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Old 5th May 2014, 19:33   #16
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

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Originally Posted by IshaanIan View Post
Funny, the global i10 (as advertised by Mr. Khan), failed miserably in the global ncap tests forget the lack of aribags, the structure itself was dangerous, the i20 we get here is a LOT lighter spec for spec when compared to the ones sold in Europe, Honda and Nissan's cars have not yet been tested; it would be interesting to see how the City does or the Terrano (euro ncap rates it 3 stars, if it follows the trend and performs poorer here in India, imagine how bad it could get)

Of the bunch you have picked, I would only applaud VW, immediately after the global ncap tests, they ensured every Polo even the baseline variant, comes with abs and dual airbags as standard

Not sure about the Swift diesel, but the petrol one tested by global ncap, had positive initial reactions so I'd reserve your wrath for when we know about more test results

That's why Ishaan, I used the words 'That Much' in my comment above We know that everyone, including Hyundai have done the shenanigans. But what I like was that Hyundai is the only brand which manages to outfit Side & Curtain airbags in addition to Driver & Passenger airbags on vehicles under 10 lakh (i20 & Verna)

Now, compare VW & Toyota, who both are in a fight to be the world's largest manufacturers. While VW has stopped selling cars without airbags, look at Toyota who are still selling a 20+lakh vehicle like Fortuner without Side & Curtain Airbags, Traction Control & Electronic Stability Control. How can anyone justify shelling out 25lakh & not getting these standard safety features?

Of course, I have nothing but harsh words for the National Car Company Suzuki for their utter lack in leading the industry in safety features. If Maruti were to make atleast Airbags & ABS standard on Swift, it would lead to a sea change in the industry.
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Old 5th May 2014, 20:10   #17
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

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Originally Posted by Desi Dybuk View Post
That's why Ishaan, I used the words 'That Much' in my comment above We know that everyone, including Hyundai have done the shenanigans. But what I like was that Hyundai is the only brand which manages to outfit Side & Curtain airbags in addition to Driver & Passenger airbags on vehicles under 10 lakh (i20 & Verna)

Of course, I have nothing but harsh words for the National Car Company Suzuki for their utter lack in leading the industry in safety features. If Maruti were to make atleast Airbags & ABS standard on Swift, it would lead to a sea change in the industry.
I guess it is down to personal preference then. 6 airbags won't make a difference if a car is structurally unsafe (I am not insinuating or pointing to any particular models here) I feel cars ought to first be structurally safe, and then offer a minimum level of safety features to everyone. VW ticks both these boxes while MS India does not. However, that does not mean Hyundai is excused; they have their fair share of structurally weak cars, and they do not offer active safety equipment like abs and airbags as standard on their sub million buck cars either. Hyundai also seems to never issue a recall out in the open for things like suspension in the Verna (has been fixed in the 2014 iteration, but only one bhpian so far has managed to have his replaced even though there is supposedly a TSB out there) and have never acknowledged or rectified issues with the vibrating steering in the i20, these acts lead me to believe that their offering you the option to buy 6 airbags on top end variants of their cars, is merely theater; their core values do not reflect any concern for their customer's safety.

So while I am not saying Maruti Suzuki India is holding a torch to what modern automotive safety in our country ought to be, I'm just saying that if I were to applaud manufacturers, I would do so the ones that offer:
1. A structurally safe car
2. ABS and dual airbags as standard
NOT a company that has a large portfolio that in the 21st century still contains a few structurally unsafe cars with no standard features, but compromises by offering you the option of paying a hefty sum for 6 airbags in their top-end variants.

Last edited by IshaanIan : 5th May 2014 at 20:16.
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Old 5th May 2014, 20:19   #18
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

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Originally Posted by IshaanIan View Post
I guess it is down to personal preference then. 6 airbags won't make a difference if a car is structurally unsafe (I am not insinuating or pointing to any particular models here) I feel cars ought to first be structurally safe, and then offer a minimum level of safety features to everyone. VW ticks both these boxes while MS India does not. However, that does not mean Hyundai is excused; they have their fair share of structurally weak cars, and they do not offer active safety equipment like abs and airbags as standard on their sub million buck cars either.
Agree with you 100%. My only point was that, as a consumer, in absence of an Indian NCAP results, I have to assume that structurally the cars sold in EU & India are similar & Indian models haven't been tampered structurally since I can't see inside the sheetmetal. For ex., I have to assume that the I20 sold in EU & India is structurally same with the only differences being things like lack of Airbags, TCS, ECS etc., which I can see from the sales brochures.

Of course, if the car companies have tampered with the structural integrity of the car by removing intrusion bars etc., I have no idea to find out about it.

And that's the reason why we need to have an Indian NCAP which maintains parity with international standards to compare. Just because a mode has 5 Star rating in EuroNCAP doesn't necessarily mean that the same model sold in India is safe either.

