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Old 6th August 2012, 18:32   #1141
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by sbala View Post
Look at this .. In Pics - Ecosport & Duster
I thought ecosport is taller than duster?
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Old 6th August 2012, 18:35   #1142
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

Stumbled upon this when i was browsing by for ecosport links. This is ford vertrek. Was wondering close is this to the design of ecosport!

Detroit 2011: Ford Vertrek Concept previews future global small crossover
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Old 6th August 2012, 18:56   #1143
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by AutoIndian View Post
My gut feeling is that its price will hover in the range of 7 to 11 lakhs & not 10 to 14 lacs as one might have assumed seeing the Brazil prices.
I would be very happy if Ford proves my predictions wrong, but let's just think about the features in the top end variant - ABS, 16'' alloy wheels, rear parking sensors, traction and stability control, hill climb assistant, side and curtain airbags, leather seats, climate control, keyless entry, light and rain sensors. All this at 11 lacs seems difficult to me, considering how Ford has priced the new Fiesta. The Brazil prices are high, no doubt about that and typically they say in Brazil cars cost twice as much as they do in the US. Indian car prices are also significantly more than comparable models in the US, so the speculation that the the Ecosport will be priced around 50% less than Brazil seems unrealistic.

If you are thinking that the base price of the Ecosport will be similar or less than the Duster then let's think about following differences in the base level models:
  • Ecosport comes with front airbags and ABS standard across variants
  • Ecosport is arguably better built and safer than the Duster to drive and in case of a crash
  • Ecosport is more modern and looks modern, probably quality interiors would be better too.
  • Ecosport petrol engine is more advanced
  • Ecosport offers better flexibility with respect to space
  • Overall better levels of equipment than the Duster, equipment options are definitely better in the top end Ecosport.
  • Ford has better service network, presence than Renault which is relatively unknown.
  • Ecosport dimensions are slightly smaller than the Duster (Probably the only negative point)
In most respects the Ecosport seems better and is probably in a better position to take advantage of the demand for compact SUVs in India. The number of bookings that the Duster got would also get the hopes up for guys at Ford, and they know how crazy, how SUV deprived we Indians are. So I don't think Ford will price the Ecosport much cheaper even if they can (due to benefits in excise, localization etc). The Duster is priced between Rs. 7.19 - 11.29 Lakhs (ex-Delhi). I think Ford will price the Ecosport at least around 80k to a Lac more than the Duster across the range (8 to 12.5 lacs)

We have all seen how we get our hopes up and then get disappointed when the prices are announced. So let's be realistic this time around and hope that the prices are sensible if not cheap.

Last edited by MandarMax : 6th August 2012 at 18:59.
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Old 6th August 2012, 19:12   #1144
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Ecosport is arguably better built and safer than the Duster to drive and in case of a crash
.
Agree this is probably a big differentiator. The review in Portugese clearly mentions the weighty build of the Ecosport and the fact that the 1.6L engine has trouble pulling this weight at times. The Duster weighs about 1150 KG which is only slighly more than a compact hatch. Would be interesting to compare the weight of the Ecosport and Duster. My guess is that Ecosport will be heavier despite its smaller dimensions. If this is true, it will drive up material costs.
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Old 6th August 2012, 19:55   #1145
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by MandarMax View Post
So I don't think Ford will price the Ecosport much cheaper even if they can (due to benefits in excise, localization etc). The Duster is priced between Rs. 7.19 - 11.29 Lakhs (ex-Delhi). I think Ford will price the Ecosport at least around 80k to a Lac more than the Duster across the range (8 to 12.5 lacs)

We have all seen how we get our hopes up and then get disappointed when the prices are announced. So let's be realistic this time around and hope that the prices are sensible if not cheap.
I absolutely appreciate your thought process MandarMax . Given the superiority of the Ecosport (as a product per se) over the Duster in all aspects (except size), people like you & me would be more than happy to pay a premium of around 80k to a Lac more over the Duster. But then we are a minority (may be less than 5%). The vast majority out there would think, why should I spend a lakh more to get a smaller car, which gives me as much FE (if not more). For these people size, external appearances matter the most. They will find the Duster a lot more VFM compared to the Ecosport. (same as how people found the Verna & Vento to be more VFM than the Fiesta when it was launched). What this resulted in was a slow but sure death for the Fiesta. Can anyone (even Ford management for that matter) in wildest of their dreams would have imagined that an older generation of a particular model would be outselling the newer generation by a whopping 500%. That is a reality, the Classic has sold more than 5 times the copies of Fiesta (Refer the July 2012 Sales thread by GTO --> http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-analysis.html (July 2012 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis) & let me tell you this was not an exception just for the last month, but has happened consistently over the last 5 months).

