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Old 28th June 2012, 15:37   #106
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Default Re: Why this Kolaveri for the Indian Car Industry?!!

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Originally Posted by raul View Post
This is way off topic but you cannot be serious! This is one of the most corrupt countries in the world, its literally destroying us from inside, and its been like this in the licence permit raj and after so how can we use terms like 'western influenced greed' in the face of our blatant greed, materialism, scams and corruption.

Our population is going to touch 2.5 billion by 2050, are we remotely ready, it seems we are not even concerned.

The whole negativity on this thread is amazing, inspite of repeated questions on how these problems can be solved not a single person is willing to engage constructively and the 'hands up in the air' response is anti-growth negative 'let's shut everything down' because we have it. All the issues highlighted about the environment, overcrowding, resources are a symptom of our inability to govern ourselves properly. Trying to solve the symptoms without addressing the underlying cause is a recipe for failure, repeatedly.

In the 19th century there was a great fear the earth is becoming overpopulated and cannot sustain more than a billion people, the current count is 7 billion. Problems are there to be solved. That's the human spirit.
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Originally Posted by fiestarry View Post
There is no xenophobia in saying that Industrialisation is not a true solution. How much more industrialisation can you have. Please read P Sainath to understand what mining and industrialisation is doing to tens of millions of tribals in Orissa, Chattisgarh, Jharkhand and many other states.

Population control is the solution to those problems not more cars my friend

The reason that certain European nations like Sweden, Denmark, Switzerland appear to be the epitome of cleanliness, order, health, prosperity etc is not sheerly because of industrialisation. They have negative population growth. They have vast incomes from colonial time investments in Africa, Asia and South America. However, they too are facing labour shortages which they shortsightedly filled with North Africans etc and are facing acute social divides where the Original people are under a threat of being swamped by the immigrants.

No amount of Apollo, Fortis, Columbia Asia hospitals and the like can change the health care available to a poor man. They depend on clean air, water and food for good health and that is something which is under threat from factories which give them only effluents and shining cars in return. They can neither afford the cars nor the effect of pollution.
And that my friend is the reason for the state of the world.

Learn to live frugally, honestly, in non-AC spaces, eat in simple restaurants , have less children, donate a part of your income to the very poor that you care so much for, look after domestic animals, drive only when essential, use public transport, create carpools, dont encourage bribery or excessive tipping to get your way, smile more often...and ask people around you to do the same ...

And see the change
raul and fiestarry, I must tell you both are good thinkers and absolutely right in your own terms. Keep going with the same attitude.
raul when you say problem are there to be solved, one should also think about the root-cause of the problem, why there is a problem at first place? Good that we are going to solve it any ways. - thats human spirit.

What fiestarry point is to concentrate on those root-cause also, to avoid some foresighted problems (already faced by developed countries, albeit it roughly means Western countries!), I don't think he is asking to going Swadeshi!

The only answer to this "Kolaveri di" is Inclusive Growth. We Indian deserves more cars, luxury cars but at the same time the common man at the bottom of hierarchy should lead a better life. He may not be able to afford a treatment at Apollo but he should get the same (except some non-essentials/luxuries) treatment from Govt Hospitals. He may not afford a car but he should at least feel proud while traveling by Govt. run city buses.

My request to Moderator, not to delete these posts please. These are off topic but surely adds vales at a broader sense.
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Old 28th June 2012, 19:39   #107
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Default Re: Why this Kolaveri for the Indian Car Industry?!!

[quote=fiestarry;2823036]
Quote:
Originally Posted by raul View Post
....
Population control is the solution to those problems not more cars my friend
....
The reason that certain European nations like Sweden, Denmark, Switzerland appear to be the epitome of cleanliness, order, health, prosperity etc is not sheerly because of industrialisation. They have negative population growth. They have vast incomes from colonial time investments in Africa, Asia and South America. However, they too are facing labour shortages which they shortsightedly filled with North Africans etc and are facing acute social divides where the Original people are under a threat of being swamped by the immigrants.
...
Are these not contradictory? The whole economic system is sustained when the "earners" are more the "need-support" people. With population control, we would be repeating what is happening in West (worse with no colonial wealth!)

