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Old 9th August 2013, 14:32   #151
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Audi India sold 705 cars, a growth of 4 percent (July 2012: 680 cars).

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German luxury carmaker Audi has recorded 19 percent sales growth in the first seven months of this calendar year. Audi India has sold a total of 5,551 cars between January-July 2013, a growth of 19 percent (January-July 2012: 4,680 cars).

http://autocarpro.in/contents/NewsDe...px?NewsID=2701
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Old 10th August 2013, 08:52   #152
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Originally Posted by aniketi View Post
At the end of the day, whatever people say, Maruti is still number 1 in India. Maintaining almost 45 % share is not a joke with so much competition around. Now other companies like Honda, Toyota, Ford etc are here for well more than a decade now but still not able to understand Indian customers mentality completely. There numbers just shows that. People still don't have 100 % faith in them. So going forward, if these companies want to compete with Maruti, better they try to understand Indian people first. Then only they can be able to generate large numbers. Lets hope these companies will learn it faster.
The trickiest part of the Indian market is its taxation system. If a manufacturer decides to invest 25000 to 50000 extra on product quality and quality control process, it translates into 50,000 to 1,00,000 increase in the actual price of the vehicle, thanks to our unscientific double and triple taxation systems. We pay taxes on top of taxes. The saddest part is this happens in a country where the spending capacity is less than half of America or the middle east.

Now, when a company like Honda and Toyota enters the segment, they cannot compensate on their core values. For eg:- Toyota's core values are space, comfort, performance, durability & reliability, lightness in design, easily serviceable design, ergonomics etc. Now, when Toyota makes a car for the budget sedan segment, they had 3
2 options -
1. give a world car to India ( like Honda did with the city ) and price it high.
2. design a car from scratch without compromising on their values, but bringing down the price by not caring too much about the aesthetics.

1st option would have been very easy for Toyota. Just release the Yaris with some minor changes to suspension and engine tuning. But, they thought that's not exactly what the Indian customer really needs based on our life style and economic environment.

Some of the design considerations they have made are really appreciable.

Eg:- They knew that Indians are closely bonded to family and travel with elder members of the family. They designed the rear bench with a lot of room, took out the middle hump so that 5 th person can sit comfortably.
They also knew that we have to handle very hot summers and the rear benchers cannot be left out here.
They aligned the centre ac vents to the left, so that it's not obstructed by the driver's hand. Another advantage, such design has is that it doesn't chill the hands of the driver and cause discomfort.
They also gave an air cooled glove box ( I always use this on my long trips ). They also designed it so that even a small laptop can be accommodated inside it!
Putting the speedo on the center gave people of any height, the freedom to use steering tilt without worrying about obstructing the speedo.
When you design a car for 5 people, you have to give enough boot space. The boot space of the Etios is bigger than that of any sedan you'll find in India.
They gave a wheel base longer than the Manza ( very critical in giving comfort without compromising on stability )
They understood that in Indian driving conditions, what you need is low and mid end torque and not high end performance. So, instead of opting for a high tech 1.2 l petrol, they opted for the old gen 1.5 l petrol which gave power at the slightest tap of the pedal. For the diesel, it was easy. They gave torque from low rpms, and ensured that the peak torque is maintained over a 600 rpm range!
They also made sure that the components used in the car are durable and rarely has to be replaced.
There are many other such small design elements on the Etios, which I do not want to elaborate on now. I would do that on my ownership thread some time later.

After doing all this, they didn't do that final sugar coating - aka aesthetics. An average Indians doesn't want to be seen as any lesser than a person from developed nation whatever our financial environment is. Toyota did miss out on this thinking of the Indian customer when they designed the Etios. They fixed most of it in the 2013 face lift. But, it was to late by then. But, still I feel that with the Etios, Toyota has got the perfect launch pad for their next sedan - the dear Qin ( similar to the way, the 'dated' Qualis was for the Innova. ). I plan to keep this car for 10 + years atleast.

Honda, learning from the Toyota experience got a perfect design in the Amaze. It has got enough sugar coating without compromising on the core values of Honda. It's a fantastic design and this is going to take Honda to number 3 position soon. And the more Honda is going to sell the Amaze, the more Maruti is going to take a hit.

