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Old 27th September 2012, 21:36   #16
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

I see so many premium sedans being driver driven. Wont the owners not mind a manual if it can save a few lakhs ? I also feel for the low volumes in India, car makers dn't want to have a manual/auto line up
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Old 27th September 2012, 22:22   #17
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

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I see so many premium sedans being driver driven. Wont the owners not mind a manual if it can save a few lakhs ? I also feel for the low volumes in India, car makers dn't want to have a manual/auto line up
+1 to this. Most of the premium cars are chauffeur-driven and wouldn't the introduction of manual transmission reduce prices which would allow greater access to that population that don't know how to use an automatic transmission! Believe me, I know many owners of D1 segment sedans that buy manuals as they consider automatics to be too complicated, expensive and difficult to maintain in the long run.

Keep revvin'
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Old 27th September 2012, 22:38   #18
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

Demand of the consumers as well as our traffic is to be blamed for this reason. I love Driving but driving a MT car in our traffic in the wee hours is certainly not an easy task and not something that people would enjoy...even an enthusiast won't. Courtsey - our epic traffic. And high-end ATs doesn't really kill the fun. Thanks to the triptronic and flappy paddles. Having said that, I do agree with S@ndy and narayan that MTs should be optional for our country! There certainly isn't any car in the 30-50L range which is manual I reckon. Maybe the manufacturers find it expensive to make as the demand is low? Read somewhere that even the next-gen M5 and M6 won't have a manual option as they are a money loser for the brand because of the low demand globally.
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Old 27th September 2012, 22:41   #19
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

I would say automatic transmission have the lions share of the market in the western world which is the primary target market for all the major car players. There is simply no/very less demand for stick driven cars considering the high speed driving conditions.

Converting an automatic to manual requires lot of money which cannot be justified by low sales volume. Hence all manufacturers stay with automatics and they don’t care to go the manual way.
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Old 28th September 2012, 00:34   #20
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

To all those I-love-manual-gears guys, please use an AT for 3 months. ( No, a 2 KM drive won't convert you). Use it for 3 months and during these 3 months abstain from an MT car and then come back and tell me if you still like an MT car.

I'm a big convert myself from MT to AT. But first month wasn't smooth. Transition is not easy when you are brought up on a diet of MT cars. But now I'm hooked. Never will I buy an MT again. Petrol or diesel? I don't care. It has to be an AT.
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Old 28th September 2012, 01:12   #21
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

99% of the people looking to buy a premium car in India want their cars to be fitted with automatic transmissions. Some of them find it silly when premium cars come with manuals because they expect the car to swap-cogs. Their logic? "I'm spending 50 lakhs, so why should I change gears?" While several enthusiasts believe that shifting gears is the be-all-and-end-all of automotive nirvana, the rich and affluent in India would rather take the practical route.

In a nutshell, there is simply no demand.

On a similar note, most manufacturers are looking to engineer automatic-transmissions that may eventually replace conventional manuals, citing fuel-economy, emissions and outright performance / numbers. It's rumored that the new 991 type 911 GT3 will not have a manual, which is sad because it's the holy-grail of driving epitome.

EDIT: I also believe that premium brands in India prefer pushing ATs as MTs may command higher running costs due to constant stop-start traffic conditions i.e. replacing a clutch that may cost upward of 50k every twenty-thousand kilometers will burn several holes even in relatively deep pockets.

Last edited by suhaas307 : 28th September 2012 at 01:15.
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Old 28th September 2012, 01:29   #22
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

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Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
To all those I-love-manual-gears guys, please use an AT for 3 months. ( No, a 2 KM drive won't convert you).

I don't care. It has to be an AT.
I am one of those manual gears guys. I have driven various types of cars with different gearboxes for long periods of time. MT, AT, tiptronic and flappy paddle. I still prefer the manual for highway driving just because I enjoy a nice gearbox with good shifts.

In a place like Bangalore, I would definitely prefer an automatic as there is no strain on your left leg or your left hand, but overall I still like a manual. Maybe it has to do with the fact that I grew up and learnt on a manual, and possibly because of the fact that I do occasionally rest my hand on the gear lever (a bad habit, i know, but still) but I always feel comfortable with a manual.
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Old 28th September 2012, 01:45   #23
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

There are virtually no enthusiasts in India. We are too practical, too sensible, too conservative, too balanced, too well adjusted to demand cars built to please the single minded driving enthusiast.
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Old 28th September 2012, 07:46   #24
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But in countries such as UK, brits there prefer manual sticks to autos. Don't the manufacturers fulfil their demand by introducing manuals there? What I wish is that Manufacturers may atleast keep MT as an option. I believe that virtually there are no enthusiasts but still I hope such day will come when they would give enthusiasts MT as optional.

Now for.eg:- The Porsche Boxster will be sold with a 6 or 7 speed manual in UK but in India, we'd get the PDK instead of 6 or 7 speed manual. I wish when Boxster gets launched they keep MT just as an option atleast!


pgsagar, I understand that you prefer convenience of AT than continuous use of MT. But still, there are some that prefer MT than AT even though it is bumper to bumper traffic. I have driven all types of cars including paddle shifters, Tiptronic, DSG etc. and although they're very convenient but still, most engaging are the manuals only.

