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Old 25th April 2013, 10:40   #61
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

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Originally Posted by sushantr5 View Post
I have one question regarding central locking, In my Tata Vista central locking is there which is electrically assisted, It means even if my electrical system fails I can open door just by pooling a lock knob because its all mechanical. So getting caught inside car due to kaput central locking does not convince me.
True. Same case in my Safari and Alto. Either car I can override the central locking by simply pulling the unlock handle on any door. The car will not prevent me from opening a door even if central locking has locked it.
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Old 25th April 2013, 10:52   #62
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

For most VW & Skoda vehicles the front doors open with a dual tug at the door latch from the inside even if the door is locked. It is a good safety feature and I guess overrides any electronic intervention.
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Old 25th April 2013, 11:02   #63
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

@rrsteer, some answers in bold

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Originally Posted by rrsteer View Post
So it seems any make of car is exposed to the threat of catching fire. My question to forum members:

1. What are the conditions which increase the chances of a car catching fire?
Poor Maintenance, Improper electrical wiring, No periodic checks...

2. In case of fire, and when the central locking is jammed, what is that as an onlooker one can do to rescue the trapped passegers?
Try opening the doors, if not grab something, break the side or rear window(not the front windshield)

3. What are the best practiced to be followed by a car owner to prevent fire or what tools should be present in a car to tackle such an eventuality?
A simple Swiss knife/seat belt cutter, a glass breaker and a Fire extinguisher.

Whatever the reason may be, it IS the duty of the owner to periodically check the car. In these days, how many car owners are opening their car bonnets? Are they checking if something is loose? Something untied? Something hanging loose which may be on fire due to hot exhaust manifold?

Please do note some of the reasons for fire are:
  • Electrical short circuiting
  • Burning rubber parts in the engine bay which may hang loose and touch very hot parts
  • Leaking fuel or some other engine fluids

I urge you all to check your car condition both electrical, mechanical & physical periodically. PLEASE DO NOT TEMPT FATE. A 5 to 10 minutes time around the car checking it will not only make you feel a little safer but you'll keep yourself and your family safe.
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Old 25th April 2013, 11:07   #64
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Add another incident: Read in a leading local newspaper today that in our city, a Maruti Omni caught fire at a petrol pump. Fortunately the 2 occupants escaped in time, unhurt, but the car burnt down to ashes. The picture of the burning car was scary & disturbing. Fortunately, fire did not spread as the incident happened at a petrol pump.

This is now becoming a daily affair kind of and we must take some steps to ensure our safety and keep some tips handy to try help someone caught in the disaster. I will straightaway store a hammer today only in my car, however, my car's door can be forced open from inside even if the security system is armed.
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Old 25th April 2013, 11:45   #65
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACM View Post
For most VW & Skoda vehicles the front doors open with a dual tug at the door latch from the inside even if the door is locked. It is a good safety feature and I guess overrides any electronic intervention.
That is the similar case in my humble Logan too. Even with power door lock engaged, the Driver & Passenger door will open from the inside when you pull the lever.
I read on some romanian forum that the intention of power door lock is to only prevent accidental opening of rear doors, where children must be seated.
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Old 25th April 2013, 12:08   #66
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

The incident about the Maruti Van that I shared a few posts ago:

http://epaper.prabhatkhabar.com/epap...12:00:00%20AM#

Image taken from newspaper.
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Old 25th April 2013, 13:32   #67
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

I see here lot of misplaced priorities. Instead of discussing fire extinguishers, we should be discussing about forms of quick and easy exits from a burning car. When a car is on fire, first thought that comes to mind is how to escape a burning car rather than fire-fighting from inside. Also, is it possible to douse fire with a single extinguisher? It is possible if and only if the extinguisher is pointed at source of fire, which is generally under bonnet. Now how will someone trapped inside have access to under-bonnet? And when fire reaches passenger cabin, it only means one thing-- IT IS TOO LATE. Forget fire-fighting and forget your car and just get out.
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Old 25th April 2013, 14:00   #68
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
Now how will someone trapped inside have access to under-bonnet? And when fire reaches passenger cabin, it only means one thing-- IT IS TOO LATE. Forget fire-fighting and forget your car and just get out.
Your points are of valid concern. Though some fires may also start from the cabin area due to electrical short-circuit like near the steering Column, under the dashboard etc. In that case, fire extinguishers can be helpful, but fires originating from the engine bay can quickly engulf the fuel lines and spread in a flash. In this situation, I don't think that small fire extinguishers are enough to douse such fires esp. when the fuel tank of cars hold at least 10-15 litres of fuel anytime.
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Old 25th April 2013, 16:00   #69
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by saket77 View Post
I am not taking the side of any company like Honda, Maruti or VW, but its the ratio of Nanos on the road to the Nanos catching fire; & IMO, this is the problem. If any car (talking of the models and not the manufacturer) has a similar ratio, then a grave introspection is needed.
Exactly friend. This confidence with Tata is what has been sorely missing. Also, there have been reports of brushing the matters under the carpet on this very forum about a Nano which smoked near the steering column.

