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Old 26th August 2009, 19:27   #16
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Originally Posted by Need4Spd View Post
This is my personal observation - might upset people - but here goes.

The majority of bad traffic on our roads is caused by two main factors:
1) Poor civic sense amongst Indian road users - every body wants to do some "jugaad" and slip thru every available gap at all costs i.e. lookout for yourself and every one else be dammed.
Every single day I observe this over and over - if traffic is backed up in the right most lane as people are waiting to turn - soon there will be a huge number of people queuing up on the LEFT side and then CUTTING across to the right rather than waiting their turn in the RIGHT Lane. Similarly driving on the wrong side of the road to sneak into a turn, so on and so on - in India the "jugaad" is much prized - think of some dumb, illegal, and dangerous loop-hole to get out of the queue.
In western countries, these kinds of stupid actions will get you arrested (or killed in an accident) very quickly. So, what is rewarded here ("Jugaad") is punished everywhere else for a very good reason.
Whats to be upset about? Someone holding a mirror to our faces?
Jugaad is exactly the right word, and we don't prize it just on the roads, we prize it everywhere else as well, and that is how we live our lives, generally speaking. Clarity of purpose is regarded above fixity of principle. And what we do in the way we live our lives vis a vis our fellow citizens, we bring to the roads, with the car as a force multiplier. And education does not seem to make any difference.
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:02   #17
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To all TBHPIANS,
PS: I have posted this in a different post. Re posting for the benefit of fellow human beings

We have such a large crowd here and at least 1% (considering very minimum) of driving community. Plus their share of friends. All in all say about 3% (again considering very minimum). Then we have share of Auto and Cab users who at least read through TBHP.

Why not we take the responsibility of driving safe. Its just matter of time that everyone starts following it. To start off, why not we

Adhere to Lane Discipline and look behind before breaking the lane.
Avoid High Beams during City Drives
Avoid breaking signals, even if its late night.
Avoid Honking when at signals
Use Indicators Liberally.

And for Cabbie and Auto Users, they instruct them to follow these or refuse to pay.

I know we will have problems, but again without a problem its never a challenge.

I saw atleast 2 vehicles with TBHP stickers on them this morning on Old Airport Road and enroute to ITPL, which where being driven rashly and was caring a damm for signals. However lets not get into who they where, lets get into how to cultivate this habit of following rules.

I recently happened to go a small country in west africa, which we assume is a backward country, but trust me guys We tried tempting the driver of our cab to honk, break lanes, break signals. But God, Oh man after 3 months we were like fools in front of him. And by no means where the vehicles less. You had prado's, land rovers, hummers, land cruisers, Honda odyssey and all sorts of SUV/MUV's there.

If such a small country with area less than south India, people less than Karnataka's population.

I now in reality in front of computer we might say yes we need to do it or just shrug of this . But folks its time we start acting now. Lets not wait someone (cops) dictating what we need to do. Lets Do it.

If ants can, why not we?
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:21   #18
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i have driven in 15 countries around the world from south asia to africa, europe to middle east but driving in india is a complete different fun altogether!

my first encounter with no horns and absolute polite manners was in Uganda, East Africa!

dont let me get started about Europe! Dubai is starting to resemble india now in terms of traffic manners!

traffic manners, whats that? (just kidding guys)

Last edited by Parm : 26th August 2009 at 23:22.
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Old 26th August 2009, 23:24   #19
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u find more Indians in dubai now a days i guess
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Old 27th August 2009, 06:51   #20
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Originally Posted by deepakchiniwal View Post
u find more Indians in dubai now a days i guess
This atrocious public behaviour in all aspects of life seems to be a South Asia thing - the old greater India really! I have never visited Sri Lanka, are their roads conditions like ours?
China is also pretty bad, but I would not want that to be my benchmark anyway for a lot of things!
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Old 27th August 2009, 09:41   #21
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There is no solution to traffic in India. Unless people understand their responsibility towards it. I seriously feel colleges should have traffic lessons (Common pedestrian-driving ethics) compulsory may be once in a week.