Can Ford afford to repeat that same mistake with a car, which is as global as the new Fiesta? The answer would be a big NO. This time around they have the excise duty benefit card to play around the price. Moreover they are targetting 80% localization. Not sure how much was the new Fiesta localized at the time of launch, but this factor too is very critical to price the product very competetively. Some reliable sources have informed, that this 80% localization target has resulted the Ecosport launch getting delayed till Jan 13. Otherwise they could have simply imported the parts from Brazil/China & launched the Ecosport well before the Duster. Moreover if there is an initial spike in the demand, there are chances that the subsequent marginal increase in prices would be taken by the market in its own stride & would not dent the sales much. However if the initial demand is a damp squib (as has happened with the Fiesta), then not even God can come to its rescue however hard you try to push the product by launching mid-night sales, cash discounts & what not.

So the right strategy for Ford would be to launch the product with basic minimum features, which the market demands & values & price it at par or a notch above the competetion. But if they launch it with all the fancy features & price it a lakh above the competition, then they have another Fiesta in the making.

Enough said about the Ecosport pricing Let's stop is here, period.
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Old 6th August 2012, 20:45   #1146
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

Quote:
Originally Posted by MandarMax View Post
80k to a Lac more than the Duster across the range (8 to 12.5 lacs)

We have all seen how we get our hopes up and then get disappointed when the prices are announced. So let's be realistic this time around and hope that the prices are sensible if not cheap.
Believe me, if Ford prices it a rupee higher than Duster, the only people who will be disappointed will be Ford themselves. But then, Ford has one of the biggest duds of this decade in its hands with new Fiesta, so why not one more? Maybe they can beat Tata's flop-show with the Aria

Ecosport is a much smaller car and neither has the brand recognition or street presence of Duster. It will be have to be priced 80k - 1Lac *lower* to have any chance in succeeding.
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Old 6th August 2012, 21:27   #1147
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by sbala View Post
Look at this .. In Pics - Ecosport & Duster
I cannot make myself get used to the looks of the Ecosport. While I used to like the clean simple lines on the previous generation Fords, their new Kinetic design language on the Ecosport looks clearly overdone. The Duster front end looks more appealing than the Ecosport.
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Old 6th August 2012, 21:52   #1148
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

The other thing which I cannot understand is the 1.6L petrol version.
If 1L Ecoboost was already announced, why then its being released in a 1.6L avatar in other countries?
Does it mean there is a market for such trims?

And with a new 1L cracker engine, I dont know how they are working on a lower price (even though they avail the sub 4m excise benefit).
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Old 6th August 2012, 22:34   #1149
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

For the price, what Brazilian website claims, I still suspect the actual figures for India, thanks to the different set of needs & requirements, we Indians are having.

Though we like oddles of chrome what who cares about differently coloured ORVMs or door handles or Bumper sill protectors or else.
Who wants an all rounded riveted fittings or plastic lined interiors or double lining dashboard or door trims or else.

This is what Ford India understood while Ford Figo development in & for India.
And this will be the key tool for Re-engineering the EcoSport for India.
Similar thing is going to happen with VW Up! also, which has been on drawing boards again for key emerging markets.

I'm keen & optimistic for EcoSport introduction in India.