Regards,
Saket
6 out of more than 2 lakhs NANO's sold are reported to have caught fire as per active press(print and electronic)

Number of lives lost due to NANO fire = Zero

Number of lives lost due to Honda fires = more than 2

Number of lives lost due to VW fire = one

Check internet for Honda recalls- it has recalled cars due to fire incidents in driver's door in all countries. I do not know if it happened in India

I have seen reports where a brand new BMW just out of showroom caught fire and burnt in MG rad Bangalore last year. It did not attract any major attention like NANO

Iam not saying that NANO fires are fine and OK.

What i would like to mention is reaction of public, even an educated forum like this towards the fire incidents.

Just go through the responses in this case. Most of them are discussing how to eascape or blaming Govt. hardly there is post questioning Honda. Honda fires leading to loss of life are being reported in India in the past few years.

My question is what Honda did in all these years even after there is loss of life due to central locking of doors in their cars?

Did we see any response from Honda on this, for ex. what preventive measure they did take , or what has caused this etc etc?

Or did we see any response from VW in the other case?

At least TATA has come out with some explanation, which may or may be correct.

Honda, VW, Maruti, Hyundai are totally silent on the burning their cars which are reported in some news papers or even in this forum.

So who is brushing the matters under carpets?
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Old 25th April 2013, 16:59   #70
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

I came across this link which in a way gives another option of getting out of the car, just in case. Please have a look at it:



Mods, if this is a re-post, please delete it.

tejas
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Old 25th April 2013, 17:46   #71
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

I have not done any analysis on these figures, neither you have quoted the source of data, but still my answers would be:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
6 out of more than 2 lakhs NANO's sold are reported to have caught fire as per active press(print and electronic)

Number of lives lost due to NANO fire = Zero
Good. We don't want to see that too, but unfortunately, many have been injured; there is a full 50 page thread on it: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-analysis.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Number of lives lost due to Honda fires = more than 2
Again, Honda is a manufacturer with many models unlike Nano, which is *A* model made by Tata motors. Anyway, what you have quoted is not the number of Honda cars that caught fire but the number of people who unfortunately lost their lives.& 'more than 2' is an ambiguity. Even in case of a single car catching fire, there is a statistical possibility that 5 lives can be lost. God forbid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Number of lives lost due to VW fire = one
Again, more than lives lost, car catching fire is what we should be talking here. Not to mention that Hondas & VWs sold world wide would outnumber the Nanos sold by a massive margin. I would be interested in the ratios. Also, VW & Hondas are selling since decades, but Nano is just a few years old, & with the number of fires, it has attracted the attention, no doubt. People are bound to feel that there is a designing flaw in the car since its a new, non-time tested design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Check internet for Honda recalls- it has recalled cars due to fire incidents in driver's door in all countries. I do not know if it happened in India
Neither do I.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
I have seen reports where a brand new BMW just out of showroom caught fire and burnt in MG rad Bangalore last year. It did not attract any major attention like NANO
It should have, no mercy if its a BMW. Fire in a car just out from showroom with no modifications/ ICE etc. is disgusting, be it a Nano or BMW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
I am not saying that NANO fires are fine and OK.
Neither I am saying that other vehicles catching fire is okay. If you scroll to the previous page, I have myself posted about a Maruti Omni that caught fire in my city yesterday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
What i would like to mention is reaction of public, even an educated forum like this towards the fire incidents.
I won't blame people for that. It is because of the price of the Nano. With the lowest price tag in the world for a car, it requires no advanced economics to understand that TML cannot plonk the best things in the car. Add below par Tata quality control to it too. I don't say that they use sub-standard parts, but what the costlier cars use are bound to be of better quality. Blame Tatas for that too, for projecting the Nano as what it is perceived now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Just go through the responses in this case. Most of them are discussing how to eascape or blaming Govt. hardly there is post questioning Honda. Honda fires leading to loss of life are being reported in India in the past few years.

My question is what Honda did in all these years even after there is loss of life due to central locking of doors in their cars?
Frankly, I still fail to understand that why won't the door open from inside if the central locking has failed. & if people are discussing how to get ALIVE from this situation, I would not blame them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Did we see any response from Honda on this, for ex. what preventive measure they did take , or what has caused this etc etc?
I have no idea. Its a fresh incident, lets see what Honda does. I sincerely hope that all manufacturers do a serious introspection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Or did we see any response from VW in the other case?