Another biggest problem is, most of the chunk of traffic is uneducated or people from uncivilized background. I hate when any two wheeler cuts my car from left to go towards right. Recently one bike maniac cut me off from left and then within 10 mins I saw him lying on road with his bike with many scratches. He had an encounter with a Safari guy, who politely got off his car and slapped this guy on his face. I guess that safari belonged to a politician/aspiring politician. A well deserved slap I say.
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Old 27th August 2009, 10:29   #22
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Originally Posted by neoonwheels View Post

Another biggest problem is, most of the chunk of traffic is uneducated or people from uncivilized background. I hate when any two wheeler cuts my car from left to go towards right. Recently one bike maniac cut me off from left and then within 10 mins I saw him lying on road with his bike with many scratches. He had an encounter with a Safari guy, who politely got off his car and slapped this guy on his face. I guess that safari belonged to a politician/aspiring politician. A well deserved slap I say.
No disrespect, but think about this:
1. Was the slapping an act of a civilized person?
2. Is the thinking of it as well deserved also civilized?
Aren't all of us in the same category then?
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Old 27th August 2009, 10:40   #23
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We can write thousands of books on driving manners in India. Its a hopeless situation. The most lacking parameter is self discipline. If this parameter is present in Indian road users, things will improve.
The way we behave, I feel that we dont believe that others have a right to live. Parking sense is not there, driving sense is not there, the list is long.

I drive two wheeler and four wheeler, its very bad experience if one is disciplined, irrespective of the vehicle. I thought that Vadodara is worst city for traffic, but after driving baleno through A'bad traffic for long, my thoughts have changed. All cities are now facing traffic problems. Add to that the presence of buses and trucks, they deteriorate the situation.

The only solution is good public transport that is safe and not stressful. But trains and buses have become " adda " of anti social elements. The so called educated mass is also not behind. They jump dividers to cross the road on feet! Broken OVRM are very common scene, no wonder they cost so much ( manufacturers actually earn quite a bit ).

All I can say is :

1) Drive with very little arrogance.
2) Be defensive, even if it takes a some more time.
3) Dont let others take you for granted. If somebody is jumping divider to cross the road, put pressure on him/her.
4) Keep your head cool. As if you have kept ice on your head. This helps a lot.

I feel that animals are better than humans.
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Old 27th August 2009, 10:47   #24
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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post
4) Keep your head cool. As if you have kept ice on your head. This helps a lot.
That is very good advice.
What is sad is that this is actually more possible today for those of us who are fortunate to drive in cars. Most of us use AC most of the time, and are pretty comfortable inside compared to the people we curse outside - the ones that are in the heat and dust and noise and pollution.
In the past, we sat sweltering too, but I think that there was a lot less aggression exhibited then. Strange kind of a negative correlation.
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Old 27th August 2009, 10:50   #25
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I have never visited Sri Lanka, are their roads conditions like ours?
In terms of physical conditions, only marginally better. The major cities are crowded, lots of security checkpoints, and the traffic is slow. In terms of traffic behavior though, Lanka is much much better. Lights, lane rules, zebra crossings, little honking. All in all quite disciplined traffic. All a stone's throw away from India.

By the way, there is another thread on which same discussion is happening. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifti...t-drive-3.html
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Old 27th August 2009, 10:56   #26
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All in all quite disciplined traffic. All a stone's throw away from India.
A friend who holidayed there also remarked on how tourist friendly a place it is, and how relaxed he felt all the time he was there. All of us know how overseas tourists are treated here, on the other hand. We know all the jargon, the atithi devo stuff, but it all gets lost in translation.
I wonder how Sri Lanka stayed immune to the great Indian disease.
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Old 27th August 2009, 11:01   #27
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I guess we have had plenty of threads discussing the road manners.

Below are my observation:
1.) Noise pollution is on the high. My ear have become very sensitive to shrill sound produced by the horn, I need to use a cotton every time I drive & keep my windows rolled up. The noise a create a lot of stress and aggression, I keep my cool most of the time, some times I loose it & when I am pushed to the limits, I don't know what I am doing on the roads though I would realize the consequences later?

2.) If one notice for the 4 wheelers, the horns are fitted inside the bonnet, it is protected from rain and direct sunlight. As a result the effect of the horn is less which is fine. But two wheelers are fitted with powerful horns, I found it to be ear deafening & louder than the ones fitted on the 4 wheelers.

3.) Two wheelers drive like a swarm of bees, honking all time unnecessarily, cutting across gaps, they think it is the duty of the four wheelers to drive carefully and give them way. If they fear for their life they would not be cutting in such a crazy manner. They need to know that the cars can also be driven in the "fast and the furious" way.

4.) Drastic reduction in mileage after relocating to Chennai, we can save a lot on fuel if everyone drives in a sane way. Whats the point in honking and speeding all the way when one knows there is a signal 200m ahead?