Quote:
Originally Posted by h.s.r View Post
Autoindian post states Length as 4.23 Mtrs. Does that mean Indian version will also be longer than 4 Mtrs?
Maybe, that will be including the length of Spare tyre included, which is mounted on its tail-gate contributing to its overall length.
Else, Ford needs to shave 'few centimetres' to project EcoSport in sub-4 metre bracket in India.
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Old 6th August 2012, 23:51   #1150
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by ampere View Post
The other thing which I cannot understand is the 1.6L petrol version.
If 1L Ecoboost was already announced, why then its being released in a 1.6L avatar in other countries?
My guess, perhaps the EcoBoost engines are not desgined to run on a heavy mixture of Ethanol. That could be the reason Ford decided to use the traditional Sigma in Brazil..May be!
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Old 7th August 2012, 00:28   #1151
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

Quote:
Originally Posted by klassics45 View Post
I thought ecosport is taller than duster?
After all, both are mini-SUV's. Looks like, they share the same height.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanjunair5 View Post
I cannot make myself get used to the looks of the Ecosport. While I used to like the clean simple lines on the previous generation Fords, their new Kinetic design language on the Ecosport looks clearly overdone. The Duster front end looks more appealing than the Ecosport.
IMO, Duster has no nonsense design - Simple, neat, but nothing special about it. But Ecosport design lines are completely different. Always gives a fresh new look each time.
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Old 7th August 2012, 07:48   #1152
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post

Ecosport is a much smaller car and neither has the brand recognition or street presence of Duster.
Which brand recognition are we talking about? One of these entered just a year ago while the other one has been here for the last 15 years.
If any, Ford has more brand recognition than "Renolt"
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Old 7th August 2012, 08:14   #1153
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

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Originally Posted by agambhandari View Post
Which brand recognition are we talking about? One of these entered just a year ago while the other one has been here for the last 15 years.
If any, Ford has more brand recognition than "Renolt"
I was talking about Duster which is a proven workhorse around the world - not about Ford vs Renault.

But then again having a brand here for 15 years means zilch, and what they have achieved means more. Look at the number of flops they had - Mondeo, Fusion, and the new Fiesta. The only major success they had is with the Figo, and that's because its priced well. Its pretty obvious that they have to price Ecosport very aggressively if they need to have a fighting chance.

Last edited by SkyWalker : 7th August 2012 at 08:21.
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Old 7th August 2012, 09:16   #1154
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

The previous Ikon and Fiesta Classic were nothing short of successful either.
But being a great car around the world doesn't guarantee you recognition and presence in India.
Eg- Yeti (it has 6 months waiting in Europe and 2.5 lakhs discount in India!).

For anyone buying a car here, Both Duster and Ecosport would be a Freshly launched car. and i dont know about others but i would like to go with the brand that is present in more than just 50 cities
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Old 7th August 2012, 16:17   #1155
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport Preview @ Auto Expo 2012. EDIT : Indian Spy Pics on Pg. 33

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
Ecosport is a much smaller car and neither has the brand recognition or street presence of Duster. It will be have to be priced 80k - 1Lac *lower* to have any chance in succeeding.
Unless Ford decides to sell the Ecosport at a loss, this will only remain a dream. At the end of the day Duster and Ecosport are both small cars, Ecosport just being tad smaller. I think Ford has better brand recognition and presence, their car is and looks modern, why would they sell it cheap? It will sell based on what it offers as compared to the competition. Also you shouldn't just plainly see it as Duster vs Ecosport fight, there are different variants of both cars that will compete against each other at various price points. For example the Duster petrol version is no match for Ecosport petrol version (and also the engine). It would be interesting to see how many petrol Dusters Renault is selling. If I was interested in a compact SUV running on petrol, I wouldn't even consider the Duster petrol, which is simply too basic and without any safety features. I would happily pay a premium for those extra features, and power and fuel economy of the Ecoboost engine. Remember both cars are targeted at urban buyers that are aware of technology, safety features etc. There are potentially many buyers with 8-12 lakh rupees looking for a better car, and considering the fascination with SUVs in our country, I am sure there will be enough buyers to keep both Ford and Renault happy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanjunair5 View Post
I cannot make myself get used to the looks of the Ecosport. While I used to like the clean simple lines on the previous generation Fords, their new Kinetic design language on the Ecosport looks clearly overdone. The Duster front end looks more appealing than the Ecosport.
Looks are subjective my friend. There are many people who think the Ecosport looks futuristic and the Duster dated.

Last edited by MandarMax : 7th August 2012 at 16:26.
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