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Old 28th September 2015, 20:01   #46
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

It might be too early to judge the car, but I don't see any drastic changes on the exterior except the front grill and the headlights. I hope the interiors seen on the spy pic are on a lower trim and sincerely hope Renault is planning on nicer interiors (leather seats, better plastics, soft touches, auto climate control, auto fold ORVMs, nicer infotainment system, etc.) on top spec's. Otherwise this will bite the dust especially with the CRETA selling so well in the market. The old design (with minimal changes) and dated interiors (with minimal upscaling) will not appeal to the customers as there are other options to choose.
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Old 28th September 2015, 20:50   #47
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

Strangely I still do not see automatic climate control in one of those interior shots. sigh
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Old 30th September 2015, 08:37   #48
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

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Originally Posted by pgsagar View Post
I don't think it is niche any more. I see many around me thinking of replacing their cars with ATs when they next change car. And in case of diesel SUVs, which inherently have hard clutch, I think AT is even more important. See how many people complain of hard Duster clutch. I think stick-shift would be fun on high-revving petrol 2-door coupes like Nissan 370Z etc. But even likes of these cars now come only with AT. Not to start an AT versus MT debate here, but in our chaotic mad-rush traffic, AT makes much more sense. Completely free left arm and left leg and one less chore to bother about while driving and focus on traffic ahead. I just llllove it.

Totally agree with you that ATs are the way forward. Amply established by the fact that every manufacturer and every segment has automatics in it's prtfolio/domain. I was assuming that MTs still account for the bulk of the sales numbers of every model and these customers get swayed by the opulence and creature comforts , the car has to offer. The duster which is looked upon as a semi budjet suv loses out big time on the feel good factor in respect to interiors, paving a way for the creta's strong sales numers, though arguably, the duster comes with better dynamics and mechanicals ( AWD, indep susp, Cruise).
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Old 30th September 2015, 09:09   #49
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

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Originally Posted by igp_79 View Post
the duster comes with better dynamics and mechanicals ( AWD, indep susp, Cruise).
Thats just for one variant of the Duster, not for the entire range.
How many AWDs is Renault selling ?
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Old 30th September 2015, 21:11   #50
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

Fair question. But other cars like the creta or the ecosport or the s cross too show off their mechanical prowess at the higher end and at comparable price points. The point i was trying to make was simply that the duster is not mechanically inferior to it's competitors at any price point... may be superior but not inferior. Where it gets thoroughly beaten is the opulence, creature comforts department. Sorry if i sound like a duster fan. I own one and the car has impressed me. I tried the newer kids on the block as i am out shopping for a new crossover and came away impressed only by the interiors and wishing the duster did well in that department too.
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Old 1st October 2015, 09:42   #51
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

I own the Duster myself, but if it were to come to choose between the Creta and the Duster- I would choose the former. Period.

Both are mechanically sound vehicles, with the Creta actually looking like the money you spent for it.

Just checked Carwale, Creta is pitched directly to the Duster in pricing !! variant to variant.
Will be interesting to see both their sales figures for the next 2-3 months.

Coming back to the topic, here is a link that explains the AMT offering a bit.
http://media.renault.com/global/en-g...?mediaid=71116

This seems to be mated to a 90Hp Petrol , I think that's a great combo.
They really killed the Petrol version here when they launched it without the Safety gear. They should not repeat the same this time around.

Also visited a Renault showroom few days back-as told by the SA, the Auto IS coming in the New year.
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Old 1st October 2015, 09:47   #52
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

I also don't understand why they are calling it the AMT , from the description in that link it looks like a plain jane Auto. whats missing?

Ooops: this AMT will not come for the Duster, but is coming for the rest of the range.
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Old 2nd October 2015, 15:29   #53
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

Renault Duster facelift to get AMT

Likely to be called the Duster Easy-R, the automatic version will get AMT and not DCT to keep costs down. March 2016 launch.

Quote:
Likely to be badged the Duster Easy-R, this will be the first Renault-badged product to come with an automated manual gearbox, globally. Renault's sister brand Dacia showcased the AMT gearbox at this year's Frankfurt motor show which is aimed at the affordable end of the Dacia / Renault product range around the world.

