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Old 3rd June 2013, 14:53   #226
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

Spoke to the dealer in Hyderabad- A class Petrol is 29 L on road, and interestingly B class is 31 L on road. Not exactly the recipe for world dominance here. Its definitely out of my budget now, and I will keep scanning the sales chart with keen academic interest.
Your move- BMW and Audi.
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Old 3rd June 2013, 15:07   #227
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The 2.1L engine makes sense since it is locally assembled by Force motors. There was no point in bringing down a new 1.8L engine. Detuning that 2.1L engine so heavily to 109PS is pure stupidity by Mercedes. That too nowhere in the world is this configuration offered.
I can understand what you are trying to tell VidyutJi. But MBIL has done this out of some sort of reasoning which i feel is baseless, since even financially, the engine is the same but this difference in tune is something MBIL needs to look. Its more of a manufacturer attitude as i would call it. Premium products = Premium prices. At 30L, this is all i can give you; if you want it, take it; if not, buy something higher from our stables. Obviously the loss of warranty would mean losing of one's peace of mind so many wouldn't dare tread that way. In short, a stupid decision looking to cash in at the short term but definitely not good for it in the long term. If this goes on, MBIL will be competing with MSIL and the likes, not so long ago did they lose their spot to audi and bmw. Still haven't come to act, yet.

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Old 3rd June 2013, 17:11   #228
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The question is not whether you can extract more power from the engine later on but why is Merc not offering the higher engine tune in the first place.

Why would a customer spend close to 30L on Mercedes hatch with 109PS then spend another lakh in modifications to increase to 180Ps, thereby losing warranty on the car. How many C class, E class have you heard with tuning boxes.

The 2.1L engine makes sense since it is locally assembled by Force motors. There was no point in bringing down a new 1.8L engine. Detuning that 2.1L engine so heavily to 109PS is pure stupidity by Mercedes. That too nowhere in the world is this configuration offered.
Probably because they felt customers wouldn't take it well if a hatch had the same engine as the sedans. 2 sedans sharing the engine is one thing, but knowing some of these buyers they wouldn't want to buy a sedan with the same engine as a hatch. And the c and e 220 is what brings Mercedes it's sales as of now. Though I do hear an a220 will be here next year.

Also how many c and e class owners drive themselves to fit a tuning box?
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Old 3rd June 2013, 18:39   #229
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Sadly this is where the complete immaturity of our car market really shows. Abroad it is perfectly normal for a manufacturer's models to have overlap in terms of price, features and performance. For instance, the higher trim C class models will overlap with the lowest end E class models. They will even have better engines and performance than the low-end E class. Correspondingly, the prices will also overlap and you could easily have a loaded C class cost more than a bargain basement E class!

Of course in a market as "small" as ours inventories are the biggest concern for manufacturers, but this notion that the smaller car needs to be cheaper, slower, worse needs to change!
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Old 3rd June 2013, 20:25   #230
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Sadly this is where the complete immaturity of our car market really shows. Abroad it is perfectly normal for a manufacturer's models to have overlap in terms of price, features and performance. For instance, the higher trim C class models will overlap with the lowest end E class models. They will even have better engines and performance than the low-end E class. Correspondingly, the prices will also overlap and you could easily have a loaded C class cost more than a bargain basement E class!

Of course in a market as "small" as ours inventories are the biggest concern for manufacturers, but this notion that the smaller car needs to be cheaper, slower, worse needs to change!
The situation is same in India. Most engines are shared across classes. E350 and S350 have the same engine. C220 and E220 have the same. C 250 and E250 have the same. Price differences remain larger because of the import duties. So even though the percentage of import duty remains same for CKDs, in absolute numbers, the difference becomes larger as you go higher.

A4, Q5, A6, A7 get the same 3.0 tdi motor.

The maturity that needs to be questioned is that of Mercedes. We're a growing market and a very important one at that. Underestimating the market and not providing value will only hurt the company in return. The sales numbers speak for themselves for Mercedes.
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Old 4th June 2013, 23:44   #231
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For all of those here who think the A is underpowered, don't lose heart. The A45 AMG can be imported in: for the 45th anniversary of AMG they have a 2-litre 360 bhp, 0-100 in 4.6 second rocket. The catch: about 70 lakhs OTR Mumbai
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Old 5th June 2013, 08:07   #232
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For all of those here who think the A is underpowered, don't lose heart. The A45 AMG can be imported in: for the 45th anniversary of AMG they have a 2-litre 360 bhp, 0-100 in 4.6 second rocket. The catch: about 70 lakhs OTR Mumbai
That almost sounds like Mercedes is playing a prank on customers. If it has to be a direct import, there are so many better options.

If that is the case, the Price of the officially Launched AMGs would not be much lower. And here naiive people like me were thinking Mercedes have got their act together and will bring the A45 And CLA 45 for under 40L ex showroom.