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Last edited by ajmat : 28th September 2012 at 08:51.
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Old 28th September 2012, 08:21   #25
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

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Originally Posted by S@ndy View Post
But in countries such as UK, brits prefer manual ones to the automatic ones. Do these premium manufacturers don't fulfil the demand there? Considering Cars in UK are right hand side configured
Not at the higher end, D segment onwards. Also taxation (both road and company car perk tax) is now based on emissions, AT cars don't always win on the emission front. Most C segment cars onwards are company owned
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Old 28th September 2012, 08:22   #26
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

2013 Ford Mustang Shelby 500 GT with no less than 650 horses comes with a 6 speed manual transmission as standard! True enthusiasts still drive MTs!!
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Old 28th September 2012, 09:54   #27
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

Quote:
Originally Posted by narayan View Post
I see so many premium sedans being driver driven.
Quote:
Originally Posted by S@ndy View Post
+1 to this. Most of the premium cars are chauffeur-driven
For my chauffeur-driven car (and NOT my self-driven), I would prefer an Automatic transmission. Surprised? Don't be. Reasons:

1. No jerks. In 20 years of hiring chauffeurs, I've noticed that 10% have a smooth driving style.

2. No riding the clutch.

3. No choosing the wrong gear by the chauffeur (either too high a speed in too low a gear, or vice versa).

Also, remember that the typical premium car owner would drive himself at night and on the weekend. Most simply prefer to drive Automatics.

Then, there's the question of resale : Due to market preferences, AT premium cars sell faster & at a higher price than MT.
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Old 28th September 2012, 09:59   #28
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

Quote:
Originally Posted by narayan View Post
I see so many premium sedans being driver driven. ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by S@ndy View Post
+1 to this. Most of the premium cars are chauffeur-driven ...
Agree, most I know are chauffeur driven. If I were deciding a 10+ lakh car, I would prefer to give a car with NO clutch to the driver. That ways, at least I don't have to be worried about the driver riding the clutch / messing with a complicated gear box!
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Old 28th September 2012, 11:54   #29
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

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Originally Posted by karan561 View Post
That the these biggies i.e. the MBA's (Merc , BMW , Audi ) to bring in their stick shift is the warranty;

They feel the Indian customers (general public/chauffeurs) are not mature enough to drive their cars or how much & when to use clutch & we may bust the clutch in their warranty period & they will have to give a free replacement. So to avoid all this mess they straight offer the A/T , so that there is nothing to worry about.
Ironically, if that is true, Skoda has had more trouble reported with DSG boxes failing than clutch wear issues

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Originally Posted by Harbir View Post
Because there are not enough driving enthusiasts in India to justify the risk of stocking up on inventory that won't shift quickly. Its understandable that they wouldn't do manual production here, but they don't risk bringing in a handful of manuals even in the case of CBUs. Not even on order.
This seems to be the explanation that best covers the facts, IMO.

Quote:
They feel validated in auto-only decision. there are no manual transmissions in cars like the Mini Cooper S or the E90 BMW 330i or the S4, but Indian enthusiasts have expressed no outrage, neither on forums like this one, nor in Indian car magazines, nor in letters to the editor, nor in clear statements to dealers.
What's stopping you?
I think it's a crime that Minis and 3-ers are offered without MT option.

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Leave aside the "premium cars", even the Laura AT outsells the MT by a huge margin. Customers spending over 10 lakhs love ATs and, considering Indian traffic conditions, you can't blame them, can you?
Rush- there may be a different explanation for that. The Laura MT option is offered only with a detuned 110PS engine (AT comes with 140 spec). Couple that fact with how smooth and "Mt-like" the DSG box is and it's a no-brainer.
VW thankfully offers the 6-speed MT option on highline.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
For my chauffeur-driven car (and NOT my self-driven), I would prefer an Automatic transmission. Surprised? Don't be. Reasons:
1.
2.
3.
+
+
Very interesting analysis. I agree for the most part. When I do eventually graduate to the luxe segment, will prefer an AT for these reasons, but it has to be a reliable box (hopefully DSG will stabilise by then.
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Old 28th September 2012, 12:58   #30
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Default Re: Why don't manufacturers bring manual transmission in their premium models?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
For my chauffeur-driven car (and NOT my self-driven), I would prefer an Automatic transmission. Surprised? Don't be. Reasons:

1. No jerks. In 20 years of hiring chauffeurs, I've noticed that 10% have a smooth driving style.

2. No riding the clutch.

3. No choosing the wrong gear by the chauffeur (either too high a speed in too low a gear, or vice versa).

Also, remember that the typical premium car owner would drive himself at night and on the weekend. Most simply prefer to drive Automatics.

Then, there's the question of resale : Due to market preferences, AT premium cars sell faster & at a higher price than MT.
I agree whole heartedly with you. But can you elaborate why AT apremium cars sell faster at a higher price than MT? This may sound a dumb question but still, am very keen to get the answer. Thank you!
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