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Old 30th April 2015, 21:35   #121
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
That is true. People seem to have no issues with things like the Ruster and the Dodgy even though they're based on pretty much the same platform as a Romanian Logan, and feature the same engine.

Either we have really high expectations of our home manufacturers and wish them to be best in class, or still nurse the colonial hangover to judge the white boys by a different set of rules.

I'd like to add to that actually, it's not just foreign brands actually, I'll put myself out on a limb here & say that vehicles like the Bolero don't face half the vitriolic sentiment that TM has faced over the Bolt & the Zest. Before anyone throws the 'iconic' bit in my face, my bigger problem with the Bolero is that Mahindra has stuck to an archaic platform that has flaws cause they know that it will sell either ways. Anyone who's driven the Bolero knows that it isn't the most ergonomic place to be in, has Mahindra done anything to fix it's shortcomings so far? Even the updated engines have been more about emission norms more than anything else. Maruti's being doing it for the longest time, take a slow selling product update it and re-launch it with a new name or better yet take an existing outdated best seller, re-skin it a bit, launch it as the latest version & laugh all the way the way to the bank for the next decade!

I can appreciate the argument that they didn't need to launch new models but TM does due it's precarious position (deep pockets aside, lets face it, the passenger car division is in trouble), but the harsh reality is that they can't pick up an existing car from a global portfolio and launch it here. They are going to take time for sure. Are they in a nightmare of their own making? Definitely! Mahindra was in pretty much the same position, but they were able to manage expectations better, they definitely worked smarter, in essence they too have just 3-4 platforms to work off, but they've done a better job of getting slightly better reliability out of the products coming from them.

Also, the discussion borders on moot because the manufacturer is essentially saying it out loud that these products are updated versions of current products while they develop their new line -up. Cars based on the AMP will only see light of the day in 2017/18 (can't remember where but I did read it somewhere). So I don't really see what new information is coming up with the same tirade at every launch, accept it, updated products are what are coming out of their stables right now.
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Old 30th April 2015, 21:44   #122
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Kite is good looking. Front (as per the rendering ) is Zestish, and is quite good.

Rear promises to be good.

Tata is inching back, as I see it.
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Old 30th April 2015, 23:48   #123
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

The Kite looks fresh and I hope Tata can launch it with some basics taken care of
a. Limited variants (low, mid, top), taking a leaf out of Maruti's book. I think even the Zest has too many variants (4?)
b. Ensure good finish and build quality - looks like they have achieved this with the Zest?
c. Light and fuel efficient engines - not a strong point with Tata vehicles which tend to be on the heavier side and most engines are a touch too old (save for the 1.3D)
d. Price it right - No repeats of the Aria, Bolt fiascos
e. Get the showroom experience right - stock enough test drive models and equip staff with knowledge about the product. Also, a decent web presence is probably mandatory as well. IMHO, Tata has some way to go here, especially compared to a Maruti or Hyundai for ex.

Not a very tall ask and something Tata is eminently capable of. Remember the time when everyone had written off Tata as a PV company in early 2000s when the Indica failed only for them to come back with Indica V2. Agree, the expectation or competition was not as tough as today, but then Tata capability was not what it is today.

Good luck Tata!
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Old 1st May 2015, 08:54   #124
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Disclaimer: I am in no way associated with TML, except perhaps being "guilty" of owning their vehicles in the past and presently as well.

This post is not about the Kite twins as such, but what does it really mean when people say that X vehicle is based on Y vehicle's platform and in this case Kite twins based on Indica platform.

My rant is because of the unnecessary baggage that gets attached to the Kite by saying its on the Indica platform and people don't seem to see the effort behind developing this car.

We can see here that Kite appears to have a different body as compared to Indica, the dashboard is changed, the engines are expected to be new , the diesel probably derived from existing 1.4 but with enough changes to call it new. The petrol engine as per ACI is completely new and not derived from Xeta or the Revotron, so the ECMs are going to be different.

As per ACI the rear suspension is no longer independent like in the Indica and would be similar to that of the Zest/Bolt,the steering is expected to be electric instead of hydraulic. Could it be that the tyres are the same ones as in the Indica, would TML save money there ?

For me this is pretty much a completely newly developed car. If I were TML, I would keep my mouth shut of any talk about Kite being based on Indica platform.

