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Old 21st July 2012, 09:46   #121
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Many of the news and article is blaming the worker and supporting the management and blaming the workers saying various non-ethical word. But in my perception our Indian corporates are not so clean and it might be MSIL fault too. Until and unless full reports comes out we cant say whom to be blamed. It might be also possible that the worker was taken ride from the management, they was forced to do some thing which they didnt agree.
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Old 21st July 2012, 09:56   #122
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Workers, irrespective of the fact that they have genuine grievances or not usually do not burn down their managers. This is calculated murder maybe instigated by maoist or foreign elements. If you look at the past China has directly protested against Japan on its own soil. It is not beyond realm of possibility that Chinese are instigating the workers through trade union wing of left to take to violence and totally disrupt worker-management relations beyond a point of return.
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Old 21st July 2012, 10:05   #123
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I think this whole bad blood during last year and now has gone to sour. Clearly the workers are being a pain with them finding ways to take revenge, Its clear from previous episodes that suzuki didn't consed much in demands, the ego between the management and worker is not harmonious et all.

Problem is that worker have made it a point to damage every time, clearly its time Maruti should leave these violent workers and for its own sake move to Gujarat or uttrakhand or any other appropriate place.

The damage is irreparable clearly, Suzuki should also hire some professionals to figure out the real causes behind, clearly it not just local temperament but the politically motivated , even competition motivated. At least suzuki can claim to have done enough for these rioters.

Last edited by aah78 : 24th July 2012 at 06:57. Reason: Post edited.
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Old 21st July 2012, 11:20   #124
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

DGM of Woodland murdered in Ghaziabad for sacking some retail workers.

Woodland DGM shot outside home in Ghaziabad - The Times of India

IMO there is a need to introspect the overall aggressive culture perpetrated around NCR - be it voilence against women or lack of respect for the laws of the land.
I dont want to generalise it but there are some fundamental issues which can not be seen in isolation.
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Old 22nd July 2012, 11:20   #125
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I hope my comments don't drag this conversation into a shouting match between different economic schools of thoughts but the argument that the workers can leave for greener pastures if they cannot endure the literal flogging and human abuse they encounter at work doesn't hold much water in India. The unemployment rate unofficially is extremely high, with a high population and scarce resources it becomes very difficult for the average citizen. I am not particularly aware of how the Tatas dealt with their labor issues in Pune but from what I have read till now it sounded similar to how they dealt with labor issues in the steel city. Generally its a mixture of cajoling, coercion, grandstanding till both sides feel they have achieved some victory to an extent they were hoping for. While the Tatas have also encountered strikes but none of them involved at least in recent times loss of life . I am not singing paeans of the Tatas here but they seem to understand labor relations a wee bit better than Maruti does. As for being well read or being aged and experienced, it doesn't necessarily make one correct all the time .

The following is an account from one of the workers in the plant printed in The Telegraph yesterday (sorry I cannot access the link for the article now)
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The working conditions don't exactly sound thrilling. And as I said earlier given the situation of our country and lack of any social safety net there are not many options for the average worker but to die of hunger or become a professional criminal. One economic school of thought does say that its the free market at work even if there is human death involved but then the same economic school of thought is curiously silent when it comes to corporate malfeasance and corruption. The problem with trade unions in India is they have become heavily politicized and are enslaved by vested interests of a few. One should also accept the existence of trade unions as part of free market principles as long as they are working together with the management to ensure the common goals of the organization while overseeing the interests and benefits of the worker.

We also should see the Suzuki group of companies in perspective. Outside India apart from producing motorcycles they are a pretty deadbeat business group and seems to be only doing much of its business in India. This country being the land of low quality and cheap bargains, for the Suzuki family to survive it is imperative for them to squeeze out whatever they can from every dollar invested. One should not be shocked that they will always try to push all the limits as much as they can when compared to other groups because the other business groups either have more market penetration or are much more diversified. As of today, they have declared a lockout to figure out what to do and if they do not fix the fundamental issues then these unfortunate acts will be repeated. It can be an easy decision to shut down Manesar and move bag and baggage to Gujarat but what I suspect would happen is Narendra Modi will be only importing the problems from Manesar into his region. All the above is my personal opinion and apologies upfront if anyone finds them offensive.
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Old 22nd July 2012, 13:16   #126
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I tend to agree with samarjitdhar.

