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Old 6th May 2013, 20:53   #61
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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Originally Posted by Bluebeem View Post
Let us not read into things and try to see what i "imlpied". I said the A class would fail because its an UNDERPOWERED HATCHBACK!. You seem to have again conveniently missed the "hatchback" part.
Not sure how you trawling through the internet to pull out opinions that reflect your own "puts us on the same page". And the point you continually seem to miss is the fact that it's a "HATCHBACK" is irrelevant.
Your original post claimed that this car wouldn't do well because it has the same power as a Polo TSI, because according to you, that's all that matters. What I have been trying in vain to explain to you is that the bhp rating is not the only thing that matters here.

Also, refrain from personal attacks like "immaturity seems to be the order of the day". That's not what this forum is for. I had a different opinion from yours, which I expressed. If you can't deal with people with different opinions expressing themselves, then perhaps the Internet isn't for you.
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Old 6th May 2013, 22:05   #62
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

I highly doubt that this car is going to see fame anytime soon. 20 + lakhs is ridiculous! ..
might as well buy a sedan or an SUV .. Well , it certainly does have the looks to kill for but those looks can kill your bank account
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Old 6th May 2013, 22:50   #63
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Originally Posted by ghostrider View Post

Not sure how you trawling through the internet to pull out opinions that reflect your own "puts us on the same page". And the point you continually seem to miss is the fact that it's a "HATCHBACK" is irrelevant.
Really? Seriously?


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Originally Posted by ghostrider View Post
Also, refrain from personal attacks like "immaturity seems to be the order of the day". That's not what this forum is for. I had a different opinion from yours, which I expressed. If you can't deal with people with different opinions expressing themselves, then perhaps the Internet isn't for you.
My apologies. No personal insults were intended. Just facts presented. Unfortunately all facts seem to point in a direction opposite to your opinions. And that seems to have been taken personally. I have merely quoted reviews from various professionals. If you have to discount professional reviews as my opinion, that's a choice you make by looking in the opposite direction of what the reality is.

However i will wave the white flag here as i seem to have pressed the wrong buttons and let the numbers speak for themselves.
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Old 6th May 2013, 22:57   #64
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

Woah! Heated exchanges in this thread! I think Merc is doing something no one else has done yet - launch a really nice premium hatchback. VW could do it with the Golf, but they are content with selling Jetta/Laura (which are the same size/platform). However, I think Merc has more brand cachet to sell a premium small car, which VW necessarily does not have. That said, I don't think they will sell hordes of the A class. I think for Merc, success would be moving 2 or 3 thousand of these over a year. One thousand of 1500 may not be called failure. The competition though, is going to heat up. BMW is expected to launch the 1 series soon (not sure in what trim/shape though). Perhaps Audi might consider launching the A3 at a Jetta/Laura price range. I think the target market is more the self driving luxury buyer who would rather have car that is compact enough to be easy in our congested cities, yet look, feel and drive like a true luxury brand car would - of course also come fitted with all bells and whistles.

With regards to the engine, I don't think getting a little more oomph out of a turbo'd engine would be too difficult. There could be ECU tunes that could take the power of this up 10 - 15% without even any hardware additions/changes. Perhaps that is what a lot of the "I want more power" crowd will do.

I would be really interested in how the market reacts to this car and its pricing and also the competition that is coming soon. I think that will determine the future of the German trio in India - who trumps who.
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Old 7th May 2013, 03:58   #65
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

When you look at the A-Class as a hatchback in the Mercedes line-up, 20-25 lakhs isn't so bad. But when you start looking at it as a hatchback in the Indian market, it is quite clearly overpriced. Dropping the price to 15 lakhs will allow the brand too make space for the entry level sedan, the CLA. And I believe this is what Mercedes might do in the coming years. They realize that the 20 lakh segment has potential, so they're using the A to test the waters.

