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Old 17th October 2013, 13:52   #16
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

I think this is a very crude statistic and does not really indicate anything, unless we look at all parameters. We should be looking at
1. Growth/ Decline in purchase of Diesel cars vs. CNG
2. Increase in usage of public transport/ Metro

We should also see if the statistics available earlier and now are correct. Knowing Govt entities, I have serious doubts on the stats provided!!!
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Old 17th October 2013, 14:51   #17
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Most of the comments above are irrelevantly negative

This is a positive report, please take it as one. Overall consumption has decreased. I believe in spite of Gurgaon, NOIDA etc., Delhi proper has seen both an increase in population and personal vehicles. Thus per capita consumption must have come down big time - and this is news to cheer.

Delhiites are probably not traveling less, so the apparent decrease in fuel consumption could be due to:
- Metro usage for longer trips
- Buses getting more riders?? Maybe the painful, dedicated corridors do have some value
- CNG substituting oil
- Refueling in Gurgaon etc.
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Old 17th October 2013, 15:06   #18
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalva View Post
Most of the comments above are irrelevantly negative

This is a positive report, please take it as one. Overall consumption has decreased. .
Overall consumtion has decreased? Where. I do not see it. all I see is the rise in the past 3 years. Consumption decresed drastically once long time back. So we should say consumtion decreased in 2010-2011.
Saying it decreased in 2012-2013 is simply misleading.
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Old 17th October 2013, 15:27   #19
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Nationally, the top-3 consumers of Diesel in India are:

- Army
- Indian Railways
- Indus Towers (3rd party mobile tower operator)

A guesstimate; better un-interrupted has reduced power back consumption by gensets in towers and other facilities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalva View Post
...Delhiites are probably not traveling less, so the apparent decrease in fuel consumption could be due to:
- Metro usage for longer trips
- Buses getting more riders?? Maybe the painful, dedicated corridors do have some value
- CNG substituting oil
- Refueling in Gurgaon etc.
From the same handbook ... there is an alternate statistic:

Quote:
VII. ENERGY AND ELECTRICITY

7.4 Sale of Energy products in Delhi

(’000 M. Tons)

2009-10: 807
2010-11: 825
2011-12: 813
2012-13: 786.99

1. Petrol (M.S.)
2. Diesel
For the same years CNG sale is increasing:

Quote:
500
596
649
695
The numbers speak for themselves

Last edited by aah78 : 18th October 2013 at 01:06. Reason: Posts merged. Please use QUOTE+ / "" MULTI-QUOTE when responding to multiple posts. Thanks!
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Old 17th October 2013, 15:47   #20
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

TSK, Diesel/Petrol are almost commodities, for which demand is nearly 'price inelastic'...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Simple economics not working. Price going up, demand is also going up in the past 2-3 years.
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Old 17th October 2013, 15:54   #21
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeep View Post
TSK, Diesel/Petrol are almost commodities, for which demand is nearly 'price inelastic'...
Correct!
thats why when noopster said simple economics, I questioned the premise.
That said, if there are alternatives eg.
1. Electric car pan India charging network
2. CNG on highways

You will see passenger car as well as freight consumption go down.
For example, in Thailand many trucks and light vans(carry 10 people) run on CNG as its cheaper.
If interstate CNG trucks start running, pollution will go down drastically so will consumption.

The govt just needs to setup around 5 high capacity pumps on Delhi Mumbai route(heavy freight corridor) and you will see many big trucks converting esp if they get excise benefits. Cost of cheaper CNG viz diesel will mean additional cost can be recovered quickly.
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Old 17th October 2013, 16:03   #22
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post

The govt just needs to setup around 5 high capacity pumps on Delhi Mumbai route(heavy freight corridor) and you will see many big trucks converting esp if they get excise benefits. Cost of cheaper CNG viz diesel will mean additional cost can be recovered quickly.
+1. And now that people have seen the benefits of CNG, there would be minimal to nil objection/resistance to the move unlike the first time when it was introduced. But how big a tank will they need to cover the whole distance?
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Old 17th October 2013, 16:10   #23
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
+1. And now that people have seen the benefits of CNG, there would be minimal to nil objection/resistance to the move unlike the first time when it was introduced. But how big a tank will they need to cover the whole distance?
Most big trucks on LNG/CNG have 80 gallon equivalent range in diesel. This comes to 300 liters of diesel, which gives you around 900 kms of range
19 wheelers have more space and hence can have capacity which is equivalent to 500liters of diesel.
So that is again 1000kms of range.
So 5 pumps with 40-50 dispensers each will be enough.
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Old 17th October 2013, 16:26   #24
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by Altocumulus View Post
Fuel is/was mostly consumed by public transport. With the shift to CNG for most of them, reduction in diesel consumption was expected. This was the long term goal and good to see that its taking shape.
Altocumulus,

the shift to CNG happened in 2000 for public transport. If anything, the that move cannot explain a sharp drop in 2010-11, I would be heavily inclined to go with the taxation logic. That alone pushes away trucks completely and gives you massive swings!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
This is just too silly
Consumption reduced drastically in 2010-2011 due to metro rail and also power situation improving drastically.
From then on its a steady rise.
This just shows how statistics can be manipulated.

