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Old 13th May 2013, 18:18   #931
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by oxyzen View Post
  • I am sure the Ecoboost is a great engine. But putting it in a SUV is probably asking too much from it. This is the type of you engine you expect in cars like Astar, & Beat, maybe even the Figo.
Ecosport is not a big car either. Its pretty much like the Jazz from a space point of view. So engine, I think is perfect with that power and torque. But I do agree that the price on the Ecoboost versions may go high thanks the technology quotient of the new engine and loaded features. But at some point in time it has to happen. Else how do we get newer technologies.

One view of the whole thing is newer technology at the same price like what we see in cell phones. But for that to happen there has to be a tipping point.
Ford can definitely do a good job of keeping the price down though.
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Old 13th May 2013, 18:43   #932
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

Now that Ecosport Launch will take a cool 1 month, everyone seem to be guessing the price which now seems the single biggest factor for success. Let me add some more Masala to it .
I have considered only Titanium model of ES which seems the better option as of now.

Here are my assumptions :
1. Going by Ford standards Petrol Variant is almost 75K-1lac cheaper in comparison to Diesel.
2.Ford seems to be treating Ecoboost engine as a premium option and hence would be priced similar to Diesel.

The current Ex showroom prices from Ford offerings:
1. Figo Titanium TDCi- 6 lacs
2.Fiesta Classic Titanium-7.96 lacs
3.New Fiesta(D) Titanium+ -10.3 lacs
4.New Fiesta(D) Style- 9.3 lacs


Now if Ford wants to continue Fiesta Classic, i doubt if they can afford to price ES diesel lesser than 7.96. If they price ES lower than i doubt if anybody would be willing to buy already ageing Classic. Agree that Classic Titanium is better equipped than ES Style, but common Classic is a decade old.

Given that New Fiesta and ES share lot of common things, the ES cannot be significantly cheaper say by 1 lac or so. 50K cheaper to New Fiesta seems acceptable. That means ES Titanium Diesel should be in the range of 9.6-9.75 lacs(in comparison to NFF Titanium +).

9.6-9.75 lac ex showroom price translates to approx 11.5 lacs on road in Bangalore .
So Ideally 1.5(P)Titanium ES should be somewhere 8.5 lacs(Ex-showroom) and Ecoboost Titanium same as diesel.

Ford Seems to be targeting Premium Hatch and some C-segment Sedans(ex: Vento/Verna etc). So what do i gain and lose with ES:

What i Gain:
1. Butch looks and higher driving/ride positions.
2.Better GC.
3.Slightly more boot space compared to premium hatches.
4.Slightly cheaper than C-segment sedans

What i Lose:
1.Handling of a sedan/hatch .
2.Fuel efficiency to certain extent.
3.Smaller boot space compared to sedan.
4.Premium interiors of a Sedan.
5.Costlier than premium hatch.

Despite slightly higher pricing(hoping) ES should rake in decent numbers as its called SUV, looks SUV'ish and feels SUV'ish . Afterall we all love SUV's right.

Couple of contradictions/confusions created so far:
1. Majority say its a very good handling car and lives upto the expectation.While some say its no drivers car. Still not sure whom to believe.
2. The interior quality as some say good and some say bad. I always felt Ford interiors are of good quality. ES interiors look fairly good in pictures posted.
3.The looks as expected is love or hate design.
4.The width. Some say its over 2000 mm but i guess its 1700 odd mm.
5.Rear leg space. Some say its cramped and some say its good. Looking at pics so far, seems ES betters premium hatches and is somewhere in Sedan's league.
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Old 13th May 2013, 18:46   #933
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by drpudhi View Post
First eco-sport is not a SUV in its true sense. If you see it weighs equal to some of the premium hatch around here.
on a lighter side, question I want to ask here is (forgive me for my ignorance)

"what is the definition of SUV? is it size or power or ground clearance or look? i am confused. A vehicle just same as a mid hatch with higher ground clearance can be called and SUV?

earlier, people use to say, thumb rule for SUV is more than 2 liter engine, then with duster, it brought down to 1.5l. now with eco-sport, it is 1 liter engine.
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Old 13th May 2013, 19:02   #934
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by ambadan View Post
on a lighter side, question I want to ask here is (forgive me for my ignorance)

"what is the definition of SUV? is it size or power or ground clearance or look? i am confused. A vehicle just same as a mid hatch with higher ground clearance can be called and SUV?