It is a good option for those looking to get an executive sedan in the Laura-Jetta range, i.e. If they don't need the boot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebeem View Post
Let us not read into things and try to see what i "imlpied". I said the A class would fail because its an UNDERPOWERED HATCHBACK!. You seem to have again conveniently missed the "hatchback" part. anyway here's some views in this thread without meaning any disrespect. Hope this puts us on the same page..
I personally don't think it has anything to do with being under powered. It's more to do with the fact that it's a hatchback in the executive sedan space. But the fact that it makes only around 100 horses does not help its case, that's for sure.
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Old 7th May 2013, 07:30   #66
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
I personally don't think it has anything to do with being under powered. It's more to do with the fact that it's a hatchback in the executive sedan space. But the fact that it makes only around 100 horses does not help its case, that's for sure.
Its a tricky territory. It can also depend on the psyche of the buyer. Is a premium hatch in mind or one is looking at it as a performance hatch.

If the buyer has performance in mind, he may think Polo but if he has cash to spare then he may also wait for the 1-series to see how it fares. And with mini also in the line, it can become quite interesting.

But if looked as a permium hatch for that price point and brand value, then its not a deterrent. But having said that for the price point they should have jacked up the power a bit.
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Old 7th May 2013, 08:37   #67
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

In the international markets, the A-Class sits in the category of 1-series, A3, VW Golf etc. To compare in Indian context, the A-Class is as big as the Jetta (sans the boot). And the latter in the fully loaded trim can cost 22-23 lakhs on-road.

The decision to field the A180 CDI as the only diesel variant could be to keep the on-road price in the vicinity of 25 lakhs. Being CKD, bringing in more engine variants later may not be a problem for Mercedes.

For those who really don’t need a large boot, premium hatchbacks like this make loads of sense. I feel this range has lot of potential to attract the affluent young buyers in India.

On a side note, this year looks quite promising. After many years of made for India (or perceived VFM) products, we are getting to see new/better engineered products with latest technology – Polo TSI, A-Class, Ecosport, upcoming 1-series etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vineethvazhayil View Post
BMW is expected to launch the 1 series soon (not sure in what trim/shape though).
There is only one shape for the F20 (hatchback). My guess is, they’ll consider only the 5-door version for India.

Last edited by vb-san : 7th May 2013 at 09:07. Reason: quote added
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Old 7th May 2013, 14:31   #68
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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The same thing was said about i20 1.2 when it was launched. Look at the sheer numbers it is doing!!
Well, i20 1.2 is priced between 5.5-7.5 lakhs OTR for different variants. In fact, I don't remember if the 1.2 manual actually goes up to 7.5. It is not priced at 20 lakhs+.
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Old 7th May 2013, 14:54   #69
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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Well, i20 1.2 is priced between 5.5-7.5 lakhs OTR for different variants. In fact, I don't remember if the 1.2 manual actually goes up to 7.5. It is not priced at 20 lakhs+.
I didnt say i20 is priced at 20L. I just said it was also derided here on this forum for being an overpriced underpowered hatch (whatever some people are saying for A class here)

To extend the argument the same engine is there in i10 but still lots of people buy the i20! There are many very very competent sedans in the same price band but still i20 is a success.

The indian customer has come a long way and there is a definite market now for what you can say non-VFM cars. Engine and power is only one thing. But there are other tangibles as well that people are looking at like style or safety or convenience or brand value etc. A-class definitely ticks boxes for some people. Let us wait and see. I, for one, am happy to see more options in the market. That 20L figure soon would not remain that expansive even in Indian context (given how prices are rising all around. Look at how much we need to pay to buy a house now!)
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Old 7th May 2013, 15:19   #70
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

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Originally Posted by joslicx View Post
I didnt say i20 is priced at 20L. I just said it was also derided here on this forum for being an overpriced underpowered hatch (whatever some people are saying for A class here)

To extend the argument the same engine is there in i10 but still lots of people buy the i20! There are many very very competent sedans in the same price band but still i20 is a success.

