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Old 8th July 2013, 20:40   #61
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

It would have been good the lowering of G.C was done cleverly so that it could be raised again aftermarket by those inclined to do so.
Just a thought - but is that really technically feasible? What aftermarket replaceable parts can be swapped to achieve this ?

--R
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Old 8th July 2013, 22:13   #62
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

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Originally Posted by rajshenoy View Post
ACI reports as if M&M has already done this:

http://www.autocarindia.com/News/349...h-suv-tax.aspx
An interesting point in the article is that by just changing the system of measurement of the ground clearance,30mm was reduced.It says the Indian system(maybe measuring lowest point of car to the road) showed a GC of 170mm instead of 200mm in the European Arc system.
So many sedans which are hit by the excise hike can use this system to evade this hike or maybe they have done it but have not made much noise about it.
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Old 8th July 2013, 22:48   #63
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Quote:
Originally Posted by rajshenoy View Post
ACI reports as if M&M has already done this:

http://www.autocarindia.com/News/349...h-suv-tax.aspx

Says upto 33000 reduction in cost. with W6 costing over 15Lakhs in Bangalore, 33000 seems like a tiny drop. Their sales are sliding and they need much more than 33000.

Having said that, if the car is coming with improved feature set, it will be a good boost
I checked the prices on the Anant Cars website - it shows the older ex showroom price eg W6 is 12,25,000 whereas the XUV site by Mahindra says new prices effective July 5 for W6 is 11,99,000. Similarly for W8.

So it does look like the ex showroom prices have been dropped already. But I guess the dealers will charge the new lower prices only for the new stock that arrives and not the ones already produced before July 5.
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Old 9th July 2013, 07:28   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragul View Post
Just a thought - but is that really technically feasible? What aftermarket replaceable parts can be swapped to achieve this ?

--R
Fiat gave that option for older Linea and Punto. Even XUV5OO is monocoque like all Fiat cars. And the cost was also about 15,000 Rs only. Even if it costs 25k for XUV5OO, it would still be a saving (more so because this additional amount is not included while calculating road tax, EMI and insurance premium).
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Old 9th July 2013, 08:38   #65
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

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Originally Posted by rohanjf View Post
Fiat gave that option for older Linea and Punto. Even XUV5OO is monocoque like all Fiat cars. And the cost was also about 15,000 Rs only. Even if it costs 25k for XUV5OO, it would still be a saving (more so because this additional amount is not included while calculating road tax, EMI and insurance premium).
Rohan, multiple things here. Your observation about Linea and Punto is actually correct. There was a problem with low GC in those cars and Fiat offered a solution and charged customers for it.

With XUV5OO, currently there is no problem with the GC. Members who have taken it to Laddakh can vouch for that. Now M&M lowers the GC by making some changes and passes on the duty benefit to the customer. That's OK. But charging the new customers for increasing the GC again to original levels, sounds counterintuitive. It will partially wipe off the duty savings passed on to the customer and M&M would be back to square one in terms of addressing the sagging demand.

Last edited by SDP : 9th July 2013 at 08:39.
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Old 9th July 2013, 13:36   #66
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

I have read the article and it doesn't say anywhere that there will be modifications to the car to bring down the GC. it merely says that a stone guard will be added to bring the GC below 170mm. So, all the prospective SUV buyers talking about handling and how the SUV's will lose their characteristic please read the article properly. The one on Autocar says that till now Mahindra was following the European style of measuring GC which differs from the Indian system. According to that the XUV 5OO has 200 mm GC but when measured under the Indian system it is actually less and only the addition of a stone guard will solve the problem.

So, people don't lose your mind buy an XUV and get the stone guard removed.
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Old 9th July 2013, 14:01   #67
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Tweets about XUV. Seems like W4 is coming.

Quote:
Hormazd Sorabjee ‏@hormazdsorabjee 50m
Mahindra readies lower cost 'W4' XUV500 but will only launch it if there is a drop in sales. Here's the full story. http://ow.ly/mMv4h
Quote:
Autocar India ‏@autocarindiamag 1h
#Mahindra readies base ‘W4’ #XUV500 variant >> http://ow.ly/mMv4h

Last edited by Dry Ice : 9th July 2013 at 14:05.
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Old 9th July 2013, 14:09   #68
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Quote:
Originally Posted by searchingheaven View Post
For the complete article, visit: Autocar


Mods, please merge/delete if already posted or discussed.
Do you think that an additional 3 % actually matters to a customer buying a 10 Lakh to 15 lakh class SUV ? Unless the customer is a commerical vehicle operator, then too he will not buy a higher end SUV unless he is a luxury taxi operator.
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Old 9th July 2013, 14:10   #69
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Spoke to the SA today and he informed me that the next lot of vehicles which has been ordered by his dealership will come with the reduced GC (which btw is just an addition of a stone guard). He also informed that the stone guard is easily removable if so desired by the customer.

