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Old 4th February 2013, 19:02   #76
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

devansn, My thoughts exactly regarding safety being sidelined in the indian automobile world. When manufacturers abroad can't sell cars without the safety prerequisites, why are they being labelled a luxury and command a premium over their base models is something that has been doing rounds in my head. Somehow i feel we are being cheated by every manufacturer out there, with taxes added to our woes and fuel hikes adding salt to the existing wounds. If only i got a rupee for every gripe i have...
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Old 4th February 2013, 21:29   #77
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by k2max6 View Post
I like the car overall barring few things like the steering wheel etc. as others have pointed out as well.
Looks well proportioned but has boring interiors. I don't know how long the market will appreciate it.

I keep a car for almost 5 years and the only thing that stops me from buying it, if it goes the aveo way. I don't want to feel like if i owned the aveo today.A car no one wants to buy. (Generally speaking)

Yes, I agree with you. Aveo was not designed for Indian roads, its just imported to cover the entry level sedan from chevy
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Old 4th February 2013, 22:07   #78
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

I like the car and the price. It may not be excelling in anything, but it looks like its average or better in most. Add that to the soft comfortable ride at city speeds, this will be a good chauffeur driven car.

I don't think boot space of 370L will kill it. new Dezire has much less usable boot space, did not stop it form becoming a best seller.
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Old 4th February 2013, 22:51   #79
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

I checked out the Sail at Trident Chevrolet near Richmond Circle last evening.
I think this car makes for an excellent entry-level sedan, and I think this is exactly what budding families in congested cities need today.

I find it mildly amusing that people are blaming this car for its lack of genuine excitement. This car is designed to be the complete anti-thesis, I'd imagine.
In a word, this car seems to be designed for comfort.

The amount of space inside, both in terms of legroom, width, and headroom did surprise me. I doubt anything other than the Etios beats it for sheer size on the inside. While the interiors do look boring, I thought the fit and finish was quite good(barring the gaping cavity between the steering column and the indicator stalks). The AC controls felt tactile, and I quite liked the overall ergonomics of the cabin. I think the power window controls on the central console were perfectly reasonable too. Granted it doesn't look as nice as one mounted on the doors, but this is hardly a deal-breaker.

I loved the cushioning of the rear seat and with the arm-rest, I thought this is one of those few cars I'd love to be chauffeur-driven in. It definitely is more comfortable to sit and drive or be driven around in than a Vento, Rapid, or Fiesta.

Feature-wise, it has everything you'd really need. The LS ABS is a downright steal in either Petrol or Diesel trim. If you're mostly chauffeur-driven, this is a no-brainer model to go for. Even the LT ABS is excellent value IMO.

Among entry-level sedans, I would go for this car eyes-closed. It has more space for passengers and luggage than the Dezire, it is much cheaper, better finished, and better looking than the Etios. My experience with the Punto means that I will not be recommending a Tata car to anyone in a hurry. While the Manza is better specced, I'm just not comfortable about owning and running a Tata again. The sales experience is definitely sub-par at Tata. While even on this brief look, the Chevrolet dealer was leagues ahead. To cap it all, the Sail is (arguably) the best looking among all the entry level sedans.

I will be test-driving this car next week to get a better idea of its on-road behavior. Reviews currently suggest that this car has a light steering and superb ride comfort. That's all I need to handle the pathetic and narrow Bangalore roads. I'll drive my Punto for the spirited handling, but as a comfortable, affordable sedan, Sail has all the boxes ticked.

Ultimately, at 7.8 lacs OTR Bangalore for the LT ABS petrol, this car is barely 70k more than a Polo 1.2P highline. There are Hyundai I20 variants that cost much more! I think even a Honda Jazz is around the same price.

Frankly, I think this car makes a great case for being a no-nonsense, pleasant, supremely comfortable, and reliable family car.

If China, with its variety of cars, is buying the Sail in truckloads, I think it means this car must definitely have something that makes it so popular. Not everything in life has to be flash and bling, surely? Why not embrace simplicity of purpose for a change?
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Old 5th February 2013, 05:49   #80
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrotek View Post
I checked out the Sail at Trident Chevrolet near Richmond Circle last evening.
I think this ....... a change?
Completely agree with you on this regard. I think this car makes more sense for middle aged men ( 30 - 45 ) who would be upgrading from their humble Altos and Waggys.

