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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:08   #376
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

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Originally Posted by sriramv.iyer View Post
The OTR price in Bangalore is close to 10L :-) - Comes with 1.2 TSI and 7 Gear DSG.
Doesn't that dig the grave already? Yikes!

Isn't the anticipated customer response from the Indian consumer a NO-BRAINER?
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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:12   #377
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10l otr is a joke xD what's the point of the excise duty benefits this car comes with? VW has over priced this way too much 8-9 otr would be reasonable considering the dsg.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:14   #378
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

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Originally Posted by allajunaki View Post
Hi,
The guy who bought the car to front of showroom told me to "use left leg for brakes" .

but when it works, it works, better than a manual
.
Can't believe that our salesmen are still in that era, when we were still making ourselves aware that not changing gears manuallly with the left hand and left leg is also an option.

Your "works, better than manual" sums it up very nicely. This is probably the future and why should we complain when efficiency and shift quickness wise we are at par (or even better) than the conventional manual transmission.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:36   #379
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

You need to look at this car differently to realise it's true potential. It's obviously not going going to change the fact this will never be a hot seller but nonetheless, let me give a different perspective on this.

The Polo TSi if priced close to 10L is sort of justified. It's after all a niche product.

In that same segment, the options you have are:

1. The Amaze - It's around 9.5L for the top end S. It's the most practical option if you need practicality and space. The engine is very decent but the old school torque converter is just about average and saps a lot of the performance.

2. The i20 1.4L 4 speed AT. 4 speed AT and Hyundai's petrol horses are more like ponies. The 4 speed just kills that even further.

3. The Scala/Sunny. Again very good but extremely boring. Only a choice if your looking for space and an AT.

4. Skoda Rapid: Outdated engine, outdated gearbox. Enough said. Space is better and it has a boot.

5. Ford Fiesta: This is the only one that comes close to the Polo TSI but it's priced at almost 11-12L on road here.

You cannot compare the Polo TSI with any of the AT hatches because the engine, performance and gearbox are way ahead than any hatch back like the i10, Ritz or Brio. Moreover, those 3 hatches are one segment lower compared to the i20, Polo and Swift.

I am wondering if VW has thought of getting this 1.2L TSI DSG option in the Vento. It will be the best AT sedan to buy within 15L segment.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:46   #380
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by allajunaki View Post
In Tiptronic mode, you get to choose when to do the up / down shifts ( The gear lever will be slotted into mode where you will have +/- options or a paddles behind the steering wheel).
Quote:
Originally Posted by spyder918 View Post

Tiptronic is a auto tranny that has with a kind of switch that just tells the automatic transmission when to shift, you shift it + to increase the level, - to reduce it. It can have number of shift maps selected by the microprocessor to sharpen the shifts by holding some shift points longer per selection by user
Thanks guys. I was aware of the S mode and D mode after reading the Fiesta Automatic review, and also about paddle shifts after seeing my pal's Civic Automatic.

It was the word 'tiptronic' that confused me. So does this mean there are some buttons on the steering wheel marked as '+' and '-' for shifting gears? I did see similar ones for cruise controls in US cars.

Last edited by vnabhi : 23rd April 2013 at 14:48.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:51   #381
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
It was the word 'tiptronic' that confused me. So does this mean there are some buttons on the steering wheel marked as '+' and '-' for shifting gears? I did see similar ones for cruise controls in US cars.
The +/- on steering wheel on cars in US is for cruise control only, not for gears. The Civic has the +/- behind the steering which are the paddles.

The tip tronic is in the gear lever is a +/- which can be engaged by pushing the gear to the left in D mode. Once you do this gear shifts happen by tapping the lever forwards or backwards. This pic will explain clearly:

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Old 23rd April 2013, 14:58   #382
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
The +/- on steering wheel on cars in US is for cruise control only, not for gears. The Civic has the +/- behind the steering which are the paddles.

The tip tronic is in the gear lever is a +/- which can be engaged by pushing the gear to the left in D mode. Once you do this gear shifts happen by tapping the lever forwards or backwards. This pic will explain clearly:
Many thanks. As the saying goes-'a picture is worth more than a 1000 words'.

I can see that the '+/-' lever is very small, so wont operating it be a wee bit difficult?
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:00   #383
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

This is a very good demonstration of the different ways of using the VW DSG gear box.




Last edited by drpudhi : 23rd April 2013 at 15:02.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:01   #384
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
Many thanks. As the saying goes-'a picture is worth more than a 1000 words'.

I can see that the '+/-' lever is very small, so wont operating it be a wee bit difficult?
Just the text is small. The lever moves distinctively to the left when tapped. After that the +/- is done by pushing the gear lever up or down. It's like an inch of movement. The lever is spring loaded so just tap it up or down to move up/down a gear. It's good fun actually but involves removing your hand from steering as opposed to paddle shifts.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:30   #385
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
You need to look at this car differently to realise it's true potential. It's obviously not going going to change the fact this will never be a hot seller but nonetheless, let me give a different perspective on this.
True

Quote:
The Polo TSi if priced close to 10L is sort of justified. It's after all a niche product.
Niche yes. Justified No

On the pricing, will present a slightly different perspective.
VW Polo with the 3-pot engine highline = 7.00 - 50k discounts = 6.50. Discounts exist because this engine is terrible in every way plus space is at a premium in the Polo especially compared to the i20, Liva and the likes.

