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Old 29th May 2012, 22:40   #61
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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It should be so thin that even a slightly bulit person can kick with both his feet and shatter it.
Or any normal driver, drive over our famed potholes and shatter it

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Old 29th May 2012, 22:43   #62
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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Shouldn't manufacturers ( all manufacturers ) make one of the four window glasses very thin and frail. Just thick enough to ptrotect from rain lashing. This glass ( pavement-side front door ) should have very thin window glass for just such an emergency. It should be so thin that even a slightly bulit person can kick with both his feet and shatter it.
That would also make it easy for the thieves to break in
Tougher glasses also protect the occupants in case of a roll over.
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Old 29th May 2012, 22:50   #63
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

I narrated this incident to a friend of mine, and he came up with a very weird theory. Nevertheless, I could not avoid thinking of it altogether, and am still wondering whether there is any truth in what he says.

So here goes, and I would like the opinion of forum members on this.

He says that using wax on the body of the car is a bad practice. Since wax itself is a flammable substance, using it on a car increases the chances of a fire spreading rapidly around the vehicle's body when a fire breaks out. Also, this increases the thermal quotient (what???) of the car, hence the fire is also difficult to put out in case help arrives. He also said that using normal Silicon polish or something similar, instead of wax, is a much better and safer option. (I thought silicon polish and wax were for different purposes, and could be used together??)

Is there any validity in what he says? Any theories to support or disprove this?

Last edited by swarnava.m : 29th May 2012 at 22:51.
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Old 29th May 2012, 22:57   #64
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I certainly find it interesting what your friend said. It is obvious that wax cathes fire and quickly too. So even if it wasnt the case in the said incident it should be avoided altogether. Specially in these soaring temperatures nowadays. Also even if the engine catches fire it will spread fast due the wax. Nice observation!
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Old 29th May 2012, 23:04   #65
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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Is there any validity in what he says? Any theories to support or disprove this?
Wax is definitely flammable but the layer would be too thin to make significant contribution to the fire. But theoretically it does. But there are other flammable parts like rubber, plastic, fabric which significantly help the fire to spread.
This makes me think one should have fire resistant seat covers, floor mats etc.
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Old 29th May 2012, 23:38   #66
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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Originally Posted by Guna View Post
Wax is definitely flammable but the layer would be too thin to make significant contribution to the fire. But theoretically it does. But there are other flammable parts like rubber, plastic, fabric which significantly help the fire to spread.
This makes me think one should have fire resistant seat covers, floor mats etc.
Also makes me think whether it would be a good idea to incorporate special technology to detect a fire or chances of it, and completely isolate the fuel tank the moment such an event is triggered. What I mean is, the petrol tank itself could be of heat resistant material, and in this event, all fuel supply should be immediately and unconditionally cut off. Probably this could slow down the spread of fire then??
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Old 29th May 2012, 23:47   #67
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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Originally Posted by swarnava.m View Post
What I mean is, the petrol tank itself could be of heat resistant material, and in this event, all fuel supply should be immediately and unconditionally cut off. Probably this could slow down the spread of fire then??
My 2007 FIAT Palio Stile came with a similar feature. It is called Fire Prevention System - Cuts the fuel supply incase of an impact.

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Old 30th May 2012, 00:07   #68
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
Wax is definitely flammable but the layer would be too thin to make significant contribution to the fire. But theoretically it does. But there are other flammable parts like rubber, plastic, fabric which significantly help the fire to spread.
This makes me think one should have fire resistant seat covers, floor mats etc.
You are right. I also feel that every one should keep a car fire extinguisher readily available in the car.

Another incident reported today Man burnt alive as van catches fire | Chittinagar | | The New Indian Express
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Old 30th May 2012, 00:53   #69
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Originally Posted by vsun View Post
This is getting really uncontrollable and affecting my nerves. All the solutions are though good in theory but take this latest case. The victim gets no time is really shocking or scary.
Sorry to say but seat-belts are also proving as hindrance as if the buckle plastic melts than one is helpless. (Please don't flame me as I was using and will use seat-belts but only thinking aloud). Forget fire-extinguishers, hammer (that too very very handy) not even below the seat but in door pockets seem to be least fool-proof solution. Time is very critical factor in fire incidents. I have read somewhere on T-BHP that fuel lines have almost 1-2 ltrs of petrol always, so even cut-off is not fool-proof. I am now firmly believing that more electricals, Gas kit are really dangerous. Keep the car in the as stock position as possible is less risky (not safer) with the exceptions of Rapid/Vento (cause of fire not known yet), Nano and few others.
PS: As mentioned above TIME is critical, in this incident, driver escaped but passenger died shows the speed at which fire spread. It also hints that there may be gas kit so rear passenger couldn't escape due to cylinder (only wild guess I may be wrong). So this "Time"available to escape (or lack of it) is what is scaring me.