Also, the pricing for base petrol is killer at 4.99L Ex-Showroom. I am assuming that most of the volumes for this car comes from the base variants of petrol, with current diesel deregulation in picture.

What concerns me is that will there be any takers for high end variant Diesel ?unless and until the diesel is declared a blockbuster for driving. Also, not that a good 3 lakh price difference between low end petrol and high end diesel.

If there are many takers for low end petrol variants, it carries the perception as a 5-6.5 L OTR car, even though top end diesel will be close to 9L OTR. Image damage is a probability.
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Old 5th February 2013, 09:51   #81
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Logged in early today after seeing the Sail Sedan Ad in the newspapers to day, and as expected, Team Bhp already has a long runnig thread on it

This car aims to capture the aspirational buyers, who till date were looking at the Etios for a budget level sedan for family use.

Coming at a price where even the mid to top level hatchbacks are more expensive, I think the potential buyer will start with very muted expectations in terms of features and goodies from this sedan.
This product aims to tap the the more sedate family oriented buyer, who would usually have 2 major concerns:
1) Space , both in terms of rear seat comfort and number of people it can accomodate, and
2) enough engine power to put up a decnt performance with decent mileage.

Corvette or no Corvette doesnot really matter in this car. a basic music system with bluetooth is more than enough for the average family buyer.

As far a I think, this car ticks more boxes in terms of features and goodies as compared to the Etios, but would really have to take a good look at the level to level comparison between the 2 in terms of what each car offers at what price level.

However, comparing this to the Desire is just not warranted. The Dezire has an aspirational quotient to it that none can match up to at this point.
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Old 5th February 2013, 10:51   #82
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrotek View Post
If China, with its variety of cars, is buying the Sail in truckloads, I think it means this car must definitely have something that makes it so popular. Not everything in life has to be flash and bling, surely? Why not embrace simplicity of purpose for a change?
Just thought of checking those truckloads comment and found this Web link.

http://www.4-traders.com/GENERAL-MOT...hina-16009198/

Quoting from that article. Apart from Cruze
1)
Quote:
Sales of the Sail family also remained strong, increasing 21.0 percent to 21,866 units.
Sail is doing fantastically well in China. Mind that China is a Sedan market with almost nil Hatch sales. (Cruze 25K and Excelle/Optra 30K a month).

Now this is the reason why Sail-UVA-hatch looks like a car derived from SAIL Sedan rather than other way round (dzire sedan infact is derived from Swift Hatch)

2)
Quote:
Its best-selling model was the Hong Guang, whose sales grew 158.9 percent to 47,765 units.
Now this second vehicle seems to be nothing but the upcoming Chevy Enjoy which is selling approximately 50K vehicles a month. How in world do they sell so many vehicle in a month. Was quite insightful to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitayu View Post
However, comparing this to the Desire is just not warranted. The Dezire has an aspirational quotient to it that none can match up to at this point.
Dzire having a aspirational quotient is not entirely true. Anyone who buys dzire knows within that he is indeed buying a hatch which looks somewhat like Sedan at the rear end and is nothing but a compromise, though it comes with maruti brand value and support which is the biggest puller in this country.

Last edited by anu21v : 5th February 2013 at 10:57.
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Old 5th February 2013, 11:03   #83
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Car looks good in the pictures, better than its Hatch version for sure. They should have launched this model first before the hatch. Now hatch has created somewhat negative feedback, review in the users mind with its design, it will be difficult for sedan to capture the market.

