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Old 15th July 2014, 12:37   #76
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Default re: Indian Government plans complete crash test of all cars

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Originally Posted by Cyrus_the_virus View Post
Warning: Rant!
I think it's high time the government steps down from it's double standards. If they want to see manufacturers improve safety system, they need to stop this ridiculous pre-independence "car is a luxury" style horrendous taxing system. Car is no longer a luxury. It is almost a necessity if not a non ignorable need.
When per capita car ownership in India is 41 per 1,000 people, it is not a mass public good (like cellphones) that deserves lower taxes. Of all things the govt. can lower prices on, cars aren't on the priority list. That is just the reality of living in a poor country such as India. The logic is - if you're fortunate enough to own a car, you can pay the tax. And it applies to everything from restaurant meals to income taxes.
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Old 16th July 2014, 13:34   #77
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Default re: Indian Government plans complete crash test of all cars

Thank You! Better late than never, the Mandatory Safety Equipment List will contain something as first line of Safety rather than stuffs like High Mount Stop Lamp etc.
When I passed out from College in 2005, and started getting interested towards Automotives - that was the era when CRDi and Turbo were being introduced in B/C Segment cars, and I used to think when new Technology Engines are making cars faster and powerful, why not so serious attempts are being taken to Stop those cars faster, and also to make them more sturdier, safer.
Till a couple of years ago, few cars (spark, alto for ex.) did not even had a left side mirror, leave apart the other aspects. And when I suggested a friend of my Dad to buy a higher model of Spark so that He could get some essentials including Left Mirror, his bland reply was "yar left mirror me kaun dekhega. waise bhi driver ne chalani hai car!!!" (Who cares for a Left Mirror, anyways the Chauffeur will be driving the car all the time). A few years later, in the outskirts of Hyderabad, I saw a Scorpio Turbo2.6' losing the traction completely and sliding down the road on a wet surface+harsh braking scenario. So bad! 120bhp, Turbo, CRDi, Power Steering+Windows, 205ish Tyres, all those goodies come standard, but not a 20k ABS.
And I felt, where are we upto! But not anymore.... No more ABS+Driver Side Airbag in 2nd from Topmodel, ABS+Dual Front Airbags in Top End kinda confusing features list. A very welcome move I must say! Good for everyone.
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Old 6th August 2014, 05:30   #78
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Default GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

The Government of India is in the process of its plan to come up with an India-specific crash test rating called "Bharat New Vehicle Safety Assessment program (BNVSA)". The GOI is planning to make this crash test mandatory for all car manufacturers. The government is also planning to open two crash test facilities in the country for this purpose.

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“We have had discussions with the government on the Bharat New Vehicle Safety Assessment program (BNVSA). Until now, the problem was the absence of a crash test facility. We expect one by the end of this year and another by early next year. Once this happens, some may go for BNVSA star rating on voluntary basis,” said K. K. Gandhi, Executive Director (Tech), Society of Indian Automobile Manufacturers (SIAM).
Important Points :
1. GOI plans to open one of the two of its crash test facilities by this year-end. The other facility will be operational in early 2015.
2. Cars may have to implement minimum crash safety features by January-2015.
3. The BNVSA rating will be given on the scale of one two five stars ala NCAP.
4. Officials believe Toyota Etios is the only mid size car that may pass the test.

Source :
http://www.thehindu.com/business/Ind...cle6284705.ece

Last edited by Koenigsegg220 : 6th August 2014 at 05:33.
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Old 6th August 2014, 07:13   #79
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Some excerpts from the linked article, with my comments:

Quote:
"...My mandate is road safety. We want Indians to survive...." said a senior official of the Ministry of Roads and National Highways.
I'd like to know what the ministry - and this official - are doing about improving safety features on trucks that ply the highways. You know, the usual ones - working tail-lamps, underrun protection, healthy tires, etc.

I'd like to know what they're doing to educate/enforce basic rules, such as not driving the wrong way on a highway, etc.

I'd like to know statistics of how many deaths/accidents were caused by the absence of safety features in cars, and how many of them were due to other factors (overloaded cars, no seat belts worn).

I'm not opposed to having safety features, but I believe there's a separate angle of education/enforcement that's also required. No amount of safety features will protect a person in the front seat when the person behind hasn't buckled up. Safety features might also not matter if you have a face to face collision with a tractor coming the wrong way on a highway. I'd like to see plans for that education and enforcement first.

Quote:
The official pointed out that cars being made for exports pass the New Car Assessment Programme (NCAP) norms whereas those for Indian customers do not have these features. "...I don’t see why Indian customers should be short-changed," he said.
I applaud this attitude - we've all seen various threads/posts that highlight this discrepancy with (nearly) all manufacturers. However, rather than yet another safety rating mechanism, I'd just ask that the government enforce a rule that manufacturers cannot advertise NCAP ratings in India if the vehicle homologated with ARAI is different from what NCAP tested. Or something that promotes transparency. Otherwise, why don't we set up an NCAP lab here (like the Latin/ASEAN NCAPs), instead of trying to wing our own version? "Indian NCAP" sounds more tied-in to the international effort than "BNVSA".