The 1.6 was priced 100k over the 1.2. So if we say the 1.2 TSI is very modern, very hi-tech compared to the 1.6; the excise benefits compensate for the TSI hi-techness.

So that is 6.5 + 1 lak = 7.5 lakh.

Now add DSG. True that it is much better than the traditional autos. But is it reliable. No. Do we believe VW will stand behind the gearbox failures in India. No. Dont we pay a price for reliability with other consumer retail stuff. So I would say, that this should take the DSG premiumness

So finally 7.5 + 1 lak for the DSG should give you a 8.5 OTR Bangalore. Now still add a niche premium of 50k, you will still have 9.00.

Hence 10.00 is not justified for a correct final (keys in the hand) selling price.

Small correction on the Amaze pricing, the Amaze S AT is 8.00 on road Bangalore while the VX is 9.1x on road.

Last edited by dipen : 23rd April 2013 at 15:34.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:41   #386
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by spyder918 View Post
9 - 9.5 is expensive and not fully justified to what is being provided, considering the DSG 7speed gearbox stories. Question is it wise to choose the saloons - vento or skoda rapid automatic then by investing bit more..

Also just heard just now that Skoda is giving the Rapid limited edition called prestige now.. with features like satellite navigation, parking sensors and some cosmetic changes, 1.6 diesel, at 9 lacs ex-showroom, but not sure if only manual or both manual and automatic.. please update if anyone knows on this
1) 9.5 lakhs ex showroom is pricey, whichever way you look at it. However, there are two ways to look at this:

- A petrol hatchback with a potentially dodgy gearbox @ the price of diesel sedans. No thank you, I want more metal for the money.

- A really quick petrol hatch mated to a convenient DSG 'box that let's you have some fun? For 10 lakhs? Your next best bet is the naturally aspirated Mini Cooper (non S) that makes 20 horses more but it's more than twice the price!

Now if you are the sort who relies on one car for all the purposes, i.e. School run, office run, the occasional drive to Goa or Ooty, then forget about the Polo TSI, you're wasting your time @ 10 lakhs, you get several cars that will prove to be more practical than the VW.

But for those looking to buy a second car predominantly for city driving, and you do 15-20 km in a day / on an average, it's a no brainer. That is, if you don't mind blowing 10 lakhs on a second car.

2) The only diesel car that comes with an automatic is the Verna. The Rapid / Vento diesels come only with manuals
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Old 23rd April 2013, 15:45   #387
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by dipen View Post

So finally 7.5 + 1 lak for the DSG should give you a 8.5 OTR Bangalore. Now still add a niche premium of 50k, you will still have 9.00.

Hence 10.00 is not justified for a correct final (keys in the hand) selling price
Depends on the state but you are forgetting one small thing.

6.5 + 1L(for TSI) + 1L (for DSG) + 50K for niche premium is 2.5L over the ex-showroom price. In Bangalore a 2.5L price increase in ex-showroom equates to a 60-70K increase in road tax and insurance. That anyways brings it close to 10.

Quote:
Small correction on the Amaze pricing, the Amaze S AT is 8.00 on road Bangalore while the VX is 9.1x on road.
This is the price list that was posted in the Amaze thread:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attac...413_184630.jpg

It says S-AT is 8.3L and VX-AT is 9.37L.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 16:02   #388
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

I think VW cannot afford to charge too much of a premium for GT TSI. Polo is their cheapest model in a country which is very value conscious. They cannot be seen to associate unsustainable premiumness with Polo - Honda failed with Jazz and Skoda did the same mistake with Fabia during launch.

If we look at the premium B seg hatch, Hyundai already has a much more powerful 1.4L petrol automatic i20. Forget the 4 speed auto-box for a moment (how many people out there actually care if its a 4-speed or DSG), in terms of pure proposition the 1.4 i20 petrol is similar to what VW is trying with Polo GT. How many 1.4s does Hyundai manage to sell? That when i20 overall has a much higher sales figure.

Yes we enthusiasts will drool over DSG, but from a company's perspective, huge premium is unsustainable to charge. I hope VW weighs everything and learns from other as well before the launch of GT.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 16:02   #389
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by dipen View Post
True

Niche yes. Justified No
Pricing is still speculative at this stage.

I don't think pricing has anything to do with costs these days. Its more like 'what the traffic can bear' kind of logic.

It depends on the projected demand and what the target audience will be willing to shell out. I am sure VW is not targeting great volumes with this car. Niche products are always high priced when compared to volume products.
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Old 23rd April 2013, 16:17   #390
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Default Re: Scoop! VW Polo TSI spotted testing in India *UPDATE* Fresh Scoop pics on Pg.15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
This is the price list that was posted in the Amaze thread:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/attac...413_184630.jpg

It says S-AT is 8.3L and VX-AT is 9.37L.
These prices are inclusive of additional warranties, essentials and 0 % depreciation. Else the prices would be closer to my posted numbers.
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