Another thing i noticed is diesel car is not at all cheap. 6.21 L for base model ex showroom Delhi means it will be at least 7.5 L OTR here in Maharashtra & most parts of the India. Dashboard looks really boring. They should have used black color instead. It would have looked much better IMO. After initial spike if at all there is any, i dont think this car will sell in great numbers. Forget beating Dzire. Also considering Amaze around the corner, i dont think it will be hit in market for long. Lets see how market responds to this.
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Old 5th February 2013, 13:00   #84
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Does anyone have info about the NCAP rating for "India" specific SAIL twins? I guess the China version gets a 4 star.
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Old 5th February 2013, 15:05   #85
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

1) Looks fairly decent, and having read the reviews of the sail UVA, I ca safely assume that this is a no-nonsense entry level sedan that should satisfy customers to a large extent. H/ever, is this a threat to the dzire? Nope, I dont think so. It will further reduce the customer base of the etios and the manza by a good extent and may be some of the dzire as well. With the Honda Amaze being launched within the next 2-3 months, I think the sail would be lost in the "honda diesel" buzz.
2) Regarding the dzire vs sail or GM vs Maruti debate, my take is that in India it boils down to perception of brand rather than anything else. People assume that buying a maruti results in peace of mind, which is mostly true since the average joe doesnt expect radical performance levels in his car. At the same time manufacturers like GM/SKODA/VW/Renault need to be more consistent in their service levels. Be more diligent, check on dealers frequently to ensure that customers are not left unsatisfied. If you ignore the brand perception and take in consideration the average buyer's requirement, I dont think as a product the dzire is better than the sail or vice versa. They have their own pros and cons, but nothing that is so different that one is to be classfied as worse than the other.
3) To all those hardcore swift fans who blatantly defend their car against any other, please drive other cars and experience them before you jump to such conclusions. I owned a dzire for 4.5 years as well so I very well know what its strengths and shortcomings are. Just because it sells in huge numbers, it does not mean it is the best around. Globally the Corolla is a top seller, but is it the best? nope. Lot of other factors ride on such numbers.

Last edited by motorworks : 5th February 2013 at 15:11.
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Old 5th February 2013, 17:09   #86
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by anu21v View Post
Just thought of checking those truckloads comment and found this Web link.

http://www.4-traders.com/GENERAL-MOT...hina-16009198/

Quoting from that article. Apart from Cruze
1)

Sail is doing fantastically well in China. Mind that China is a Sedan market with almost nil Hatch sales. (Cruze 25K and Excelle/Optra 30K a month).

Now this is the reason why Sail-UVA-hatch looks like a car derived from SAIL Sedan rather than other way round (dzire sedan infact is derived from Swift Hatch)

2)

Now this second vehicle seems to be nothing but the upcoming Chevy Enjoy which is selling approximately 50K vehicles a month. How in world do they sell so many vehicle in a month. Was quite insightful to me.

Hong guang (Enjoy) costs between Rs 4-5 lacs in China, that is the reason for the huge numbers , plus Chinese market is much bigger than Indian car market. If Chevy were to price Enjoy similarly, it will sell more than Eco, Omni, Ertiga or Quanto.

Sail is a better package than Dzire. Only interiors are better in Dzire but still Dzire will continue to lead the segment. I hope Amaze is launched in Petrol trim too and at similar price point, given the diesel price increase may wean private car buyers away from this mad diesel rush.
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Old 5th February 2013, 17:29   #87
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Drove the Diesel SAIL sedan today and was reasonably impressed with the package.

Exteriors look pretty good but my colleague found it a little too bland. The empty expanse on the boot lid gives this impression. Side profile looks good.

Interiors are same as U-VA so are just average. Rear seat space is very good. Backrest angle is perfect and legroom aplenty. Underthigh is also very decent but the seat base is a little short. I would say Etios still has the upper edge in rear comfort but SAIL comes close. The armrest in SAIL is a big plus for the chauffeur driven. The Sunny is still tops where legroom is concerned but lower seat height and poor underthigh means it's not as comfy as SAIL and Etios.

The fuel tank in the middle results in a nice foot rest for the rear passengers. This also results in a very handy storage space under the rear seats. You can comfortably dump your shopping there or a laptop bag.

Boot space is less on paper but in reality it's very decent. It can easily take your family's weekend vacation baggage. No problems. Was impressed with the high quality carpet moulding in the boot area as well as the carpeting on the inside of boot lid. Even the Honda city doesn't have this!

