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Old 3rd August 2012, 15:56   #31
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Dear infotech58 and ess_a,

Thanks for your points.

1. Regarding FE, I assumed a 50-50 city and highway cycle. Nevertheless, I reduced the FE to 16 and 14 kmpl (from earlier figures of 17 and 15 for Diesel and Petrol respectively). The revised numbers say that diesel buyer needs to drive around 19,500 Kms each year compared to 21000 per first iteration.

2. I did not consider resale in the calculation as the model intends to answer the question "how many KMs before I recover my costs". The same can be incorporated.

I will work on these points and attach the revised XLS.

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Originally Posted by infotech58 View Post
interesting calculation. following is what i would like to see added to this financial model:
  1. different FE figures: average FE of 15 for a petrol i20 sounds difficult to achieve given i10 gives 12/13 at max in city. how does the overall calculation change if the petrol FE is assumed at 12 or 13? however, for diesel, most people will actually get 15-17 in city driving and 20 on highway with i20, you may want to tweak that in the sheet.
  2. resale value: assuming, at the end of four years, the car would be sold off, there would be a significant difference between the resale of petrol vs. diesel which IMHO shall take care of the difference in initial investment.
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Old 3rd August 2012, 16:22   #32
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

The revised model is attached. Members are welcome to suggest or work the attached xls themselves. Pl share further refinements for common benefit.

For those trying to model their own choices, just change the values in green cells and remaining will be auto-calculated. I would like to see how it works out for other makes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ess_a View Post
Agree to both points. And they are quite significant in terms of tilting the buying decision this way or that way. I don't think i20 would give more than 12kmpl in petrol and 16kmpl in diesel in city driving conditions. Instead of 20,000 km per year for breaking even, I would put this number between 14-16000 kms, depending upon the initial price difference and the average petrol vs diesel mileage of the cars.
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File Type: xls Diesel vs Petrol CBA Model for TBHP.xls (45.0 KB, 2782 views)
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Old 3rd August 2012, 20:13   #33
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by aditya101 View Post
The revised model is attached. Members are welcome to suggest or work the attached xls themselves. Pl share further refinements for common benefit.

For those trying to model their own choices, just change the values in green cells and remaining will be auto-calculated. I would like to see how it works out for other makes.
I think you should also consider the interest on the money invested which is saved by the diesel car due to high fuel economy and less price per liter.

Again there can be 2 scenarios here.

Loan v/s full payment.

1.Loan

If we take a loan on both the cars,In case of diesel we would be paying more money on the emi and saving on the fuel cost but in case of petrol its reverse. So that difference needs to be taken into consideration.

2. Full payment.

In this case of petrol car the money saved on petrol car payment can invested and gained interest on. But in case of diesel the money saved on fuel can be invested into monthly recurring deposit scheme and gained interest.

What are your thoughts on this folks?
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Old 3rd August 2012, 21:09   #34
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Over a long period of ownership, 8-10 years, diesel makes more economic sense anyway you put it.over life time ownership, present day diesel engines will easily be25% more efficient ignoring fuel prices.
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Old 3rd August 2012, 22:49   #35
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

This exercise has been done many times on the forum. Please search the forum and you will find excellent calculation models rather than reinventing the wheel.

Some of the points I remember from those threads (Sorry for being lazy to locate the thread)

Loan Vs Outright purchase
OTR Price of cars
Down payment (in case of loans)
Interest Rate (in case of loans)
Fuel Efficiency (Highway/City)
Month Running (Highway/City)
Fuel Cost (Diesel/Petrol)
Ownership Period (yrs)
Expected Resale value
Potential Earning from the money saved by opting for a petrol car (e.g. FD @10% etc)
Maintenance Costs

Thats all I think. Please search old threads. There is lot of info there.
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Old 9th August 2012, 15:25   #36
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Site for comparison between diesel & petrol, with loan option: Diesel vs Petrol Car - Analysis | Aravinda VK
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Old 9th August 2012, 17:09   #37
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz View Post
This exercise has been done many times on the forum. Please search the forum and you will find excellent calculation models rather than reinventing the wheel.

Thats all I think. Please search old threads. There is lot of info there.
I don’t think in any of comparisons one is able to determine the break-even in kilometres and all the parameters (including Resale) are considered.


Quote:
Originally Posted by msdivy View Post
Site for comparison between diesel & petrol, with loan option: Diesel vs Petrol Car - Analysis | Aravinda VK
Interesting - But most of these comparisons miss out on one important factor i.e. Resale value (though this is subjective). A diesel vehicle will generally have a better resale value and hence the overall cost of ownership will be lower and the break-even would be earlier. Also I feel, knowing the break-even in kilometres makes more sense than in years, as ones running will vary over a period of say 5 years.

Last edited by jessie007 : 9th August 2012 at 17:10. Reason: remove formatting
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Old 9th August 2012, 17:44   #38
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

I will quote an example to help clear the context.
Suppose I compare pure running costs of an Alto with a Safari. Assume alto gives 20kmpl (petrol) and Safari gives 12kmpl (diesel). If I run both cars exactly 1000km per month, with the fuel costs being Rs 75/liter (petrol) and Rs 46/liter (diesel) then the Safari costs only Rs 80 per month more than the Alto to run!!!!