It's not easy to dislodge a number 1 brand in any field. For example, Maruti changes the shape of a hatch to a sedan with 300l boot space ( figo has 290l and more space inside the cabin than a Dzire ) and calls it a sedan, we Indians believe that it's a sedan. This vehicle simply won't sell in any other part of the world ( even if it was made by Toyota for same price )
And they also smartly reduced the already cramped boot space of the new swift. This made the Dzire boot space look OK, when it was released. Smart marketing, I would say. But, as a customer, I'm not to take it irrespective of how many others go behind it. The last good sedan design from Maruti was the Baleno. It didn't sell. And then Maruti gave a design which the Indian public demands and it won. We cannot blame Maruti for it. Every design is to make money. And I hope brands like Toyota and Honda don't forget about their core values which give them high reputation all over the world when they go this sugar coating way at some point.

Last edited by amalji : 10th August 2013 at 09:11.
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Old 10th August 2013, 09:05   #153
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Originally Posted by amalji View Post
1. give a world car to India ( like Honda did with the city ) and price it high.
City is sold only 3rd world/developing countries.
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Old 10th August 2013, 09:14   #154
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City is sold only 3rd world/developing countries.
I've seen a lot of city in the middle east. If middle east is considered a developing country, then modify what I meant accordingly. For Toyota, they handle countries of the middle east and emerging nations like India separately.
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Old 10th August 2013, 09:40   #155
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Tata needs a serious partner from Korea,Japan or even US .Co Branding must. Days of buying Indian brand Car for patriotism is over. It is a global warfare out there. Survival of the Fittest.
That is a very big load of rubbish. What companies are you talking about when you say Japan, Korea and US? All Japanese companies, Korean companies and the US companies are here already. Maybe just the French PSA group is available for collaboration (it is almost a GM company now) but then Tata has enough strength of its own. It has lost its way, but with some concerted action it can get back. In a competitive market losing share means that it will take a huge effort and a long time to recover the lost share. But I am sure Tata can do it. I do not think you are even aware of the basics of the car market and how it is playing out. Otherwise you would not make this nonsensical statement.
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Old 10th August 2013, 10:21   #156
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What companies are you talking about when you say Japan, Korea and US? All Japanese companies, Korean companies and the US companies are here already.
Japanese - Mazda, Mitsubishi, Subaru
US - Chrysler.
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Old 10th August 2013, 11:17   #157
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Enjoyed reading your surmise, though I'd disagree on the Yaris front. Being exposed to the model in the middle east, (in my view) the car with minor changes would have sufficed to take on Swift.

Though I'm no fan of the sedan version myself, I consider that an opportunity lost for Toyota.

Even the IQ with an extended base would have worked (Have seen this model as well). They have a great arsenal of products, and the Etios could have covered the lower flanks later.

You are right about Amaze ticking all the boxes. It's a great combo of hygiene factors, and a svelte exterior. Will they get it right the next time around with Jazz and the Brio based MPV? Only time can tell.

Also, I feel the market is ready for their Nbox. Another slumbering giant is Nissan. They have fantastic cars in Tiida (Ticks all the boxes) and Juke (Ecosport challenger?), but they don't release it in India!

Maruti's success, (in this day), is a mystery to me. The Swift is too cramped, with black interiors that further accentuate the feeling. A 60:40 back bench would help there. The new Alto is a Frankenstein; from every angle it looks like a different car. The WagonR's front-end doesnt work for me at all, 'blue eye' notwithstanding. (But, big thumbs up to StingRay. It looks sophisticated and practical at the same time).

"1st option would have been very easy for Toyota. Just release the Yaris with some minor changes to suspension and engine tuning. But, they thought that's not exactly what the Indian customer really needs based on our life style and economic environment."
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Old 10th August 2013, 11:25   #158
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Japanese - Mazda, Mitsubishi, Subaru
US - Chrysler.
Mitsubishi is already in India with Hindustan Motors and it looks like the company will stop selling in the Indian market just as it did in the European market. It is a company that is not doing well and I do not see how it will help Tata when it is really not in a position to help itself.