earlier, people use to say, thumb rule for SUV is more than 2 liter engine, then with duster, it brought down to 1.5l. now with eco-sport, it is 1 liter engine.
I know you asked in jest, yet I will try and explain with all seriousness.
A SUV as we know stands for sports utility vehicle. It needs to have a component of sporty i.e enough power to make driving fun, ability to have a lack of seriousness or have a fun quality about it, needs a component of utility i.e able to haul people, pets, luggage, a combination of the above, in US, ability to haul a boat/trailer to the nearest fun site. and Vehicle which is self explanatory.
So lets see does Duster check sports? I believe so. Utility? Maybe, if we stretch it to an extent. After all how much can a 5 seat hatchback haul?
Can the EcoSport do this? Ofcourse not. A ritz sized hatchback is cramped even with two people forget more.

For India if your car can safely put two tyres down into the dirt and mantain speed without worrying (say on a single laned road), I believe it can be called a SUV
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Old 13th May 2013, 19:13   #935
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ambadan View Post

on a lighter side, question I want to ask here is (forgive me for my ignorance)

"what is the definition of SUV? is it size or power or ground clearance or look? i am confused. A vehicle just same as a mid hatch with higher ground clearance can be called and SUV?

earlier, people use to say, thumb rule for SUV is more than 2 liter engine, then with duster, it brought down to 1.5l. now with eco-sport, it is 1 liter engine.
If you ask me its all about peoples perception. If we apply the strict yard sticks of definition of a sports utility vehicle, it may not make the cut. But should praise Ford that they created that aura of SUV around Ecosport.it all comes down to marketing and how people perceive a product.

Wiki says " SUV is a vehicle similar to a station waggon or estate car, usually equipped with four wheel drive for on or off roading, with passenger carrying capacity of a mini van or large sedan".

Last edited by drpudhi : 13th May 2013 at 19:15.
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Old 13th May 2013, 19:47   #936
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

I am keen on knowing EcoSport Diesel Mileage(FE) Since this has same engine as that of New Fiesta and similar profile Assuming that FE will be similar

Can anyone point me to real world FE figures of new Fiesta 1.5 ltr diesel engine in Bangalore city conditions and say highways
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Old 13th May 2013, 19:48   #937
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by PrideRed View Post
Now that Ecosport Launch will take a cool 1 month, everyone seem to be guessing the price which now seems the single biggest factor for success. Let me add some more Masala to it .
I have considered only Titanium model of ES which seems the better option as of now.

Here are my assumptions :
1. Going by Ford standards Petrol Variant is almost 75K-1lac cheaper in comparison to Diesel.
2.Ford seems to be treating Ecoboost engine as a premium option and hence would be priced similar to Diesel.
Most of your reasoning is sound. The only thing it doesn't take into account is that the diesel variants of the EcoSport will attract lower excise and so a larger difference in price with the new Fiesta is possible. However, the googly here is that the petrol will attract higher excise, being a 1.5l engine. So the question is how will Ford manage the positioning, considering petrol versions are typically cheaper than their diesel counterparts?

Last edited by Technocrat : 13th May 2013 at 21:20. Reason: Please avoid quoting large post completly specially when its on same page as it causes inconvenience to our mobile readers.
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Old 13th May 2013, 20:01   #938
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by rajshenoy View Post
I am keen on knowing EcoSport Diesel Mileage(FE) Since this has same engine as that of New Fiesta and similar profile Assuming that FE will be similar

Can anyone point me to real world FE figures of new Fiesta 1.5 ltr diesel engine in Bangalore city conditions and say highways
It is very very fuel efficient, for more check out Bhpian MAS' review thread here
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/long-t...completed.html
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Old 13th May 2013, 20:05   #939
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by StarScream View Post
Most of your reasoning is sound. The only thing it doesn't take into account is that the diesel variants of the EcoSport will attract lower excise and so a larger difference in price with the new Fiesta is possible. However, the googly here is that the petrol will attract higher excise, being a 1.5l engine. So the question is how will Ford manage the positioning, considering petrol versions are typically cheaper than their diesel counterparts?
My question is - should Ford really try so hard to position the Petrol lower to the diesel? Why? Ecoboost or no Ecoboost, I doubt any petrol engine is going to get much numbers in for Ford. The bulk of the sales will be diesel so the question is - should ford worry about the pricing of the 1.5ltr petrol lower to diesel? If so, why?
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Old 13th May 2013, 20:42   #940
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by S2!!! View Post
I saw the video review by oncars.in and honestly I felt that was a very genuine review and can almost relate to everything the reviewers mentioned about the EcoSport. He has covered most aspects well and has brought out a whole list of negatives along with a few positives. In fact he mentions that the steering feels as if it is lifted off a Hyundai car - lifeless and it doesn't handle as well as other Fords which is in contrast to what Renuka Kripalani mentions in the autocar review. I guess we just have to wait for the team-bhp review to find out which of them is correct.