While any type of violence is unjustified, not acceptable by labor unions or anyone, we should not ignore the other side of the picture.

In the name of efficiency & cost optimization, manufacturers may be going a bit too far.

There has to be limit to these cost optimization efforts especially when it comes to human beings.

This reaction by workers may be the outcome of continuous work pressures & deteriorating work conditions they have been going through over a period of time.
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Old 22nd July 2012, 13:24   #127
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

While I would theoritically support that the Maruti factory should be relocated to Gujarat, I think what would happen to the 3200 workers at the Manesar factory and other industries which may move out fearing labour unrest and damage to life?
The existing crime rates will go on a high with these workers having no means of livelihood and hence resorting to mugging or robbery for sustenance.

When the Mumbai Pune expressway was being laid, We used to hear of many local adivasis or tribals, who used to resort to looting random vehicles on the expressway at night on certain stretches. It seems after surrendering their land to the government for making the expressway, they squandered all of the little compensation on alchohol. No farming land to earn, so dacoity was the only option. Hope the same does'nt happen to Gurgaon and NCR.
There is already a perception on the low safety. It would become unlivable.

Last edited by hrman : 22nd July 2012 at 13:26. Reason: numbers corrected
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Old 22nd July 2012, 19:16   #128
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

I saw a lot of people saying - "Oh well, this is India". India is made by us. Each one of us. The fault is not of India. Its of Indians.

We can go find better places to live, or can try to make this place a better one to live.

If we need change, it should happen with us. The problem is not with the goons, the politicians, NCR or anything else. Its with each one of us.

The question is = Can we change ?

1) Can we NOT resort to short cuts, but work hard for what we yearn ?
2) Can we the best in what we do and expect the best in return ?
3) Can we throw away the "chalta hai" attitude ?
4) Can we seriously believe in the dignity of life and not influenced by caste,creed, money or language?
5) Can we instill values in our younger ones and teach them the value of creation and not consumption?

We are here because of our forefathers' hard work or our own hard work. But, there is a huge element of luck that has made our lives what it is. What if we were born in an impoverished family with no access to education, nothing to hope for ? Do our little "petrol /diesel toys" matter to them ? I don't think so.

We believe that the only responsibility we have is to pay taxes. All the development efforts lies with the Government because they collect taxes from us. Is paying tax only our responsibility ?

We spend a lot on our luxuries (for prepping up our rides,for that exotic vacation,for that indispensable gadget, you name it). How much do we give to the poor souls that were not as lucky as us? Be it as money or as our time/efforts?

Its easy to blame that the poor are poor because they spend their entire earnings on alcohol. Yes, it is true, but why do they resort to it? If there is no HOPE for change, what will all of us resort to ?

Why do the "developed" nations have better standard of living ? Is it because their citizens sulked and escaped to better places or did they put in their sweat and blood in making their country a better one ?
Its easy to blame the British /the Dutch /the Portuguese /the Mughals or (put your favourite tormentor here) for our plight. Yes, we were looted. Yes, our land was raped. Are we such losers that we still blame them for our plight ? Even after 65 years of "Independence" ?

What will make all of us proud again to be an Indian and make us work for India ? Another war with Pak or China perhaps?

We need a second struggle for independence. This time, for the freedom of our minds.

- Ramblings of another selfish, ignorant, callous, preachy, I-pay-my-tax-so-i-don't-care Indian.

PS: My heartfelt condolences to the family of Mr.Dev. If any of Mr.Dev's dear and near one is reading this - Please don't direct your anger at one person or 3000 people. These people are just a representative of a larger malaise.