He had also mentioned that the price during delivery is what is applicable and it will be the same price for all cars (both old and newer ones with the reduced GC).
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Old 9th July 2013, 14:29   #70
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Will the 'Stone Guard' function as a skid plate? Then it need not be removed i guess.
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Old 9th July 2013, 20:39   #71
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

why has the govt decided to impose additional tax on :
a) cars longer than 4m
b) cars having engine capacity > 1.2L
c) cars having GC > 160mm
d) ... xxx specs of a vehicle (??)

=> the sole purpose seems to be "to 'ensure' that 'luxury' car buyers (or) 'performance' oriented car buyers (or) 'offroading enthusiasts' (or) buyers targetting a combination of these; who DO NOT fit into the category of 'i just want a fuel efficient small car that will take me from point A to point B, which will guzzle less fuel, which hogs less road-space'; are made to pay more for buying the vehicle"

Now, if the above is the real purpose, which babu came up with the above a) b) c) d) criteria ? all that needed to be done was to impose additional tax based on vehicle cost (just like income tax slabs). The forces of free market will ensure that the more affluent buyers who want more than 'just a car' are taxed more. It was this simple & what we have ended up with, is a set of complex laws which have large loopholes.

This whole 'low GC' with stone guard for the bolero/scorpio/XUV is mahindra's way of telling the govt : 'your loopholes are so big, I can shove an entire XUV through the loophole'
Afterall :( , this is india, where the legislature/babudom makes a forture by carefully planting loopholes into the rules/laws.

Last edited by venkyhere : 9th July 2013 at 20:48. Reason: typo
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Old 10th July 2013, 22:32   #72
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

This news of M&M 'reducing' the XUV's official GC by incorporating a stone guard under the engine baffles me. All XUVs since launch already have a stone guard and I happen to be very familiar with this part (stone guard) because mine needed to be replaced after it broke during my recent expedition to Ladakh. I wrote about it here (Debuda’s Silver Mahindra XUV500 W6 @ Jamshedpur).

Probably, M&M are simply going to replace the existing plastic stone guard with a metallic one, as some TBHPians have suggested on this thread. It seems that plastic parts are not taken into account for computation of official GC in India. I had earlier expressed my thoughts about this here (Mahindra XUV500 : Test Drive & Review).

If my guess (that M&M are replacing the plastic stone guard with a metallic one to reduce the official GC) is correct, I would be very happy personally. Many new (and ignorant) XUV owners, having benefited from the lower cost (due to lower excise), would readily discard their metallic stone guards to 'restore' their GC to that of the 'original' XUV and I would cheaply acquire one of those instead of getting a steel one custom-made as I've been planning!

The fragile nature of the plastic stone guard of the XUV was also exposed during the ASEAN-India Car Rally 2012 when 14 of the 28 participating XUVs lost their skid plates (stone guards) on a cratered stretch of road in Myanmar (Source : Autocar India, Feb 2013, page 111).

IMHO, the only 2 useful purposes being served by the flimsy plastic stone guards in the 200 mm GC XUVs (like mine) are : (1) Keeping the engine bottom clean; and (2) Reduce wind resistance (at high speeds) marginally by keeping the flow of air under the car streamlined. It definitely cannot live up to its official name by guarding the engine oil pan against stones.

I eagerly await the arrival of metallic stone guards in the kabadi market!
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Old 12th July 2013, 09:34   #73
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

utter rot. now the sumo, bolero and all other people movers of the rural hinterland will be taxed extra as well. and think of it, for the really affluent, what difference should a 3% difference make?
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Old 12th July 2013, 10:40   #74
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Quote:
Originally Posted by debuda View Post
...
I eagerly await the arrival of metallic stone guards in the kabadi market!
Debuda,
This is a masterstroke by M&M - killing two birds with one stone.
1. People complaining about the lousy plastic stoneguard would now have a option of opting for a proper metal one from the service-center instead of working out a jugaad solution with the help of a local garage or body shop.

2. Rubbing govt's nose in the dirt who has been acting foolish by defining SUV in a arbitary way and imposing additional duties, thereby creating an uneven playing field for different manufacturers.

On a lighter note, I doubt we would get metal stone-guards in the kabadi market. People who get their cars with the metal stone-guard would soon realize that its actually a good thing.

regards

Last edited by SDP : 12th July 2013 at 10:42.
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Old 12th July 2013, 10:58   #75
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Default Re: M&M may modify some SUVs to duck Excise Duties *UPDATE* Pg.3 XUV to lose some GC

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marauder View Post
An interesting point in the article is that by just changing the system of measurement of the ground clearance,30mm was reduced.It says the Indian system(maybe measuring lowest point of car to the road) showed a GC of 170mm instead of 200mm in the European Arc system.
So many sedans which are hit by the excise hike can use this system to evade this hike or maybe they have done it but have not made much noise about it.
Could you give a link for the details of the European Arc system?
Thanks.
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