What can be done to make our roads a safer place? Nothing
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Old 27th August 2009, 11:19   #28
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Is RTA the main culprit or is it the corruption in RTA which is the main root cause - you decide.

Cops are not to be blamed to the extent they get blamed. They are the front end of the whole blame game so they get the stick.

If RTA issues license only to those who pass a proper driving test, the drivers on road would be more educated and only then the cops would be in a position to effectively implement the rules.

A friend of mine had to appear for a test to enable him to get a driving license. Well, once money was paid, license was assured. However, the test had to be conducted since it is computerised and cannot be skipped. In the test, he could not identify a sign which showed an arrow turning right with a red line crossing it diagonally. So the guy conducting the test told him to click the "No Right Turn" as the answer. Thanks God, my friend only needed the license for a photo identity and not for actually driving and that he does not live in India. Imagine him driving here and turning right at a turn where such a sign is posted and causing a massive jam - is he to blame or the corruption or RTA?

The only solution is for the Indian Government to wake up and implement through the State Governments a road map over the next 5/10/20 years to progressively make driving tests tougher and ensure a corruption free environment during the tests and ensuring only genuine licenses.

Well, it is up to YOU and ME to make that difference by raising this issue on different forums till it becomes a public and media frenzy and Government has no choice but to buckle in and make licensing tougher.

Okay, okay, before you take off on me or my thoughts ... dreaming of such an India is allowed ...
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Old 27th August 2009, 11:36   #29
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Citing references which showcase that Indians are bright and intelligent race etc does not help in this case.
Because all the references quotes showcase individual intelligence.

Where we are lacking is the COLLECTIVE INTELLIGENCE.
We simply lack the ability of foresight, and thinking about the greater good.

Take this case:
We have public transport system everywhere in the world. Many Indians feel proud about ticketless travel, not knowing about the repercussions.
In Europe, ppl know that if they don't pay for it, the system will stop functioning.

THAT is the difference. Collective intelligence.
Someone jumping red light should know what consequences it can have, and how much inconvenience it will cause to others. And he should also know and have confidence in others thinking similar way.
How many drivers in India do you think follow that line of reasoning?

Why does this happen?
Frankly I don't have a clear answer - but one thing which is obvious is this:
In India, we have been raised in an environment, a society, which dictates everything about your life. All major things happen on their own, because of someone's coercion - our parents, society, religion etc

This programs us to behave in a way which is pretty selfish with narrow interest. Why? Well we know someone else is taking care of the greater good. (Society rules and regulations etc).


In more free societies, ppl are educated that with freedom comes a responsibility which ensures that our actions bear consequence to the greater good.
Hence, there is no need for a strict authority.

Now coming to the traffic and road sense scenario, in India, unfortunately the authorities are lacking the strictness, which is there in other aspects of life.
Ppl who have been programmed to behave for authoritarian rule, continue doing so in the absence of authority also - leading to chaos on the roads.

Simple example:
Everyone would've seen a rail-road crossing. Usually the road which passes over the rails is the bottleneck. (The road else where is wider, but it narrows down where the rail crosses).
Now when the gates are closed, vehicles pile up on each side.
If most ppl were thinking about the "collective responsibility" concept - no one will spill over to the opposite lane. Because you know - once the gates open - ppl from the other side of the lane will come on this lane and cause a traffic jam.

However, what happens in actual case?
Ppl start spilling over to the other lane. When gates open there is a trafffic jam. Everyone curses each other, everyone gets angry.
Most ppl at such places expect a traffic cop to monitor the movt, and control the traffic.
That's how we Indians are programmed to behave.

The only solution in current scenario will be a stricter authority. Nothign else will work unless our culture changes.
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Old 27th August 2009, 11:38   #30
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I'm sure even animals will observe road rules once they are made aware of them , unlike Indians. Life here is like a lottery , which includes driving.There are no guarantees.Sad to see that educated/aware Indians are as bad in violating traffic rules as the uneducated/unaware, so there is no role model to emulate. I feel the automobile community , from the industry/organizations to enthusiasts should work with schools to teach civic and traffic sense to youngsters at a very early age and with NGO's to spread the awareness among various localities and peoples. The Govt. can only so do so much. Proper enforcement is also essential, which is another big Achilles heel. If only one's wish was reality. Meanwhile, the chaos continues.
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