The need of the hour is that the information should be available to Indian consumers on how the models sold here compare internationally. Sadly, ARAI seems to be the hand maiden of the car manufacturers & the Indian government is blissfully unconcerned.
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Old 5th May 2014, 20:53   #19
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

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Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
I am really surprised about the new Corolla results though. This is ought to be the latest Corolla model and hence should have been safer still. While 4-stars in itself is not bad, it is certainly not good given even older hatchbacks scored more for protection. I would be interesting to see how the Indian made Punto/Linea perform in the test.
I think the standards are different for different sized vehicles. Considering the results, I wouldn't be surprised if Toyota went back to the drawing boards to fix the lacunae since Corolla is one of their highest selling model & they would want to flaunt their 5 Star rating in their ads.

If they don't do that, expect VW & Hyundai taunt Toyota since they have 5 Star ratings for their models in the same category.
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Old 5th May 2014, 21:39   #20
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

The Vento report states on first page, "It scored 4-Star Adult Occupant Protection (AOP) since ESC is not available (AOP points in 5-Star range)". The Vento TSI has ESP, which I believe is another acronym for ESC. So is it safe to assume that the TSI variant will achieve 5 star rating?
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Old 6th May 2014, 06:15   #21
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

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Originally Posted by mpksuhas View Post
Traction control is same as what is called as launch control I guess ? If so it is to minimize wheel spin while starting the vehicle from a complete stop. I don't think it will make any change in crash worthiness.
Being part of safety equipment (to prevent accidents) like ABS etc is reason enough to desire/choose it.
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Old 7th May 2014, 00:05   #22
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Default The ASEAN NCAP Crash Test

I recently found out about the ASEAN NCAP crash test


http://www.aseancap.org/. They seem very rigorous and well performed.

Currently, very few cars have been tested, but interestingly, various cars that are sold in India are a part of it.

What struck my eye here however was that the i10 (made in India) has obtained only 2 stars in the ASEAN NCAP, and has performed miserably.
On the contrary, in the Euro NCAP, it has gained 4 stars out of 5. The only difference I find is that the Euro i10 has side airbags.

Now, does this signify that the ASEAN tests are very hard? Or (I heard from somebody) that the cars made in the west are structurally more sound, despite being the same model. (Only speculation) That for cost cutting, essential components for structural rigidity are avoided.

Please clarify.
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Old 7th May 2014, 00:20   #23
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ASEAN NCAP is as far as I know similar to euro NCAP. Ironically the mou to establish ASEAN ncap was signed in Delhi in 2011, between global ncap and Malaysia. Now ASEAN ncap is applicable in Malaysia, Singapore and the Phillipines.

The ratings are similar, as are the tests on the car. The difference is that if I can remember correctly, euro NCAP is slightly more stringent and also has positive points for additional safety measures.

Most automakers sell cars with top end safety kit in Europe whereas in ASEAN, they only have basic safety trim.
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Old 7th May 2014, 05:49   #24
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Default re: The ASEAN NCAP Crash Test

surprising to see the Honda City score exactly as much as the Ford Fiesta and even a little more in child occupant safety. Though the Fiesta would be my pick of the two, this is just another classic example to show people how the exterior sheet metal thickness does not have a bearing or crash safety.

Also interesting to note that the Hyundai i10 (global car made in India) score only two stars even with dual front airbags. That is simply atrocious from a car designed in the 21st century.

Yes Prakhar it is not just speculation. Just check out the weight difference between an i10 model in India and the same exact model (spec-to-spec) in Europe.
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Old 7th May 2014, 08:15   #25
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Default re: The ASEAN NCAP Crash Test

The Euro NCAP is the most snobbish (strict) of all safety tests including American and Asean, given that any rating over 3/4 must be considered good enough for a car.

What I'm saying is there are many things unknown to the general public about the testing and we must also go by our own research of the car in determining its safety. For example Euro-NCAP reserves it right to withdraw, and assign different ratings as soon as their parameters for safety changes. They also focus on pedestrian safety (to ensure the hood centre has a soft spot) and that there are no rigidly fitted logo's protruding out of the car that could harm a pedestrian. They also check the wing mirrors for 2 way movement for greater human safety. ENCAP cannot enforce all of their safety protocol on manufacturers as costing would blow the roof, they just test a car based on how it was made in the first place, using a certain standard applicable to present day referring to a segment leader of safety as a benchmark.

For eg., 2 airbags were the standard 5 years ago, now it is 4/6. So 1/2 airbag models will lose plenty points. The vehicles will lose points again for lack of ESP or pretensioners or inadequate rear passenger safety which cannot be helped in certain entry level models. The i10 2 airbags model clearly scored 4 stars upon debut, its just that the protocol for safety is updated now. While I understand that sheet metal thickness must be of a certain quality and rigidity, it has no bearing on the ENCAP tests.