For me it looked like a paid review by Duster. The reason : If ford is employing the same steering as it is there in the new Fiesta I must not believe the words in this review. It was giving as much same feedback as from a hydraulic power steering I have seen. At 140+ I felt that, the feedback I much better in Fiesta .
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Old 13th May 2013, 21:00   #941
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by Nilesh5417 View Post
My question is - should Ford really try so hard to position the Petrol lower to the diesel? Why? Ecoboost or no Ecoboost, I doubt any petrol engine is going to get much numbers in for Ford. The bulk of the sales will be diesel so the question is - should ford worry about the pricing of the 1.5ltr petrol lower to diesel? If so, why?
No they don't have to - that's just the conventional wisdom. And is true for all the other cars they sell.

The other thing I thought is that they don't have to sell an entry level petrol at all - the top-end Ecoboost and 1.5 AT could suffice (with those you have a story to tell to justify the price).

But that doesn't seem to be the way Ford is thinking and that makes me think it will disappoint those expecting a very aggressive starting price.
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Old 13th May 2013, 21:00   #942
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by Nilesh5417 View Post
My question is - should Ford really try so hard to position the Petrol lower to the diesel? Why? Ecoboost or no Ecoboost, I doubt any petrol engine is going to get much numbers in for Ford. The bulk of the sales will be diesel so the question is - should ford worry about the pricing of the 1.5ltr petrol lower to diesel? If so, why?
If the Petrol 1.5L ES is to cost more than Diesel, say the starting price of Entry level 1.5L(P) would be something like 8 lacs(Ex Showroom). That would be marketing disaster. Also there is no point in offering 1.5L P version if it costs equal or more than Diesel, they already have the pricey Ecoboost for this.

Unless Diesel is priced something like 6.5-7.00 it looks highly unlikely that 1.5L Petrol would cost more than diesel.

To me it looks like the whole purpose of launching 1.5L petrol is just to have an Ad in the paper saying "Prices start at just x.yz* onwards" and attract customers.
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Old 13th May 2013, 21:13   #943
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Originally Posted by PrideRed View Post

If the Petrol 1.5L ES is to cost more than Diesel, say the starting price of Entry level 1.5L(P) would be something like 8 lacs(Ex Showroom). That would be marketing disaster. Also there is no point in offering 1.5L P version if it costs equal or more than Diesel, they already have the pricey Ecoboost for this.

Unless Diesel is priced something like 6.5-7.00 it looks highly unlikely that 1.5L Petrol would cost more than diesel.

To me it looks like the whole purpose of launching 1.5L petrol is just to have an Ad in the paper saying "Prices start at just x.yz* onwards" and attract customers.
Why should the 1.5 petrol cost more than diesel?? If ford can price the fiesta classic with the 1.6 petrol at 5.6l ex showroom even when the classic falls in the higher tax bracket due to its >4m length and >1.5 engine capacity i see no reason why ford should price the 1.5p variant high, the 1.5p is made in India so should have very low manufacturing cost.

Last edited by rambo1o1 : 13th May 2013 at 21:14.
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Old 13th May 2013, 21:31   #944
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Ford is coming out with 10 variants for the Ford Eco Sport.
4 diesel Variants
3 petrol 1.5 liter manual variants.
1 petrol 1.5 liter automatic variant
2 Ecosport variants.
(y).
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Old 13th May 2013, 21:41   #945
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Default Re: Ford EcoSport revealed with PICTURES : Inside & Out!

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Originally Posted by rambo1o1 View Post
Why should the 1.5 petrol cost more than diesel??
Simply because the petrol and diesel fall into different tax brackets. There would be an additional 1L (approx) tax on the 1.5 petrol that will offset the additional cost for the 1.5 diesel engine.

I don't see any reason why they should launch a 1.5 petrol unless they plan to sell it to us without a profit.

All comparisons with the Fiesta classic are of zero value.

Last edited by civic-sense : 13th May 2013 at 21:44.
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