So where does Tata save money ? Would love you hear your thoughts.
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Old 1st May 2015, 10:56   #125
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Quote:
Originally Posted by da_lowrider View Post
Are they in a nightmare of their own making? Definitely! Mahindra was in pretty much the same position, but they were able to manage expectations better, they definitely worked smarter, in essence they too have just 3-4 platforms to work off, but they've done a better job of getting slightly better reliability out of the products coming from them.
I agree with your thoughts. But specifically on Mahindra being spared the scrutiny vis a vis Tata, and in relative terms, the fact is Tata is more exposed to competition in the segments they play. Hence there are more ways of comparing their products and evaluation.

Mahindra, in terms of their bread and butter play are more cocooned. What is the direct competition to Bolero, Scorio and even XUV? And then what is the direct competition to Zest, Bolt and India family?

It is difficult to say, why we ask more questions of Tata or home grown brands. It seems to be more psychological than fact based.
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Old 1st May 2015, 21:00   #126
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

The rear looks similar to the Grand i10 or new Ford Figo and looks good to me. Would love to see what new TATA brings for the customers.
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Old 1st May 2015, 21:31   #127
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Quote:
Originally Posted by prashanthyr View Post
a. Limited variants (low, mid, top), taking a leaf out of Maruti's book. I think even the Zest has too many variants (4?)
Good luck Tata!
Agree with all the other points - I think you have covered everything - good fit, finish, build quality, refreshed designs and improved showroom experience should do it for Tata, and they are very much capable now.
But then I love the XMS variant - enables you to buy safety features at mid-variant level.

Last edited by jetti : 1st May 2015 at 21:34.
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Old 1st May 2015, 22:14   #128
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Spotted this on the ghats near pune. Didn't look like a Tata Car at all. And most probably this is with a diesel engine as it was emitting lot of smoke.
Attached Thumbnails
The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-dscn6473optimized.jpg  

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-dscn6474optimized.jpg  

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Old 2nd May 2015, 13:59   #129
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jetti View Post
But then I love the XMS variant - enables you to buy safety features at mid-variant level.
True, safety is important and I hope Tata can provide basics like rear wash / wipe, ABS and Airbags as standard or optional across all variants and not just on the mid / top variants. This will also give them an USP and will likely push everyone else to provide Airbags / ABS as standard.

In Europe, AC or power windows can be an optional extras, but safety features like rear wash / wipe, ABS, 4-6 Airbags are pretty much standard across the range! Of course, India is a different kettle of fish altogether!
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Old 4th May 2015, 10:23   #130
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

A big thank you to Aadesh Jain for sharing these images with other enthusiasts.

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_014.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_016.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_017.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_018.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_019.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_021.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_022.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_023.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_025.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_026.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_027.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_028.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_029.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-wp_20150428_030.jpg

Link to Team-BHP News Article
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Old 4th May 2015, 11:20   #131
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

The design language seems similar to last gen i20. Its a good thing though. Very few bits like the rear door design gives away that its based on indica. Initial impression, job well done Tata!
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Old 4th May 2015, 20:55   #132
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

According to Autocar India the Kite will get a new 1.2L Petrol engine producing around 75 BHP. This engine will have three cylinders, 4 valve per cylinder with an aluminium block. The Diesel engine on the other hand will be a 1.05L version of the 1.4L Dicor, producing around 70BHP.

source - http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...-394836.aspx/0
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Old 5th May 2015, 19:29   #133
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Default re: The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)

This part about the petrol engine is confusing:

Quote:
The petrol engine set to be offered is an all-new 1.2-litre three-cylinder unit which may also carry the ‘Revotron’ name. The new Revotron, unlike the current engine, uses an aluminium block and four valves per cylinder in place of the cast-iron block and two valves per cylinder. The new engine is expected to generate about 75bhp. The current Revotron motor will likely get a boost in power to make differentiation easier.
Both engines being called Revotron? One is 3 cyl and other is Turbocharged 4 cyl? One Cast Iron and other Aluminium? Why share the same name when they have nothing in common?

From same source - http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...-394836.aspx/0
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Old 9th May 2015, 17:24   #134
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Default Scoop Pictures: Tata Motors Hatchback

Saw couple of these near Hinjewadi today. The form reminded me of peugeot hatches, albeit on stilts.

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-1431172294315.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-1431172323601.jpg

The Tata Zica Hatchback (aka Kite)-1431172355625.jpg

Last edited by .anshuman : 9th May 2015 at 19:25.
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Old 9th May 2015, 19:29   #135
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Default re: Scoop Pictures: Tata Motors Hatchback

That's the Kite hatchback. Good catch.
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