I guess Mercedes is One brand who aren't going to get their act together anytime soon.
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Old 5th June 2013, 10:07   #233
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I guess Mercedes is One brand who aren't going to get their act together anytime soon.
With lots of new launches still left, Mercedes will be leading the pack next year. Mark my words. And this is coming from a bmw owner.
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Old 5th June 2013, 10:38   #234
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With lots of new launches still left, Mercedes will be leading the pack next year. Mark my words. And this is coming from a bmw owner.
Honestly, after the success of the ML and the launch of the A class, i thought the same thing.
It is very very hard to go wrong with breakthrough first movers like the A and the CLA. But in India Mercedes seems to be pricing/powering/equipping these cars ridiculously. No parking sensors in a hatchback that costs 22 lacs Ex showroom is a bit too much.
Speedy also mentions that the Mercedes India Head's idea of progress is a Sport version and Base version of C class.

Now i'm thinking it could go either way. Launch of new models can only take them so far. Its the quality, pricing and perceived VFM of these cars that will really decide. And if the above post about the CLA45 AMG prices is to be taken into consideration, Mercedes is going to position and price the CLA very close to the C class (Since the AMG versions are also so closely priced inspite of the engines being poles apart). That is definitely not aggressive pricing.

As you may have seen ACM just mentioned major reliability issues with a GL in another thread. While the new GL is by far the best car in its category, reliability issues are holding customers back.

The bottom line is, mercedes is yet to get their act together, so it remains to be seen where they will finally end up.
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Old 5th June 2013, 11:08   #235
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That is definitely not aggressive pricing.
Mercedes has never priced anything "aggressively" in India. They are single handedly responsible for the current pricing levels of German cars here because they were the first in and set the benchmark for prices (which have always been high). The rest arrived and colluded with MB to keep prices high and have fat margins rather than compete honestly and ruin their margins.
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Old 5th June 2013, 12:20   #236
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Mercedes has never priced anything "aggressively" in India. They are single handedly responsible for the current pricing levels of German cars here because they were the first in and set the benchmark for prices (which have always been high). The rest arrived and colluded with MB to keep prices high and have fat margins rather than compete honestly and ruin their margins.
Completely Agree! Let's say "Mercedes has never needed to price anything "aggressively" in india" - Thanks to very little competition earlier.

There's very little doubt that this collusion strategy has worked horribly for mercedes. The result is Declining sales and declining customer satisfaction. The declining sales are not so much the result of any radical changes in the Mercedes' way of doing things. Its because earlier there wasnt any competition (or little) and now there is.

Why is why they need to get their act together.
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Old 5th June 2013, 17:55   #237
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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Mercedes has never priced anything "aggressively" in India. They are single handedly responsible for the current pricing levels of German cars here because they were the first in and set the benchmark for prices (which have always been high). The rest arrived and colluded with MB to keep prices high and have fat margins rather than compete honestly and ruin their margins.
CEO of Merc India once said in an interview they won't go below a certain price level to keep the brand prestigious.

Anyway I think its foolish on MB's behalf to launch a vehicle with such underpowered engine at such cost.

Last edited by Dante : 5th June 2013 at 17:58.
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Old 5th June 2013, 19:03   #238
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It's ironic that they associate PRICE with prestige instead of the quality / tech spec / features of the PRODUCT. I think it's pretty pathetic to even TRY offering a supposed luxury vehicle with a 108 bhp engine at a price > 25 lakhs.
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Old 5th June 2013, 19:21   #239
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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It's ironic that they associate PRICE with prestige instead of the quality / tech spec / features of the PRODUCT. I think it's pretty pathetic to even TRY offering a supposed luxury vehicle with a 108 bhp engine at a price > 25 lakhs.
One key difference I noticed about Mercedes in India is that they donít have a clear USP to boast of (compared to its German rivals). BMW always have been keen on highlighting their cars as driverís delight. They take pride in highlighting on their sportiness, engine, handling etc. Audi leads the way on interior quality, plushness, quattro etc. Mercedes highlights on prestige, panoramic sunroof etc (and recently on youthful styling), but thatís pretty much about it. The rival brands are not lacking in the prestige factor anyway.

When I look at the new A-Class brochure online, it looks like they themselves are feeling odd to talk about the diesel engine in A-Class. Nowhere there is a mention of the power figures.

They are indeed coming up with quite a few stylish models now, and I hope they bring more transparency and show a bit more intent.
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Old 5th June 2013, 19:29   #240
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Yeah, well...they are banking on the fact that their brand has historically been seen as "prestigious" by the average Indian due to whatever reason. Take any average Indian and throw a couple of crores at him, what's one of the (almost) sure-shot bets he'll be after? I'd say a Merc of some sort is a good guess!
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