Another factor could be the rise of diesel price in Delhi as compared to Haryana. All commercial vehicles crossing the border now fill up in Haryana. You rarely see interstate trucks filling up in Delhi
Guruji,

Agree on CNG and taxation. I'm not sure how the metro situation logic applies. Metro has been around since 2003. I doubt 2010-11 had such an impact from the metro (in that year, gurgaon metro started). I think even the power situation had a strong impact on diesel demand - the shortfall of which is ultimately met by gensets as aditya said too.

Last edited by phamilyman : 17th October 2013 at 16:28.
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Old 17th October 2013, 18:23   #25
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by aditya101 View Post
Nationally, the top-3 consumers of Diesel in India are:

- Army
- Indian Railways
- Indus Towers (3rd party mobile tower operator)
Could you share the source of your info. I am surprised that someone like BMTC or BEST is not waayy higher than Indus!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeep View Post
TSK, Diesel/Petrol are almost commodities, for which demand is nearly 'price inelastic'...
Diesel maybe but definitely not Petrol. If petrol goes up...these are the most common trends we see--> cut down on unnecessary driving, switch to diesel cars, switch to CNG/LPG, switch to 2w, switch to metro, switch to smaller cars.

Wheat, Rice & cooking oil are commodities that are price inelastic
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Old 18th October 2013, 00:10   #26
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Air Pollution levels in Delhi have gone up drastically over the last decade.
I don't have a source to quote on this, but that's the general understanding.

And the main factors affecting air pollution in urban zones fossil fuel consumption by industries and vehicles.

Statistics is the devil - it can be used to prove anything right or wrong, lol.
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Old 18th October 2013, 15:00   #27
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by samarth.bhatia View Post
the main factors affecting air pollution in urban zones fossil fuel consumption by industries and vehicles.
In Delhi air pollution has gone up not only due to fossil fuels, but due to the farmers burning the hays/waste of paddy/sugarcane.
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Old 18th October 2013, 17:14   #28
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Could we factor in recession and informed (or reluctant) spending by the customer. Just do not consider the leisure trips / travel. Consider the demand of over consumer goods. Since demand went down, supply went down as well and hence transportation. Also, didn't air travel numbers drop as well?

You could ask, why 2009-2010 didn't project reduced numbers? Answers could be 1. Inventory/Stock 2. More informed spending by customer after losing (or on the verge of losing) his job.

Agree?

Last edited by blue_pulsar : 18th October 2013 at 17:15.
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Old 20th October 2013, 09:38   #29
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mpower View Post
Could you share the source of your info. I am surprised that someone like BMTC or BEST is not waayy higher than Indus!
I got this from an Indus Tower engineer who is incharge of erecting the towers. The reason for high consumption is, that a large number of towers are hoisted on mobile trucks with their own gensets that run 24x7. Trucks are cheaper than high rent costs and also resistance by the populace to allow permanent towers in residential areas.

http://www.financialexpress.com/news...l-fuel/1107208

Due to erratic power supply, about 60% of India’s 500,000 telecom towers depend on diesel generators and according to sector regulator, Trai, consume nearly 2 billion litres of the fuel every year.

http://www.dnaindia.com/money/150157...t-indus-towers

ndus, formed three years ago, hosts 48% of all cell-phone antennas in the country. It also accounts for more than a third of the three lakh telecom towers in India.

In all, it consumes three million units of electricity a year, enough to power more than one million Indian homes and is the single-largest power consuming company in each of the 16 states where it has operations.

While most of the 1.1 lakh towers owned by Indus are powered by the grid, operators have to depend on diesel generators in rural and far-flung areas, such as mountains and jungles. There are around 20,000-30,000 diesel-fuelled telecom towers in the country, according to industry estimates.
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Old 20th October 2013, 13:40   #30
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Default Re: Delhi shows decline in fuel consumption over the last 3 years

Even grid powered towers need Gensets for back up. The telecom industry is now experimenting with alternate sources of power like solar power & wind power.

While the government / industry can create infrastructure along highways and in other towns and cities to dispence CNG, is CNG available in required quantity?

Power plants with thousands of MW of capacity are either idling or running at reduced capacity due to shortage of Natural Gas.

Last edited by rajneeesh : 20th October 2013 at 13:42.
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