In fact, affordability is the main reason why Renault has chosen the AMT option instead of the far more expensive and complex dual-clutch transmission. Whilst the DCT will offer a far smoother drive than the AMT, the cost difference between the two transmissions was working out to upwards of Rs two lakh to the car buyer

Name:  0_468_700_http___172_17_115_180_82_ExtraImages_20151002124643_dust2 copy.jpg
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http://www.autocarindia.com/auto-new...mt-397829.aspx

Last edited by volkman10 : 2nd October 2015 at 15:32.
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Old 2nd October 2015, 16:49   #54
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Renault Duster facelift to get AMT

Likely to be called the Duster Easy-R, the automatic version will get AMT and not DCT to keep costs down. March 2016 launch.
Surprised that they think a 15 to 17 lakh buyer will accept a Duster with an AMT in the name of an Automatic. Having driven lots of these, I have come to a conclusion that it's okay for a Celerio or an Alto to have an AMT, move up the ladder and the expectations increase.

When I went to test drive an AMT Diesel Zest, I was left high and dry when it came to gearshifts for a 9 lakh rupee on road car, at the same time, I was okay with the Celerio at 4.8 lakhs. At 15 to 17 lakhs, with Creta already present which has a 6 speed torque converter, a 6 speed Torque Converter based XUV5oo on the cards, add those bland interiors and nothingness when it came to features as compared to competition to the equation, I see this a product planning failure from the start.

Use a thing called Torque Converter Mr Renault, I am sure naam suna hoga, Torque Converter, Torque Converter.

Last edited by humyum : 2nd October 2015 at 16:51.
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Old 2nd October 2015, 22:23   #55
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

From past few months I have been trying hard to fight against the tide and not end up with creta automatic. But after reading this, duster goes straight out of my list. If they go ahead and lunch it with AMT I seriously wish that the duster truly gets, for the lack of better words, "dusted" .
Till how long are these manufacturers going to take us for a ride? I totally agree that AMT makes sense for budget cars but not for the ones costing over 1.5 million bucks. Some where in the article it's mentioned that the price difference for the DCT transmission is working out be over 2 lakhs, I wonder then how are Ford and vw able able to provide DCT transmissions in cars starting from as low as 7.8 lakhs on road? If not DCT then how about torque converters, Even brio has got a torque converter, Scorpio has got one as well.

AMT in such an expensive car is a blasphemous unless it's a red hot Italian super car named after a fighting bull of course

Last edited by fuelinmyveins : 2nd October 2015 at 22:25.
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Old 3rd October 2015, 12:46   #56
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

So they cheaped out. I am at a complete loss at understanding the strategies of Renault India. Are they completely out of sync with the market? Have they cocooned themselves in a sight/ sound proof shell? Have the sarkari babus taken the company over? Why such incomprehensible levels of absurdity in product planning?
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Old 3rd October 2015, 12:58   #57
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

I like the idea of an AMT Duster. Especially if it is offered in both AWD versions. Looking forward to the facelift too, which will hopefully make better perceived value for money based on the spruced-up interiors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
When I went to test drive an AMT Diesel Zest, I was left high and dry when it came to gearshifts for a 9 lakh rupee on road car, at the same time, I was okay with the Celerio at 4.8 lakhs. At 15 to 17 lakhs, with Creta already present which has a 6 speed torque converter, a 6 speed Torque Converter based XUV5oo on the cards, add those bland interiors and nothingness when it came to features as compared to competition to the equation, I see this a product planning failure from the start.
Not sure what your current ride is to influence your driving style, or what you mean by "high and dry" which seems quite out of place in this context.

From the reviews it has been concluded that AMT works best in high-torque applications such as diesels. A specific example was the AMT Celerio (or Alto?) vs the AMT in the Zest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fuelinmyveins View Post
I wonder then how are Ford and vw able able to provide DCT transmissions in cars starting from as low as 7.8 lakhs on road?
I agree, but there is still a significant difference between the prices of equivalent Manual and AT in these cars, which is what the AMT is trying to negate.

Torque converters also come with a whole lot of baggage in terms of added mechanical complexity and hence losses. Let's not even get started with the cost of Dual Clutch, and how poorly the shifts are managed in Ford's application of it. VW DSGs are great, but then they do tend to conk off quite inconveniently.