A larger malaise, which is our mindset.
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Old 22nd July 2012, 22:35   #129
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker View Post
Workers, irrespective of the fact that they have genuine grievances or not usually do not burn down their managers. This is calculated murder maybe instigated by maoist or foreign elements. If you look at the past China has directly protested against Japan on its own soil. It is not beyond realm of possibility that Chinese are instigating the workers through trade union wing of left to take to violence and totally disrupt worker-management relations beyond a point of return.
now don ;t say that ISI is also involved in strike and they have moles in MSIL . common this is a straight workers - mgmt conflict in a private entity with a history.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hrman View Post
When the Mumbai Pune expressway was being laid, We used to hear of many local adivasis or tribals, who used to resort to looting random vehicles on the expressway at night on certain stretches. It seems after surrendering their land to the government for making the expressway, they squandered all of the little compensation on alchohol. No farming land to earn, so dacoity was the only option. Hope the same does'nt happen to Gurgaon and NCR.
This is another side of a multiple facet coin . GGN off lately is seeing many billionaires due to land and real estate. Audi ;s and BMW are normal and the corrupt system has ensured that a normal peace loving person either stays inside house or must retaliate to protect himself . there is no other option .

IMO by declaring a black out, MSIL is trying to pressurize the govt as they know fully that it will affect those directly who has booked swifts / Dzires . a govt intervention will also give a bit of legitimacy to mgmt ;s stand on the issue .

personally I was thinking of buying a Alto K10. Not anymore now . Moving Out of GGN to Gujarat is not a option IMO. for new projects they may shift but they must continue with what ever they have already build in GGN.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 07:36   #130
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Originally Posted by .sushilkumar View Post
now don ;t say that ISI is also involved in strike and they have moles in MSIL . common this is a straight workers - mgmt conflict in a private entity with a history.
there is no worker-management 'conflict' here. The 'workers' have eliminated the management.

how many private entities with a history has their entire top-level management been massacred by workers.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 09:43   #131
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Naxalite hand in Maruti violence? - The Times of India

Quote:
The bloody and systematic attack on the senior management at Maruti's Manesar plant may have been the result of Naxal influence, according to sources within the government. Intelligence agencies have been asked to investigate whether Maoists are infiltrating trade unions in the Gurgaon-Manesar belt, which has witnessed serious labour trouble in the past few years, added the sources.
...

Meanwhile, social activist Sandeep Pandey — winner of the Ramon Magsaysay Award in 2002 — met trade union representatives of Maruti's Gurgaon plant. Another well-known activist, Swami Agnivesh, is understood to have sought time for a meeting.

...

In an interview to TOI, Maruti MD Shinzo Nakanishi confirmed that it appeared to be planned attack, rather than a spontaneous outburst. The mob first smashed CCTV cameras before specifically targeting senior Maruti officials.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 10:49   #132
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

This horrible incident at Manesar has a distinct political stench to it.

Quite a few years ago, I was working in a factory in Gurgaon's Udyog Vihar and at that time my uncle was the Gen.Secretary of the Chambers of commerce of the same. There was a massive strike and somewhat of a riot outside the Hero Honda factory. In this case a number of workers were sacked and corresponding documents describing their lack of efficiency were put up on notice boards for all and sundry to see. A huge number of cops arrived on the scene and The labour was dispersed after a lathicharge. In less than a week all was back to normal, none of the fired workers were reinstated and the factory went on to work as usual.

Now when a similar situation happens at Maruti Udyog, Manesar, there is no sight of the cops. Maruti is way bigger than any company in Haryana and the government knows very well what it means to Gurgaon. It is because of Maruti that today Gurgaon has its position as a commercial and industrial hub in India, else it might have been another dusty suburb. Someone in this thread rightly said that Gurgaon owes a lot to Maruti and not vice versa. Still the police ignored the frantic calls from the management and let the Labour go on rampage and the factory burn, people get thrashed and an innocent person burn to his death.

WHY?

The plain answer that seems to me is " Vote bank Politics". The respected authorities did not act evasively maybe because someone in the Political higher ups of Gurgaon felt that it is better that He/She preserve his/her vote bank and appease the bulk voters than pacify a handful of management present at the factory. This has been the case for far to long. What they do not realize is that it is not the labour class, but us the management class, the industrialists, the shopkeepers and the service class who pay taxes and have made Gurgaon what it is today. If more than half of Haryana's revenues come by Gurgaon it is not only because of the labour present in the factories but also because of the hard working middle class and the enterprising upper class of Gurgaon. It is high time that the government gives us our due and treats us equally, not just like a minority who's presence or absence does not make any difference to their winning or loosing of elections. With a massive population like our, labour can be outsourced from anywhere in the country but finding the right environment for growth of Industry is difficult.