Mazda has been quoted as coming to India on its own steam by Autocar India in the later of 2012 and found that the CX-5 crossover was being tested. Apart from that Mazda still shares platforms with Ford despite Ford having withdrawn its 33% investment in the Japanese company. Mazda is relying on Maruti to give its Ertiga to Mazda which it intends to re-badge and sell in markets such as India. Mazda does not have a great product portfolio.

Sabaru is even sadder because it has relied on Suzuki to provide it platforms in the past and that included the old Maruti Esteem platform. It was once a part of the GM umbrella post which it has leased out some of its idle production lines to Toyota and subsequently Toyota has taken a share of over 15% in the Fuji owned company. Their only car that has been a star is the WRC spec Impreza which would be too expensive in the Indian car market.

Coming to Chrysler it is no longer a free agent and is on the verge of being taken over entirely by FIAT. Already FIAT India has announced bringing the Jeep range from Chrysler into India and that means that you may as well forget Chrysler coming to the aid of Tata, especially after Tata and Fiat have parted ways in the sales and distribution of cars. The collaboration with Fiat is still on for the manufacturing of cars at the Ranjangaon plant.

My point is that Tata has access to the Multijet diesel and the Fire petrol engines from Fiat. It really does not need anymore collaborators.
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Old 10th August 2013, 14:07   #159
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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For eg:- Toyota's core values are space, comfort, performance, durability & reliability, lightness in design, easily serviceable design, ergonomics etc.
Is that somewhere documented? I don't think you left out anything in teh 'core values'
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Old 10th August 2013, 14:22   #160
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Originally Posted by sadsack View Post
Mitsubishi is already in India with Hindustan Motors and it looks like the company will stop selling in the Indian market just as it did in the European market. It is a company that is not doing well and I do not see how it will help Tata when it is really not in a position to help itself.
There is a lot of platform sharing between Nissan and Renault - but they still are both present in India. There is no reason why Chrysler or Suburu or Mazda cannot do the same.

Last edited by mobike008 : 12th August 2013 at 11:24. Reason: Please dont quote entire post for a short reply. Next time infraction..
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Old 10th August 2013, 14:57   #161
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I too trust Tata . I feel that they have capable cars and offer excellent value for money with respect to space and features . All I feel their top management need to be more motivated and feel more responsible to give us more quality products most other manufacturers will bite the dust . They just don't feel that committed . They work like in the government . Lazy and at ease always . This makes them complacent . Disclaimer . I have an indigo dicor and a nano . But I also have a Honda amaze diesel . I have owned maruti 800 and alto for 8 and 9 years respectively .
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Old 10th August 2013, 15:36   #162
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Is that somewhere documented? I don't think you left out anything in teh 'core values'
Try reading through any book on Toyota like the Toyota Kata. :-)
Space, comfort, performance had a mention in many Toyota ads. You visit the Toyota service center, and you will understand how much they give priority for durability and easy serviceability when they design parts.
There is an old story with the Lexus, where Toyota engineers mentioned a concern that all of the competition was having heavy weight design. The management still decided against making the car heavy because they knew that if they compromise on that one aspect, the Toyota durability and reliability will go for a toss.

Last edited by amalji : 10th August 2013 at 15:44.
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Old 10th August 2013, 16:07   #163
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

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Try reading through any book on Toyota like the Toyota Kata. :-)
I am sure you read about it in that only!

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Space, comfort, performance had a mention in many Toyota ads.
Ah, I missed them.
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Old 11th August 2013, 10:18   #164
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Still cant understand why Honda City charts such hills and slopes on its sales figures.
Dzire seems to have gotten over the Amaze factor, and is creeping back up.
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Old 13th August 2013, 10:24   #165
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Default Re: July 2013 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis

Mercedes regains top spot in India’s luxury car market in July sales.

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MB managed to bag the top slot by selling 810 cars ahead of Audi's 705 units in July. BMW has stopped sharing its sales data but is understood as finished third
While a one-month lead may not be a clear indicator about overall segment leadership, industry analysts said Mercedes Benz is going aggressive on the back of new product launches, especially with compact models like the A- and B-Class.


http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/b...w/21792888.cms
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