Performance is similar to hatch back so pretty decent. Turbo lag is there but not really bad. Ride and handling are exemplary. Way better than what the Etios, Sunny and Dzire offer. This car can maintain it's line around a corner very nicely at the same time absorb the bad stuff easily. Colleague missed a speed breaker and it took it very nicely.

Steering is devoid of feel and light. No feedback at all and disappointing since the dynamics are great. Brakes are very sharp and impressive. Good feel as well.

Best part is the pricing. The top end diesel LT model is 9.2L on-road bangalore. That's cheaper than the Etios V-D as well as VX-D. The Sail is very good VFM. It's a more complete sedan over the Dzire and feels much better than the spartan Etios.

Worth a look if your looking for a sub 10L sedan and don't want the Dzire compromise.

Only problem I see for GM is one which is coming in 2 months time from Honda. The Amaze.
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Old 6th February 2013, 12:11   #88
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by rock75 View Post
Hong guang (Enjoy) costs between Rs 4-5 lacs in China, that is the reason for the huge numbers , plus Chinese market is much bigger than Indian car market. If Chevy were to price Enjoy similarly, it will sell more than Eco, Omni, Ertiga or Quanto
I dont think thats possible in India. A VW polo, a Swift sells at 2.5 to 3.5 lakh INR equivalent price point in china, which has a very different price point in India. I think its relative pricing that matters and not absolute pricing.

Pricing in a country is dependent on Tax and duty structure in that country which may be relatively higher or lower than other country. I guess China and USA Taxations are ultra low as compared to India Taxations . A corolla or camry starts at 16,000 to 22,000 dollars in USA which should make it 8 lakh for corolla and 11 lakh price for camry in India but I don't think that's possible even if these cars are localized 100% mainly due to multi-level of Duty, Taxations, VATs, CSTs and what nots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
The top end diesel LT model is 9.2L on-road bangalore. That's cheaper than the Etios V-D as well as VX-D. The Sail is very good VFM. It's a more complete sedan over the Dzire and feels much better than the spartan Etios.
How in the world a 7.51 Lakh priced car gets a OTR price of 9.2 Lakh in Bangalore... I am aghast at Bangalore Road Tax Structure :(

Last edited by anu21v : 6th February 2013 at 12:22.
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Old 6th February 2013, 12:13   #89
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Just one thing. What's with Chevy and Hyundai and a couple others using ABS stickers on top end models as if they are something high-tech? Sure, they save lives and all, but ABS as a tech is age old and it's a norm in automobiles in many international countries. I don't understand the branding value behind ABS. The top-end SAIL will have ABS and the lower end won't but is it really necessary to differentiate the variant with an ABS sticker? Matter of fact, even if ABS is provided as an option, there's no real value in putting up the ABS sticker. And it doesn't even look good. It just looks "meh".
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Old 6th February 2013, 12:53   #90
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Default Re: Chevrolet Sail (Sedan) Launched @ Rs. 4.99-7.51 Lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by 9thsphinx View Post
I don't understand the branding value behind ABS. The top-end SAIL will have ABS and the lower end won't but is it really necessary to differentiate the variant with an ABS sticker? Matter of fact, even if ABS is provided as an option, there's no real value in putting up the ABS sticker. And it doesn't even look good. It just looks "meh".
For that matter, why would you need any label other than the manufacturer logo and model name? What value does the LS/LT badge add?

ABS sticker at the rear sometimes makes the drivers with non-ABS cars a little cautious while following as they are unsure if they might be able to stop in time. I wouldn't mind that getting that extra caution from the guy behind especially in our road conditions where no one keeps safe distance from the vehicle in front and even an 800 follows a Verna at the same speed without worrying about the addional braking distance it needs.

Also, the cost concious and safety unconcious Indian customer always needs something to show off for every penny he spends on his car. That 'ABS' sticker is probably the only way for him to tell others that he spent another 20k than the regular model. If it makes him happy, what is the harm in having the sticker?

I'll be happy if at least one more ABS version gets purchased due to the sticker. Its a real pain if you are hunting for a used hatch with optional safety kit. They just don't exist in the used car market and the ones that do are usually abused to the core.
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