Last edited by carwatcher : 30th May 2012 at 01:01.
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Old 30th May 2012, 01:10   #70
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

http://www.livehindustan.com/news/lo...catiopnvalue=1

As per above link it was a diesel. Can we suspect the pressurized fuel line to be the culprit. The fire started from the engine bay.

I have a "personal" feeling that the diesel versions are more susceptible due to higher pressure in fuel lines. Also I find it difficult to digest that you cannot open the door manually because the latch melted.
Let me discuss a peculiar condition with the central locking in SX4 ZXi.

I tried to unlock a door (by rotating the door lock manually) and pulled the door-open lever half-way. At the same time I pressed central locking "unlock" switch (same effect as taking out the keys after switching off), with the door handle in half pulled state. I was surprised to see that while other doors unlocked, this door locked itself again. I had to manually unlock it again (or release the door handle and use central locking "unlock" again).

This can also be simulated when the passengers are in a hurry to get out of the car, and you just try to pull out your keys, those doors get locked (where the hurrying folks decide to pull the door-open levers in advance)

Could it be something similar on that Swift. Internally the door lever "unlocked" but the central locking reversed it again, and then "probably" the physical linkage to manually open the doors is lost by then (due to heat), and you cannot open the doors, causing one to suffocate inside.

Just some food for thought to keep gray cells ticking. Please do not consider this as a finding to the problem. These are my (extrapolated) speculations and not "reliable" or from any source of truth.
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Old 30th May 2012, 03:58   #71
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

Not just any hammer but a special one with a pointed end designed to shatter glass. In AC buses (with sealed windows) it is required by law (in the west) to have clearly visible hammers positioned in the bus for this purpose.

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Emergency hammer, car escape tool, keychain rescue tool, auto escape tool, centerpunch - LifeHammer by nov8

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Originally Posted by tanwaramit View Post
I have kept pliers in the glovebox as a precaution, cant understand why the door locks fail on such occasions, while it should be opposite.
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
So what do you suggest to buy for safety? I have seen fire incidents with all manufacturer's cars Maru
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Originally Posted by ethan3686 View Post
Its done now. I have decided to keep hammars below my car seat. In each car of mine. Hammers are better anyday over a plier or a spanner.
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Old 30th May 2012, 08:50   #72
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

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Originally Posted by Guna View Post
  • short circuiting
  • cables getting heated due to overloading
  • engine getting overheated (drained coolant)
  • leaking fuel line/tank coming in contact with hot object (like exhaust)
  • etc
That is what I mean. These are the usual suspects, so remedies should be thought of.

Moreover, the spark thus generated needs medium to spread. Here it may be the upholstery/engine bay sound deadening material etc. This should be made of fire retardant material so as to minimize the chances of fire spreading.

A more simple and immediate remedy is providing fire extinguisher, which could be a saver to an extent.
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Old 30th May 2012, 11:21   #73
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

I find many arguments in this whole discussion about whether vehicles have/don't have manual override over electrical locking systems rather baseless. These systems work on the battery right? If they don't have a manual override, then what are we supposed to do in case the battery is drained? Stay stuck inside the car (what if all 4 windows are power operated!!) till someone can charge the battery or get us out???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
Wax is definitely flammable but the layer would be too thin to make significant contribution to the fire. But theoretically it does. But there are other flammable parts like rubber, plastic, fabric which significantly help the fire to spread.
This makes me think one should have fire resistant seat covers, floor mats etc.
Yes, true. However, the wax is spread over the entire surface of the car's body, however thin. That might have an effect in causing the fire to spread faster.
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Old 30th May 2012, 12:01   #74
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

Quote:
Originally Posted by devsoftech View Post
http://www.livehindustan.com/news/lo...catiopnvalue=1

I have a "personal" feeling that the diesel versions are more susceptible due to higher pressure in fuel lines.

This can also be simulated when the passengers are in a hurry to get out of the car, and you just try to pull out your keys, those doors get locked (where the hurrying folks decide to pull the door-open levers in advance)

Could it be something similar on that Swift.
Yes, I believe the high pressure theory. But, diesel will not explode in that case like petrol thereby giving some time.

Regarding the lock reversal thing, its same in Swift too. I always have this hurry passenger issue when my father is my co-passenger. He always do that

Regarding the incident, I still can't digest. One of the news mentions that he called fire for help. If he got that much time, then why didn't he even try to use the manual unlock (or was he ignorant of that?). If the fire started from engine bay, door latches melting so fast can be ruled out IMO.

Last edited by bhp_maniac : 30th May 2012 at 12:02.
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Old 30th May 2012, 12:28   #75
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Default Re: Swift Catches fire: Owner Dies

Request all BHPians to have this gadget in your cars always!
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