At least TATA has come out with some explanation, which may or may be correct.
Because a particular model was involved multiple times; added recently to the stable on which a lot of hopes rest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
Honda, VW, Maruti, Hyundai are totally silent on the burning their cars which are reported in some news papers or even in this forum.
Again see the ratio, but IMO, an investigation by the company is definitely required.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkg View Post
So who is brushing the matters under carpets?
All would like to. No manufacturer would like to in these shoes. Hence, discussions like these should be seen as constructive criticism.

PS: It was a painful task.

Last edited by saket77 : 25th April 2013 at 17:57.
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Old 25th April 2013, 19:40   #72
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

I always keep a "arrivaal"(tamil name for sickle) with steel pipe as handle under my seat or in the door pocket.

Actually it is not purely legal to do that as it may be considered by police for assault. But I have it to cut my seat belt and smash the windsceen.

I was asked once and I said I keep it to ward off ghosts as I travel alone in the night a lot.
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Old 25th April 2013, 19:45   #73
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Skoda laura is the only vehicle I have seen where there is no lock knob. The doors open with a dual tug of the door latch wherein the first tug unlocks the door and the second one opens it.
If i have locked the the vehicle from the remote, there is no way for me to open the door from inside the car without pressing unlock from the remote. You can actually lock people inside the car.
In conclusion, its all electrical. What if there is a fire and electronics get messed up and locks the doors. There is no way of getting out of the car without breaking the window.
just found out there is a lever in the boot but that is too difficult to reach for old people like my dad. He is 55 and a little overweight, he can't possibly go back to the boot and use that lever to come out. I think a hammer is most important in Skoda.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACM View Post
For most VW & Skoda vehicles the front doors open with a dual tug at the door latch from the inside even if the door is locked. It is a good safety feature and I guess overrides any electronic intervention.
my skoda's doors wont open manually from inside when they are locked from the remote. Are you sure yours do?
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Old 25th April 2013, 20:09   #74
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by bantejas View Post
I came across this link which in a way gives another option of getting out of the car, just in case. Please have a look at it:



Mods, if this is a re-post, please delete it.

tejas
Hi,

First off, this is a very tragic incident; my condolences to the family. I feel that the price of the car doesn't matter when it comes to basic safety requirements. So, it is immaterial if the car in question was a rolls royce or the civic. The fact that a man lost his life should have made the govt come down like a ton of bricks on car manufacturers (from the very first fire itself-a long time ago).

Moving on, it reminds me of an incident from childhood when my family witnessed a car fire. It was the fiat (1100) that caught fire right in front of our eyes in the parking. The car was parked by our neighbor next to our own beloved fiat. And the engine caught fire the moment it was cranked and started. Needless to say (being fighter pilots all: my dad and our neighbor) immediately got to extinguishing the fire with sand, garden hose and what not, which was followed by the fire engine. The car was saved and went on to provide excellent service for years. All i remember is: Fire started, dad screaming water (to ask us to get the hose and buckets) and then the fire fighters. What was fortuitous about the situation was that there was no central locking involved.

Back to topic: headrests, hammers, steering and gear locks, guns (if you have a license), and spark plugs ceramics (google ninja rocks, its an awesome thing to break windshields and other car glass). What else? Presence of mind, because even the car keys could be used to break the glass if one is strong enough to hold it like a knife and push it through the glass.
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Old 25th April 2013, 21:04   #75
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Default re: Honda Civic catches Fire on Dwarka Underpass. Owner Dies!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACM View Post
For most VW & Skoda vehicles the front doors open with a dual tug at the door latch from the inside even if the door is locked. It is a good safety feature and I guess overrides any electronic intervention.
VW and Skoda lock system is actually the opposite of safe. The entire locking mechanism is governed by electronic sensors which are then controlled by a Body Controle Module (BCM). This is the reason behind the fact that a person cannot escape a VW/Skoda when locked by the remote.

I have witnessed the horrors of VW locks as we own a VW Jetta (2008) which has the most unreliable central lock. All the doors have their own will and want. Out of the blue, doors get locked and would not open no matter what you do.

To make matters worse, the central locking machine on the particular door can only be repaired/replaced when the door decides to unlock. We once had to wait 3 months for the rear RH door to unlock on it own and then drive the vehicle half locked to the service centre to get the unit replaced!!!

Imagine if all doors get locked and you are inside the vehicle!!!

Last edited by akhilesh51 : 25th April 2013 at 21:05.
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