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Old 3rd September 2014, 08:14   #181
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

With price gap less than 10, I would say instead of spending 1-1.5L on Diesel cars, Save the Money and Enjoy a Free Revving Petrol ( I wonder which one !! with all the sub-4m rules, We have puny 1.2L petrol engines now)

Or If you still dont know what to do with that extra 1 Lakh rupee, why not upgrade to a nice Petrol Automatic ? Perfect for the Indian Traffic Jams !!!
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Old 3rd September 2014, 09:01   #182
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

The price gap has definitely made automatic petrols a more attractive option - given many have been in the mindset to buy a diesel car for a premium.
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Old 3rd September 2014, 09:06   #183
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by rajshenoy View Post
I wonder which one !! with all the sub-4m rules, We have puny 1.2L petrol engines now
Relevant question!

European cars like the VW Polo (Except in the GT TSi avatar), FIAT Punto etc are better to drive in the diesel makes! The petrols just about do their job.
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Old 3rd September 2014, 09:35   #184
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
European cars like the VW Polo (Except in the GT TSi avatar), FIAT Punto etc are better to drive in the diesel makes! The petrols just about do their job.
Yes, but that's more because our present market is so biased towards diesels. A Punto with a 1.4 T-Jet should be better than the 1.3 MJD (or even the 1.6). With these price updates, I hope engines like 1.4 T-Jet, 1.2/1.4/1.8 TSI etc. get mainstream.
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Old 3rd September 2014, 09:57   #185
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Relevant question!

European cars like the VW Polo (Except in the GT TSi avatar), FIAT Punto etc are better to drive in the diesel makes! The petrols just about do their job.
That was purely due to Everyone jumping to Diesel because of "Kitna Deti hai" and Petrol car makers had to go with Frugal engines for the sake of giving good mileage.

I owned a 1.3L Swift Petrol in the past and Even on highways i never got beyond 15-16kmpl But the car was pleasure to drive. But later on Maruti gave 1.2L and finally the current one with VVT feels tad better.

But Slowly even the diesels were focusing only on FE race. We now see MUV like Ertiga, Enjoy, Sedans like Ciaz,SX4 etc running on a puny 1.25 L diesel. A 20L Toyota Corolla runs on a 1.4L generating pathetic performance figures. Hyundai XCent Diesel, Chevy beat diesel 1.0L etc. And things started looking more ugly with Tata and Suzuki talking about tiny 800CC diesel motors powering Next gen diesel hatchbacks.

Now with prices deregulated, I bet the Diesel entry level hatch back with sub-1 L engines will surely get scrapped.

May be makers will start offering petrol engines in two flavors. for masses and higher variants with turbo charged engines etc for those who like performance.
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Old 3rd September 2014, 10:05   #186
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by rajshenoy View Post
for masses and higher variants with turbo charged engines etc for those who like performance.
Yes. Correct.

However, petrol engines are also looking in this direction for more efficiency. The 1.2 TSi for example was more efficient than the 1.6 petrol it replaced. Suzuki is developing a 1L petrol which will be as powerful and even more efficient than the current 1.4

Even TATA has joined the race with revotron.

Thankfully - the turbocharged motors are good to drive as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vb-san
With these price updates, I hope engines like 1.4 T-Jet, 1.2/1.4/1.8 TSI etc. get mainstream.
Hope so!
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Old 16th September 2014, 12:26   #187
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Petrol does make more financial sense now.
Quote:
With the price differential between petrol and diesel narrowing sharply, the extra money paid to buy a diesel variant no longer makes economic sense, says Crisil Research in a note.

The share of diesel variants in total domestic sales of passenger cars and utility vehicles has started falling since peaking at 58 per cent in fiscal year 2012-13, according to Crisil. The research agency expects the percentage of diesel vehicle sales to fall to 45 per cent for this fiscal year (2014-15) while petrol vehicles increasing their share to 55 per cent.
http://profit.ndtv.com/news/industri...mpaign=story-7

Last edited by noopster : 16th September 2014 at 17:13. Reason: Added article extract
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Old 16th September 2014, 12:30   #188
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

With the diminishing gap between Pertol and Diesel, Petrol makes better buying proposition even for a person ding 2000 kms a month.

The additional 1 lac payable for a diesel will take approx. 50 months for repayment considering a monthly run of 2000 kms.

Hence, to actually benefit from Diesel, 4 years duration is at least required.

In this 4 years, considering that your service cost is higher for a Diesel, petrol will be a safer and better bet.