Here I am comparing apples to oranges in terms of cars, but what it still shows is how much more cheaper running a diesel car is when compared to petrol. If we compare apples to apples i.e. A diesel hatch to a petrol hatch, we see that it makes more sense to look at diesel always. This too at just 1000kms/month. If we typically drive about 2.5 to 3k per month then a diesel SUV is actually cheaper to run than a entry level petrol hatch.

All excel sheets are Ok it terms of net analysis and cost of ownership and all other business management gyan. However in the real world unless I buy something so exotic (like a sports car, or a sports bike or a 'perfect' car which is not available in diesel) it makes sense to buy diesel all the time. Cheers!!!
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Old 9th August 2012, 20:16   #39
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by jessie007 View Post
Interesting - But most of these comparisons miss out on one important factor i.e. Resale value (though this is subjective). A diesel vehicle will generally have a better resale value and hence the overall cost of ownership will be lower and the break-even would be earlier. Also I feel, knowing the break-even in kilometres makes more sense than in years, as ones running will vary over a period of say 5 years.
Please help me out with this resale value factor. Yes an old diesel will fetch me more money that its petrol counterpart. But then one has also paid more for it (~1.5 lakhs comparing the Swift (Z variant) D with P). Will this factor not cancel the each other at the time of resale?
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Old 10th August 2012, 00:40   #40
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by jessie007 View Post
I don’t think in any of comparisons one is able to determine the break-even in kilometres and all the parameters (including Resale) are considered.
FYI.

Please refer to Petrol Car or Diesel Car.xls posted on http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...vs-diesel.html (The financial Truth: Petrol vs Diesel) thread.

There are more threads where this has been discussed extensively. Try this:
Enter Diesel Petrol in the search box. Make sure you select Search Titles Only and click Go.

Hope that helps.

Last edited by Rock 'n' rollz : 10th August 2012 at 00:43.
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Old 10th August 2012, 10:26   #41
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by anandjha View Post
Please help me out with this resale value factor. Yes an old diesel will fetch me more money that its petrol counterpart. But then one has also paid more for it (~1.5 lakhs comparing the Swift (Z variant) D with P). Will this factor not cancel the each other at the time of resale?
Yes it does sort of cancel out (varies from model to model) but most people only consider the upfront cost and not the resale value. You can check the illustrations on the first page only, where I have compared Swift Vxi & Vdi - the break-even is as low as around 33,000 kms (approx). So if one will be driving less than that, then only a petrol version makes sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock 'n' rollz View Post
FYI.

Please refer to Petrol Car or Diesel Car.xls posted on http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...vs-diesel.html (The financial Truth: Petrol vs Diesel) thread.

There are more threads where this has been discussed extensively. Try this:
Enter Diesel Petrol in the search box. Make sure you select Search Titles Only and click Go.

Hope that helps.
Thanks for pointing out - the excel you have mentioned is quite detailed. My idea was to have minimum number of fields and standardization in terms of mileage (ARAI) and resale value (Car Wale) - supported with illustrations of current popular cars.
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Old 10th August 2012, 22:10   #42
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by apachelongbow View Post
I will quote an example to help clear the context.
Suppose I compare pure running costs of an Alto with a Safari. Assume alto gives 20kmpl (petrol) and Safari gives 12kmpl (diesel). If I run both cars exactly 1000km per month, with the fuel costs being Rs 75/liter (petrol) and Rs 46/liter (diesel) then the Safari costs only Rs 80 per month more than the Alto to run!!!!
There are 3 costs involved in vehicle ownership - cost of acquiring, cost of running, and cost of maintaining. You have taken cognizance of only the cost of running while excluding the other two in your analysis.

I agree that if the running is like 2.5k to 3k per month then diesel makes sense between diesel vs. petrol of same model.
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Old 11th August 2012, 00:17   #43
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by jessie007 View Post
Thanks for pointing out - the excel you have mentioned is quite detailed. My idea was to have minimum number of fields and standardization in terms of mileage (ARAI) and resale value (Car Wale) - supported with illustrations of current popular cars.
I think that excel takes into consideration everything that is relevant to Petrol Vs Diesel car comparison. Its very generic in nature. All one needs to do is fill in the variable values like OTR prices of the cars being compared, Exp Ownership period, Mileage, highway running etc.

The calculation doesn't really change for 2012. Its the per ltr fuel price that needs to updated in the Excel model and we are done.

May be I am unable to see something that you are able to see. BTW there are more threads that have comparisons of popular cars. Like I said before hit search and you would find them too.
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Old 5th September 2012, 19:30   #44
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Default re: Petrol versus Diesel Cars

Quote:
Originally Posted by agambhandari View Post
Nice Study on Petrol vs Diesel! I would like to add that My family's average monthly running does not exceed 700Kms. So Petrol still makes tremendous sense for me.
We are looking to buy a compact SUV. But Sadly Cars like the Yeti or the Duster don't have a half decent Petrol Variant. Now I am compelled to buy a Diesel Car
(for which i have to pay more than a petrol)
In an Ideal World I would buy a TSI Yeti!!
couldn't agree more. Time for skoda to wake up as there are still buyers in the market who are willing to shell out for a TSI yeti.
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Old 6th September 2012, 00:35   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wordsworth

couldn't agree more. Time for skoda to wake up as there are still buyers in the market who are willing to shell out for a TSI yeti.
Considering the dismal sales of Diesel Yeti, I wonder if takers of Petrol Yeti would be more than a dozen.
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