But this apart, focusing only on the auto part, what do we need?

An affordable, convenient, efficient and eco-friendly transportation system. It could be personal vehicles (cars, bikes, etc) or public transport. By any standards, a personal vehicle system cannot be that. So the route is only public transport system. But a public transport system requires huge capital outlay from Govt. which in this country is not feasible, at least at this point. So, we are forced to resort to a personal transport system just because of insufficient funds.

In current auto scenario, do we have a vehicle which is "an affordable, convenient, efficient and eco-friendly " vehicle for the "common man", who earns say 10K/month? All of us would agree, such a thing is not available now. May be the auto industry should move away to it, so much so that the common man (a non-auto-enthusiast, who sees any vehicle as a commute mechanism) can use it. That should be the Kolaveri of the industry!
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Old 29th June 2012, 16:50   #108
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Default Re: Why this Kolaveri for the Indian Car Industry?!!

[quote=babu.sundaram;2823715]
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiestarry View Post
Are these not contradictory? The whole economic system is sustained when the "earners" are more the "need-support" people. With population control, we would be repeating what is happening in West (worse with no colonial wealth!)
But a public transport system requires huge capital outlay from Govt. which in this country is not feasible, at least at this point. So, we are forced to resort to a personal transport system just because of insufficient funds
Population control and negative growth are like comparing well trimmed haircut and a shaven head. Please use your imagination and you will see reason.
The Govt is already incurring huge expenditure in education, health care, public distribution system, oil subsidy, MNREGA, supporting sick PSUs, bearing the President's foreign travel cost and a million other such schemes. Why should public transport not be on its agenda. In fact it already is with Govt owned bus services in each state, railways, metro rails and the like. JNURM ( or whatever) is an urban bus scheme where new , low floor buses have been introduced into most cities I know.
Smaller public transport is also essential like taxis, autos, 6,7,8,10 seater autos, cycle rickshaws etc.

Cities and large towns are now beset with parking problems, tremendous air pollution , increased driving time, flyovers constructions, adulterated fuel etc. Private car ownership for people earning 60k onwards a month may be feasible and sustainable but they are a small minority.
The Govt could divert its attention from promoting car manufacture to such endeavours.
Car manufacturers on their part should focus on making cars that will be easily maintained and reliably last 20 years. Today it is difficult to find accident parts for many B+ segment(onwards) cars after merely 4 years of manufacture because headlights have been modified; bonnets, front bumpers and panels are not interchangeable with previous versions. To avoid large inventories of old version parts companies only stock them in central depots. This increases waiting times and prices. There are enough and more examples to support my statements on this forum.
All in all the sufferer is the middle class customer.
The Govt could regulate model changes by mandating that the manufacturer should not make cosmetic changes with say 7 years on a product. It could sound backward but I know that millions of car owners will retain their 5 year old cars for a further 5 years if they know it will be supportable.
More on this later.
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Old 5th July 2012, 22:27   #109
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Default Re: Why this Kolaveri for the Indian Car Industry?!!

I know this is not in direct relation to the state of the automobile industry in this country, but I think this was bound to happen sooner or later. The first solution is to have inclusive growth.

What I mean is not concentrate all the opportunities in the cities, but focus on tier 2 cities towns as well. Case in point is the IT industry, since I work for a bleeding edge innovator in the cloud space.

My workplace is situated in a very crowded area of the city, and till date I have not yet found a single reason why it should be so. If the same was moved to the outskirts, people will anyways be forced to relocate nearby, as 65% of the population working in any IT company is immigrant from other states in India.

Second is to consolidate operations as much as possible to one physical location, and this is my sequel to the previous point I mentioned.

When people live closer to workspots, travel is cheaper, no pollution... etc.

You can ask me how will all this improve the auto industry ? Yes, it will because the traffic will be spread across, and the pressure on the infrastructure will not be concentrated on just one location, which can help in people buying more cars at least to use on a weekend. But yeah it can work negatively as well.. as people wont need cars anymore since workspot is close by.. My 2 cents..
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