Also in this case what made matters worse is that the Local labour class of Gurgaon is very rowdy and high headed. The villagers in and around Gurgaon think that they own the city and they can do as they please. Those who are poor vent their anger and frustration by causing unfortunate incidents like the one in the Maruti factory and those who have suddenly become rich by selling their lands or by taking rents from the labor class in villages, create ruckus at pubs and malls, eve teasing women and picking up petty fights. Talking about hypocrisy,with Maruti locking down the factory at Manesar the same have come down on streets protesting for their livelihood. They are worried that if the factory keeps shut for a longer period or if it reallocates what will happen to their salaries and the rents which they receive from the labor class, respectively. With such people being a majority but not substantial contributors to the growth of Gurgaon it is hard for Gurgaon to become a world city of the future.

The government must immediately take actions against the perpetrators of violence and dole out strictest of punishments to the instigators of the mob. A clear message has to be sent to the industry, that the government is with them and justice will prevail no matter what the cost.

I am sorry if I offended anybody, I am just putting my point of view and I know it is not the only point of view.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 11:09   #133
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Here is a piece of somewhat-bright looking news for those who have booked Swifts and DZires and have been affected by this. I am also one of those waiting patiently for my Swift ZDi to arrive.

'Lockout at Manesar won't affect dispatch ops' - Hindustan Times

According to the link, there are 26,000 (manufactured) cars in Manesar's stockyard at the moment and the dispatch operations will continue uninterrupted, to dealers across the country. I spoke to my sales advisor and manager at the dealership and they said the incoming car stocks will come in at the same usual rate at least for the next month or two.

The current stop on production will start affecting dispatch operations only from September or so, according to the dealership here.

If you have booked your Swift and are wondering whether to shift to another brand because of this new fiasco, do not despair. In all probability, your car may already be manufactured and may be awaiting dispatch.

P.S - Owing to the lockout, all Maruti dealerships are expecting an order from Maruti to stop taking new bookings for Swift and DZire with immediate effect, and new bookings will be accepted only once the production resumes at Manesar (which is quite a while away, considering Maruti's stipulation that the culprits need to be caught first before the lockout is lifted).

Last edited by KarthikK : 23rd July 2012 at 11:16.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 11:23   #134
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

According to one eye witness there were a couple of thousand outsiders in the me-lee. So has to be planned and orchestrated.
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Old 23rd July 2012, 12:15   #135
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Default Re: Strike woes haunt Maruti's Manesar plant again. 1 DEAD & Production hit

Quote:
Now when a similar situation happens at Maruti Udyog, Manesar, there is no sight of the cops. Maruti is way bigger than any company in Haryana and the government knows very well what it means to Gurgaon. It is because of Maruti that today Gurgaon has its position as a commercial and industrial hub in India, else it might have been another dusty suburb. Someone in this thread rightly said that Gurgaon owes a lot to Maruti and not vice versa. Still the police ignored the frantic calls from the management and let the Labour go on rampage and the factory burn, people get thrashed and an innocent person burn to his death.

WHY?

The plain answer that seems to me is " Vote bank Politics". The respected authorities did not act evasively maybe because someone in the Political higher ups of Gurgaon felt that it is better that He/She preserve his/her vote bank and appease the bulk voters than pacify a handful of management present at the factory. This has been the case for far to long.
+1
It is quite fishy that the cops didn't arrive on the scene in time when 3000 rioters, majority non-employees were marauding through the nations premier car manufacturing company. And also is quite suspicious that no significant arrests have been made till date after an event of such large magnitude has passed. Suggests of connivance at some higher level. Maybe the maruti management refused to pay hafta to some lobby. Obviously killing the goose that lays the golden eggs along with the golden eggs has never been a bright idea but Haryana has never been known for it's far-sighted political leadership.
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