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Old 31st July 2012, 10:09   #271
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Angry Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Guys:
I don't understand one thing. If you are not satisfied with the pay or feel that you are being exploited - then please QUIT. No one is forcing you to work like slaves.
Why are you crying in front of media - that MISL is not doing this or that? No happy, then quit - simple.
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Old 31st July 2012, 10:14   #272
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

^^That attitude by the higher ups is the crux of the issue. Treating labour like a commodity in the market place. The moment you say that, you elicit a burning, mindless rage from the opposite party who knows Jobs in the mfg sector, at his level, are not easy to come by.

Last edited by Gansan : 31st July 2012 at 10:16.
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Old 31st July 2012, 10:20   #273
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Originally Posted by mohandas View Post
Guys:
I don't understand one thing. If you are not satisfied with the pay or feel that you are being exploited - then please QUIT. No one is forcing you to work like slaves.
Why are you crying in front of media - that MISL is not doing this or that? No happy, then quit - simple.
That sounds like it's coming from someone in IT industry. The IT employees today enjoy the choices and freedom like no one else in this country. It's probably difficult, but try to put yourself in their shoes. I am disappointed in Maruti because they are making lot of profit and it wouldn't cost them much to share little bit of that with their employees. Investors are important but so are the employees.
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Old 31st July 2012, 11:00   #274
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

After all other tries, now its the famous vaastu, that is expected to "correct" the problems!

Maruti Suzuki seeks help of astrologer to correct vaastu at Manesar plant - The Times of India

So, we do not even leave Japanese
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Old 31st July 2012, 11:29   #275
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Originally Posted by prakash_ajp View Post
That sounds like it's coming from someone in IT industry. The IT employees today enjoy the choices and freedom like no one else in this country. It's probably difficult, but try to put yourself in their shoes. I am disappointed in Maruti because they are making lot of profit and it wouldn't cost them much to share little bit of that with their employees. Investors are important but so are the employees.
Whether Maruti wants to share its profits with its workers or only with the Suzuki family in Japan is their prerogative and that is how typically capitalism works. But they should stop whining when the after effects of their strategy boomerang on them. What Maruti expects is to grab the maximum amount of profits by paying low wages to their contract workers and in return the contract workers should worship the Suzuki Gods for setting up a factory and providing them subsistence level pay. Actually the Japanese work culture leading up to "Karoshi" was a by-product of post-nuclear Japan where there was no option but to build everything from scratch. They still retain that work culture although they have been suffering from stagnation for over a decade, and expect everybody else to adopt the same. What the Suzuki clan should understand is India is not post-nuclear Japan.

You have actually hit the nail on the head. IT workers (including me) have lived a really luxurious cocooned life in India since "globalization" took place. Most of the IT workers, me included, somehow managed through their education (mostly core engineering streams) and opted for IT as it looked a very cozy option. Work in air conditioned offices, company sponsored trips outside India, opportunities to permanently immigrate, sky high salaries, and after so many years I have realized that most of us in IT don't even deserve 1/10th of the pay given the intelligence we demonstrate here. To top it all, the government has given tax holidays to all IT companies in India and even after enjoying it for 10 straight years the who's who of IT are crying about how it would affect their bottom lines while actually sitting on boatloads of cash piles. Not to forget they got all the land for their offices practically free. Some of the biggies in fact can get into the real estate business if IT somehow ended. The fallout of that is most of the engineers graduating during the peak of India's globalization opted for IT rather than core engineering. This has caused heavy shortage of manpower in the core sectors like civil, mechanical, electrical, you name it. India's growth story has crippled because of that and we are seeing the effects now. I know this is all but this is one of the big reasons most of us cannot empathize with the real India.

Sure labor reforms are needed, regulations should be simplified and made rational, but that doesn't mean that one particular section of folks, organizations or workers, should be allowed to walk away laughing by grabbing all the benefits at the expense of the others. That's totally unhealthy capitalism.

Last edited by samarjitdhar : 31st July 2012 at 11:57.
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Old 31st July 2012, 11:38   #276
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Profit maximization so that more money can be shipped to their headquarters is the root cause of this extreme exploitation i guess.

This thread already discussed this:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ly-maruti.html (Over-dependence on Suzuki proving costly for Maruti)
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Old 31st July 2012, 12:07   #277
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

As I have commented earlier on this thread, violence and murder should not be tolerated whatever the issue may be. I also notice on this thread and in the media, blaming India's labor laws for companies employing contract workers and how if we "liberalize" the laws and allow companies to hire and fire at will, these kind of situations will not develop.

I tend to disagree. If we change the laws and allow companies to hire and fire at will like how it is in US without proper regulatory mechanism, it will only lead to more trouble and not less.

Case in the point - please read about workers and conditions at warehouses that ship/support online retailers like Amazon and the implications of hire and fire policies:
I Was a Warehouse Wage Slave | Mother Jones

Pity the Elf Slaves of Online Shipping | Mother Jones

A Visit to the Warehouse of Soul-Crushing Sadness | Mother Jones
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Old 31st July 2012, 12:51   #278
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjothi View Post
After all other tries, now its the famous vaastu, that is expected to "correct" the problems!

Maruti Suzuki seeks help of astrologer to correct vaastu at Manesar plant - The Times of India

So, we do not even leave Japanese
Maybe, Suzuki will soon consider redesigning all cars sold in India to make them Vaastu-compliant.