In the 90's Wrigleys introduced numerous different chewing gum varieties under different names and lots of advertising. The idea was (from an interview) to habituate Indians to chewing gum before introducing the more expensive sugar-free varieties. Today Orbit is one of the most visible (and possibly best selling) chewing gums in urban India, and is sugar-free. AMT is a lower cost way of introducing automatics to the greater masses.

A difference of a lakh at 17L will still influence the buying decision of most Indians - we are that price conscious.
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Old 3rd October 2015, 17:23   #58
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

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Originally Posted by VeluM View Post
I like the idea of an AMT Duster. Especially if it is offered in both AWD versions. Looking forward to the facelift too, which will hopefully make better perceived value for money based on the spruced-up interiors.



Not sure what your current ride is to influence your driving style, or what you mean by "high and dry" which seems quite out of place in this context.

From the reviews it has been concluded that AMT works best in high-torque applications such as diesels. A specific example was the AMT Celerio (or Alto?) vs the AMT in the Zest.



I agree, but there is still a significant difference between the prices of equivalent Manual and AT in these cars, which is what the AMT is trying to negate.

Torque converters also come with a whole lot of baggage in terms of added mechanical complexity and hence losses. Let's not even get started with the cost of Dual Clutch, and how poorly the shifts are managed in Ford's application of it. VW DSGs are great, but then they do tend to conk off quite inconveniently.

In the 90's Wrigleys introduced numerous different chewing gum varieties under different names and lots of advertising. The idea was (from an interview) to habituate Indians to chewing gum before introducing the more expensive sugar-free varieties. Today Orbit is one of the most visible (and possibly best selling) chewing gums in urban India, and is sugar-free. AMT is a lower cost way of introducing automatics to the greater masses.

A difference of a lakh at 17L will still influence the buying decision of most Indians - we are that price conscious.
I think you do have a point, after all. Personally, I prefer torque converter. Best over all. I mean extremely reliable, and of late, newer ones with lock-up clutch are best of both worlds. Even FE on newer ones are pretty close to MTs.

Was never a fan of DSGs. In addition to that notorious unreliability, they jerk and shudder in low speed traffic crawls (which is why people buy ATs in the first place). Wonder what is all the fuss about DSGs then. CVTs are known for rubber band effect. That only leaves us with AMT. I think Lamborghini also uses AMT, albeit a very refined one, I'm sure. But, AMT nevertheless. Now, if AMT can deliver the goods, then why not? They score good on performance and FE front. And the best thing about AMT is, it piggy-rides the conventional MT gearbox and hence repairs would be very easy. Should something go wrong, just take the worn AMT unit out, put in a new one and, voila! You are back in business. No need to lay a finger on the gearbox, unlike TCs, DSGs or CVTs. Isn't that splendid?
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Old 3rd October 2015, 17:48   #59
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Duster being a capable mini SUV, TC auto boxes would have made more sense. With torque multiplication, it can provide a low ratio equivalent torque for steep climbs. This would have made the AWD version more attractive.
It is quite unfortunate that they over priced the car to such an extend that there is no room to price a TC or DCT version properly. I just hope the competition intensifies to force the manufacturers provide better products at proper prices.
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Old 3rd October 2015, 18:12   #60
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Default Re: Rumour - Duster to get an automatic transmission in 2015

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Originally Posted by VeluM View Post
Torque converters also come with a whole lot of baggage in terms of added mechanical complexity and hence losses. Let's not even get started with the cost of Dual Clutch, and how poorly the shifts are managed in Ford's application of it. VW DSGs are great, but then they do tend to conk off quite inconveniently.

A difference of a lakh at 17L will still influence the buying decision of most Indians - we are that price conscious.
A torque converter is the most common, most reliable and most maintenance free AT technology out there. If by baggage you mean transmission losses then yes, it is less fuel efficient.

Most manufacturers are putting a lot of effort into making their DCTs more reliable because it is superior to TCs in shift quality and fuel efficiency.

I disagree that a 17l customer will care for a lakh here or there. But he will care for a better experience. In fact a DCT would have given Renault a leg up in the technology stakes against the Creta. An AMT at that price won't work as there is already a feeling that the Duster is overpriced.
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