PLEASE NOTE that i have not driven any of the hyundais in India.

But, based on the quality of the products worldwide, i guess the success of hyundai here is because even now we dont have enough choice of good products except few from maruti. And ofcourse hyundai india has a very good marketing team.
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Old 15th March 2006, 10:11   #27
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axually tata has already beaten hyundai in sales.

tata sold 14K something vehicles while hyudai sold 8k something.


http://www.business-standard.com/com...&autono=218455

Hyundai sold 8,780 units, down from 9,518 units in February 2005. Tata Motors registered a 12 per cent growth in sales, with 14,201 units sold in February this year, against 12,671 units in the same month last year

Last edited by devarshi84 : 15th March 2006 at 10:13.
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Old 15th March 2006, 10:14   #28
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The new Accent is a big disappointment. I had a chance to sit in the car recently and rear seat space was horribly limited, at least for me. I am 5' 10", I got into the drivers seat adjusted it to my comfort level and immediately got into the back seat behind the drivers seat. It was so cramped that I had to twist my feet to squeeze in and my legs kept touching the front seat. It was a very uncomfortable situation. In western countries, this isn't a issue since Accent is always owener driven, but in India it will almost always be chauffer driven. The trunk space was huge and Hyundai India will have to either lessen the trunk space making more room at the rear or reduce the price to make it entry level mid-size car with Flair and Indigo to sell in decent numbers. Besides, the new Accent looks more downmarket compared to the old one.
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Old 15th March 2006, 10:35   #29
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oops..i forgot to mention Plagiarism of hyundai cars.
old sonata looks like jaguar .
embera looks has a lot of simailrity with honda accord and certain models of lexus.
U think thats bad, u should check out models from KIA(a hyundai company).
Most of their models have resemblence to japanese or premium european cars.
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Old 15th March 2006, 10:39   #30
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As per the marketing initiatives and complete customer focus i would say that HYUNDAI actually deserves the number 1 position more than the MARUTI.

However TATA too have it in them to achieve that #1 slot and if TATA uses its alliance with FIAT to the fullest wherein FIAT for petrol and TATA with FIAT's diesels, mark my words, TATA FIAT together have a very strong chance.

Let the best one win.

Cheers.
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