How equations changes!!
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Old 16th September 2014, 12:51   #189
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Two things most calculations don't consider:

1) Higher resale value of diesel vehicle - if higher initial cost is considered, higher resale value should also be considered
2) Diesel vehicles give mileage closer to ARAI figures in day-to-day city driving as compared to petrol variants, wherein there is a bigger difference in ARAI mileage and mileage in daily drive in actual traffic

50,000 kms seems a reasonable break-even period and those who intend to use for a longer duration generally will purchase diesel. Normally aspirated 1.2 petrols in hatchbacks and compact sedans are not as fun to drive as one rarely revs to such high RPMs (approx 5400-6200 range), especially in city traffic, to derive all the power, plus torque figures are relatively low.
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Old 16th September 2014, 13:29   #190
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

There is a Crisil reporting being quoted by the media that apparently explains why a diesel engine doesn't make sense as the savings due to the price differential have come down. The problem is with the information used in the calculation, ARAI figures that are way off for petrol and nearly accurate for diesels, the articles completely ignore the biggest cost in ownership ie depreciation. Look up a classified listing and the difference between petrol and diesel is about 5 times the premium paid initially. The diesel premium is worth it if you do highway trips, with the emphasis on infrastructure by the current government long highway trips are going to be less stressful, the tank range of diesels helps here.
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Old 16th September 2014, 14:25   #191
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by avira_tk View Post
the articles completely ignore the biggest cost in ownership ie depreciation. Look up a classified listing and the difference between petrol and diesel is about 5 times the premium paid initially.
With prices between the fuels closing rapidly, it is just a matter of months before the difference in used car prices evaporates. The current used car prices reflects the trends from the previous era, with people who paid higher prices hoping for higher returns, are not able to accept the new reality. Once the clamour for diesels come down, used car prices will correct itself. Just a few months more.
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Old 16th September 2014, 14:46   #192
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
With prices between the fuels closing rapidly, it is just a matter of months before the difference in used car prices evaporates. The current used car prices reflects the trends from the previous era, with people who paid higher prices hoping for higher returns, are not able to accept the new reality. Once the clamour for diesels come down, used car prices will correct itself. Just a few months more.
Although the market might correct itself in terms of the higher demand for Used Diesel cars, but equal opportunity will be there for diesel cars as equal to petrol and no way a used diesel car will sell at the same price as the used petrol car considering all other parameters (like model, year, condition etc) being similar.

Say a new 6,00,000/- Petrol car might fetch 3,50,000/- after "X" years of usage, while a new 7,00,000/- Diesel car might fetch 4,30,000/- after the same amount of usage. (All numbers are approximates and could vary depending on the success of the specific petrol/diesel models).

So effectively the owner is losing 20,000/- out of the 1 lakh premium he is paying for the diesel, which will be definitely offset by the superior mileage of diesel.

I see lot of people ignoring this point while comparing the Diesel vs Petrol cars in terms of money value.
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Old 16th September 2014, 15:05   #193
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Individual car owners will need 6 years for a diesel car to match a petrol

http://t.co/XJTlt3pXEC
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Old 16th September 2014, 15:07   #194
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
With prices between the fuels closing rapidly, it is just a matter of months before the difference in used car prices evaporates. The current used car prices reflects the trends from the previous era, with people who paid higher prices hoping for higher returns, are not able to accept the new reality. Once the clamour for diesels come down, used car prices will correct itself. Just a few months more.
I don't think market dynamics work in exactly this manner. Demand & supply is one thing, but another important aspect is the purchase price of a new vehicle. Its not that people bought diesel vehicles at a price higher than for what it was being retailed at. If the price of the new vehicle drops, then only can it affect the resale price in a major way. Like when Honda dropped the price of Jazz by around Rs. 1 lakh, or like when Ford dropped the price of Fiesta.

There has been no drop in the ex-showroom prices of diesel vehicles, so this aspect shouldn't have any effect on the resale value of diesel vehicles. Reduced demand on the other hand, can have a bit of an impact and affect resale price, but not very drastically. Resale prices won't just drop from say Rs 3 to 2 lakhs or even to 2.5 lakhs; it might come down to say around Rs 2.85 lakhs which translates to around 5% correction, just as an example.

Also the fuel price difference is set to stabalize at the Rs 10 mark, as both fuels are now priced as per prevailing crude prices in the international oil market. This difference will not reduce to say Rs 5, barring individual state taxation policies like in Goa.

Last edited by jessie007 : 16th September 2014 at 15:23.
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Old 16th September 2014, 15:12   #195
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Default Re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

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Originally Posted by mrbaddy View Post

Say a new 6,00,000/- Petrol car might fetch 3,50,000/- after "X" years of usage, while a new 7,00,000/- Diesel car might fetch 4,30,000/- after the same amount of usage. (All numbers are approximates and could vary depending on the success of the specific petrol/diesel models).
Taking your own example, with diesel, I spend 7L and get 4.3 at sale. Total loss = 7-4.3 = 2.7.

With petrol, I spend 6L and get 3.5 at sale. Total loss = 6-3.5 = 2.5.

Now, add the interest you accumulate for the 1L saved on initial cost over several years. The 1L simply doubles to 2L in 7 years.
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