The indian customer has come a long way and there is a definite market now for what you can say non-VFM cars. Engine and power is only one thing. But there are other tangibles as well that people are looking at like style or safety or convenience or brand value etc. A-class definitely ticks boxes for some people. Let us wait and see. I, for one, am happy to see more options in the market. That 20L figure soon would not remain that expansive even in Indian context (given how prices are rising all around. Look at how much we need to pay to buy a house now!)
I agree with you on the changing mindset of an Indian customer. However, I wanted to say that there's a limit to being overpriced for a hatchback in the same Indian context. Difference between i20 and i10 in terms of pricing is not as much as between a Polo TSI (which is currently the most expensive hatchback if we leave out the B-Class) and A-Class. I still believe that most of the customers would rather go and buy a Jetta or Superb in that price bracket rather than a Mercedes hatchback - leave aside the power argument, but if Merc thinks they can tap the 20 lakh segment with a hatch (and not a hot one at that), they may not been doing the right thinking. I'm not saying that's the right way to look at it, but that's the way it looks like to most of us. As for the power, I'm willing to shell out 20 lakhs+ if I can afford it for a Golf GTI, which is a 200+ bhp 4 cylinder engine, even if it is a hatchback.

But I do respect your point of view, and only time will tell.
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Old 7th May 2013, 15:58   #71
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

A-class is all set for the launch on May 30th* and Mercedes believes that it is going to be a runaway success as it has done in Europe. It could appeal in India too to the young and the young at heart with its sporty look.
* source Autocar India
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Old 7th May 2013, 17:54   #72
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Default Re: Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details

Lots of discussions on the space power here, with Jetta, laura.. Lets allow the numbers to speak...

Jetta:
L-4644, W-1778, H-1453 mm
138 Hp / 319 Nm

Laura tsi:
L-4569, W-1769, H-1485 mm
160PS / 250 Nm

2012 A-Class 180 (Europe):
L-4292, W-1780, H-1433mm
121Hp / 200 Nm

Mini Cooper:
L-3723 L-1683 H-1407 mm
184Hp / 244 Nm

Not bad.. the A class is a close runner up here...

Also, given the hatchback look, it has been a long journey of love-hate relationship for A-class as it debuted, from 1997. As a first timer in india, pricing would be the 'bang' factor to appeal the takers who are ready to give up the sedan class for this hatch, as the only rivals in this segment+price area are quite distinct in look and design- say beetle, and Mini cooper, which appeal the takers no matter how few. From design perspective A class is not much different (other than size) from a typical hatch shape, which can be a setback. IMO a company like Merc should be establishing standards in the space of design..

It has gone through various changes from 1997 to till date, and believe me.. this one is the best, if you look back to the A-class history.. I've got the 'highlights' on its historical journey; lets flachback with the figures, to see what all is done to keep this going every time the new model is launched.. check the attachments..

Pls Note that the all the figures are factory standard -
Attached Thumbnails
Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details-aclass-evolutionpart-1.jpg  

Mercedes A-Class Preview : Pictures & Details-aclass-evolutionpart-2.jpg  

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Old 7th May 2013, 18:25   #73
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Lots of discussions on the space power here, with Jetta, ...
Just wanted to clarify - in my earlier posts, I kept on talking about sedans like Jetta, Superb etc. In the 20 lakh+ segment. I stand corrected - I meant Passat, and not Jetta. Passat and Superb are D+ segment cars in India, whereas Jetta ia D segment. Quoting from spyder's post since my error dawned upon me while I was reading the very informative comparison data. Thanks.
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Old 7th May 2013, 23:17   #74
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I still believe that most of the customers would rather go and buy a Jetta or Superb in that price bracket rather than a Mercedes hatchback
well an equally valid counter-argument would be why settle for a VAG when you can get a Merc! At the end of the day a Merc is a Merc hatch or no hatch. If that boot and all the extra power is not much of a big deal then it is a compelling choice (yes its a big if for some and no so big for others). You can get many features not there in contenders - that awesome moonroof for one. In the end its all about what you want. Why restrict to elephant size sedans only especially if all that space is not needed?
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Old 8th May 2013, 07:32   #75
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Finally, it's an A220 CDI, both petrol and diesel Mumbai on road 26 lakhs, only the petrol will have a panoramic sunroof. Rest of the internal features are the same. For a small amount, the power/torque can be increased without affecting warranty.
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