It is interesting to note that while heavier vehicles are considered safe, the laws of physics also state that those vehicles have less rolling resistance in an emergency maneuver and upon impact generates greater g-force and damage than a vehicle that's built 'just' right. I'm just pointing to a fact that light-body and heavy-body vehicles both have disadvantages. Hence the ENCAP focusses on steel-impact bars, crumple zones and weight distribution analysis to ensure a car is resistant to tumbles, can crumple where required to convert the velocity into stoppage and to restrict collateral damage to outside of the cabin using high strength steel bars. After this the PRS like seat-belts and SRS like airbags, active neck-restraints are taken into consideration. While the protocol for testing is methodical and complete, I'm afraid that only very few cars have passed it with flying colours. The i20 for example has always gotten 5 stars and was said to be the safest passenger hatch due to its 6 airbags, ESP and ABS as far back as 2008. Volvo's/Merc take it to the next level with their emphasis on active bonnet/radar proximity sensors for greater safety of pedestrians. In India we can only be practical about choosing a balance between owning a car that's easy to live with (maintenance), has a certain level of SRS's yet can fit into a budget. So while we can use the ENCAP ANCAP as a reference, we must also be aware that for ultimate safety there should not be a budget restraint. Etios, Liva, Brio, Estilo etc were never tested by ENCAP, yet they sell/used to sell.

I know its a long boring post but I had to get my point across. Too less research and too much research both could hamper a practical choice based on needs/budget. Use the tests as a reference point but be aware that they have openly specified that ratings can change every year based on new benchmarks. My humble view.
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Old 29th August 2014, 10:44   #26
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

ASEAN NCAP crash tests Tata Vista, 2014 Honda City and Jazz.


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The India-made Tata Vista that is internationally exported to countries like Myanmar, Indonesia and Philippines was the only Indian-origin car to undergo the ASEAN NCAP. It scored 9.24 out of 16 in Adult Occupant Protection (AOP), securing 3 out of 5 stars and 3 out of 5 stars in COP (Child Occupant Protection) with a compliance rating of 53%. The GZX trim that was tested featured both driver and front passenger airbags
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The 2014 Honda Jazz (Honda Fit) and the Honda City scored 15.58 and 15.8 respectively out of 16 in Adult Occupant Protection, both securing 4 stars in AOP and 4 stars in COP with a compliance rating of 71%. Both the Honda Jazz and City are built in Thailand to cater to the local Thai market. While the above ratings were secured by their respective base variants with 2 standard airbags, the 6-airbag top-end variant secured 5 stars in AOP and COP


http://indianautosblog.com/2014/08/a...#ixzz3BkrvRLOj
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Old 29th August 2014, 11:07   #27
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

Thanks to ASEAN-NCAP and Tata for selling the Vista in some South East Asian markets, we now have an NCAP rating for another Indian car. The Vista tested was a 1.4 petrol (which was sold as the Vista Safire 90 with Fiat's 1.4 litre engine in India), made in 2014, and equipped with 2 airbags and ABS.

It scored a decent 3* rating on both adult & child occupant protection parameters. I guess many Tata cars in India based on this platform (Vista, Manza, Zest & Bolt) and equipped with 2 airbags would fare similarly in an NCAP test.

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The full pdf for the Vista is also available:

http://www.aseancap.org/wp-content/u...Tata-Vista.pdf

Last edited by RSR : 29th August 2014 at 11:16.
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Old 19th May 2016, 11:39   #28
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

Volkswagen's Vento 1.2L TSI gets 5 Star ASEAN safety rating.

Just Launched in Malaysia, the Vento 1.2TSI is 'Made In India' equipped with ESC.

Pic- Paultan
ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius & Vento, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Ciaz, Ertiga & Amaze-vw_vento_highline_ext181850x567.jpg


Volkswagen provided technical evidence that its 1.2L variant is equipped with Electronic Stability Control (ESC) system and gets 5 Star rating while the 1.6 P variant received 4-Star rating due to the absence of ESC.
Quote:
Volkswagen Vento obtained 14.51 in AOP category. As Vento’s 1.2L variant is equipped with ESC and its 1.6L variant is not, the Vento received two ratings in which the variant with ESC is awarded with 5-Star AOP while the variant without ESC received 4-Star AOP rating. For COP, the Vento has met 85% compliance within 4-Star range.
The base variants of the VW Vento (1.6) in the Malaysian market still retain a 4/5 star rating owing to the lack of ESC

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http://www.aseancap.org/wp-content/u...9-May-2016.pdf

Last edited by volkman10 : 19th May 2016 at 11:54.
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Old 19th May 2016, 17:09   #29
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

Another feather in the cap of my lovely TSI, what a beautiful car it is

VW might have done it's own set of bad deeds, but when it comes to pure driving pleasure, nothing in the segment beats the TSI with DSG. Only gripe would be alas it was a 1.4 Engine and not 1.2.
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Old 19th May 2016, 17:34   #30
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Default re: Latest ASEAN NCAP Test Results - 5* for Prius, 4* for Swift, Sunny, Pajero Sport & Vento

So, would it be safe to conclude that the 'made in India' export examples quoted in the ASEAN NCAP tests mentioned here, would be the same as the ones the mfr is also currently selling in India? And not the kind of double-speak that Mr. Bhargava of Maruti is currently demonstrating?
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