Definitely not to undermine or advocate Vaastu, but I find it funny that an industry major like Suzuki (and that too from Japan) has run out of corporate solutions to solve this persistent problem. What is MSIL up to after all ?
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Old 31st July 2012, 13:00   #279
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I still fail to understand how could Suzuki not think about Disaster recovery and business continuety scenario fore hand? Most of the industries maintain healthy practices around these scenarios.

Both the top selling models at one plant ?? How could you?

Its so simple when an individual can think about de-resking the portfolio, why Suzuki could not do it, like let Desire be at one plant and swift at other. Agree both share the similar Assembly line, still??

I know, i am no expert of manufacturing techniques or production lines or lean methodologies, still its the common sense that I acquired from my Production Engineering.

Or its just that they ran out of luck this time?
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Old 31st July 2012, 13:15   #280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samarjitdhar
So lets not kill all those companies who employ contract labor. Lets kill all those contract laborers who are not feeling too happy about their condition where they are forced to survive on the bare minimum and live a life without dignity and could be potential murderers. We have nipped the problem in the bud, isn't it.
Who said about killing the workers ? but you just justify killing the management and I can't change your views/ thoughts.

I think sitting in a air conditioned office, most people here dont understand the reality of the business and economy. This country is not prosperous and till the time it is not, the worker class will not get its due. Having said that, killing the management is not justifiable or helpful. Things will not change by killing the companies but the economy needs much more money. Do you see the per capita income (which includes income of all the companies) in this country respectable?

The less educated/ less-skilled class will have to bear this unless the country gets its per capita to a respectable level and again killing the employer is not going to help as he is not the one holding back the economy.

I myself live a sub standard life compared to my counterparts in the developed world, doesnt mean I should kill my employers. I'm bearing exploitation at my level and the workers shall continue to bear at theirs unless we develop!
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Old 31st July 2012, 13:31   #281
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

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Originally Posted by SLK View Post
Who said about killing the workers ? but you just justify killing the management and I can't change your views/ thoughts.
Sir, in none of my posts have I ever justified killing anybody be it a manager or worker. But I really cannot help if you want to equate presenting an alternate viewpoint as justification for killing somebody, so let peace prevail, I really give up .

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLK View Post
I think sitting in a air conditioned office, most people here dont understand the reality of the business and economy. This country is not prosperous and till the time it is not, the worker class will not get its due. Do you see the per capita income (which includes income of all the companies) in this country respectable?
Actually its the other way round. It is only when the workers get their fair share and dues the country will be prosperous. And by fair I mean justified under the laws of the land, equal job opportunities, performance recognition, pay based on skills and work done and not exploited or disparities maintained for high profits. This in no way means communism so please don't flame me for that. There is a living example in front of our eyes which is the post world war II United States. Till the mid 70s workers actually got their fair share while the economy and industry was built and the country as a whole became prosperous. Sure they had other issues like race related, an imaginary cold war, etc. but not such terrible industrial problems. Come 1975 most of the industrialists figured out that they can make astronomical profits by breaking the unions and moving the manufacturing to cheaper locations like China. From then on its been a pretty downward spiral as the only industry that prospered in the US is moving money from one account to the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLK View Post
The less educated/ less-skilled class will have to bear this unless the country gets its per capita to a respectable level and again killing the employer is not going to help as he is not the one holding back the economy.
As I said, nobody advocates killing but what you said and I have highlighted in bold doesn't sound too right. The fact that a handful few will become amazingly affluent while the majority suffer for an unknown amount time with the hope that things might turn around for them doesn't work. Yes I know, its trickle down economics, and the world including India has been playing it since the last couple of decades. Actually almost all nations as a whole barring a few individuals have become less and less prosperous by doing this.

Last edited by samarjitdhar : 31st July 2012 at 13:32.
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Old 31st July 2012, 14:01   #282
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I wonder if some people talk about exploitation and take sides with the labor, should not ALL indians come together and shoot all corrupted babus exploiting Indians for more than 60 years?

I guess Maruti has created jobs in that region in form of suppliers and all. Is it really hard to find a similar skill set job? This is a humble question and not any statement. As per my understanding, its not only the Factory/assembling cars in the plant but the labor requirement must be spread even at supplier level as well. Now, even such suppliers must be working on how to maximize profit, which is not wrong I guess.

Violence can not be pardoned at any cost. I hope this will not shy future investment in that region by other auto/related companies.
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Old 31st July 2012, 14:21   #283
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

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Originally Posted by neoonwheels View Post
I wonder if some people talk about exploitation and take sides with the labor
If someone tells you not to run in front of a freight train or else you will come to grief, that is not taking sides with the train - or is it?

Nobody is justifying anything; let the culprits be brought to book, by all means. we are just saying history is repeating itself, and will do so again, unless some fundamental changes come about. These events are like forces of nature; against which there are no arguments.
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Old 31st July 2012, 14:40   #284
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

^^Bringing fundamental change is something Indians are not comfortable with.
As long as things work make it work. We love our comfort zone.

See even after such a big disaster instead of bringing in necessary changes, Maruti management is trying "Vaastu"!!!!!!!

I see more such incidents happening in future.
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Old 31st July 2012, 15:56   #285
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
Nobody is justifying anything; let the culprits be brought to book, by all means. we are just saying history is repeating itself, and will do so again, unless some fundamental changes come about. These events are like forces of nature; against which there are no arguments.
One fundamental change is to shift Maruti to Gujarat or anywhere else. Locals of Manesar and Maruti can not live in peace. Apparently labor want to work less and earn more whereas Maruti want to pay less for more work.

Last edited by sourabhzen : 31st July 2012 at 15:58.
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