Quote:
Automakers complain that if they were to incorporate most of the safety features, car prices could rise by 15 per cent to 20 per cent for the base model with one or two star rating.
This raises the usual dilemma - affordable transport for more, or pricier transport for fewer? Notwithstanding the fact that safety systems like ABS and airbags aren't actually that costly to implement (tens of thousands at the most), and is not the scare-mongering 15-20% higher that automakers claim. Secondly, how can they say the price goes up by a percentage of the car value when the safety systems are the same and must therefore cost roughly the same (e.g. the same 2-6 airbags and dual/four channel ABS in an Eon or Vento)?

Last edited by arunphilip : 6th August 2014 at 07:15.
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Old 6th August 2014, 07:34   #80
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

I welcome the govt's move.

The allegation on pricing is outright BS. 20% increase in a mid-sized sedan (1-1.5 lakh) due to safety? because they sent a handful of cars for crash testing?

Sorry - the author of that article should read TBHP and be better informed:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...-debunked.html (Safety Features - Myths on costs debunked)

Without actually doing a crash test, why are they claiming Etios is the only sedan passing it? Hello? They should've googled other cars' NCAP rating. This is a crap article - guess it didnt go through Hindu's usually impeccable standards of quality.
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Old 6th August 2014, 07:57   #81
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Welcome move by Govt.

I read this article in The Hindu today and I found the headline to be loaded. I feel they shouldn't have concentrated on the increase in price but the positive change this rule can bring.

Mandatory crash tests will push car prices up for sure. Because manufacturers currently save cost on the crash structure stating lack of safety laws here. But that's not the thing to concentrate here. What about the lives that will be saved? Or the saving on cost of hospitalization and insurance? Or being able to get back to work sooner after a bad crash?

Hope this gets through from the clutches of the manufacturer's lobbies. Its high time all new cars get air bags, crumple zones and electronic safety control.

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Even I am confused about the claim that Government officials believe Toyota’s Etios is the only mid segment car to have passed the crash test.

Source
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Old 6th August 2014, 08:15   #82
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Probably the author of the Article was influenced by Toyota or a fan boy to have written that line about Etios being the safest car in that segment.

Its a nice move but then what is the authenticity of such a facility in India. Going by the way things work in our country, I will find it hard to digest such ratings specially if they differ from international ratings.

Lastly I do agree that the Govt should rather concentrate on improving a whole lot of other factors on our roads which would prevent many more lives rather than these ratings. As a simple example Helmet is still not complusory or the rule is enforced properly in most cities and towns. And this list can just go on. Regarding cars, they could have rather started with making safety features compulsory across all models.
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Old 6th August 2014, 09:19   #83
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Probably the author of the Article was influenced by Toyota or a fan boy to have written that line about Etios being the safest car in that segment.
I've seen a lot of ambiguous reporting happening in the last few years, probably because the new breed of journalists have not understood the usage of punctuations at the right places. No offense to any young journalists in this forum, but it is a sad fact that the majority of the youngsters find it difficult to write a long paragraph without grammatical errors. This can be seen in other jobs as well though the impact of bad grammar is not really a big deal in most cases except written media. The line just before the confusing remark was a statement from Toyota spokesperson. So it is possible that even this line was actually something the Toyota spokesperson said and not necessarily by any Government official.

Quote:
We welcome the decision to make crash tests mandatory. Our market should be on a par with global standards in every aspect, including safety. This would help us reduce fatalities on the roads which are a matter of concern to us,” said a Toyota spokesperson. Government officials believe Toyota’s Etios is the only mid-segment car in India to have passed the crash test.

Last edited by zenren : 6th August 2014 at 09:23.
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Old 6th August 2014, 10:20   #84
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

A welcome move from GOI and quite inevitable too. I don't pay much heed to the 15-20% hike - may be true for the likes of Alto or i10 - as in the cost of Airbags are kind of fixed regardless of the cars, so the price differential will be more for cars costing less.

Also GOI should implement some schemes where the star rating linked directly to the annual insurance premium. This would be a win-win situation for the companies and the public, as there would be direct incentive to go for a safe vehicle.
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Old 6th August 2014, 10:28   #85
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Another excuse to fleece car buyers. How can a few test cars crashed raise the price by a whopping 20 per cent? Even 1 per cent increase is enough to cover the costs. It's not like they crash a given model from every lot. And what is this veiled advertisement for the damp squib Etios? Now gullible public will queue up before Toyota show rooms. Smart move.

Last edited by pgsagar : 6th August 2014 at 10:29.
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Old 6th August 2014, 10:32   #86
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Pro-active governance at play here. Safety has been a neglected aspect on our roads for far too long. Forget the shoddily written article, the BNVSA is a small step in the right direction. Even cars that have an acceptable NCAP crash rating are built to a cost here in India.

Car makers will cry foul at the increasing costs but a baseline level of safety should be made non-negotiable. Let them work around that.
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Old 6th August 2014, 10:36   #87
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Default re: Indian Government plans complete crash test of all cars

In a bid to improve India's poor road safety record, the Government has announced that it will make safety features such as airbags and anti-lock braking system (ABS) compulsory on all cars from 2017. Additionally, crash tests will also be made mandatory. In view of the new safety norms that cars will have to meet, many manufacturers could soon be forced to scrap some of their older models.

Link to Team-BHP News Article
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Old 6th August 2014, 10:52   #88
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" 4. Officials believe Toyota Etios is the only mid size car that may pass the test. "
Well well. This is a joke! I myself own an Etios Liva & i know how light the car is. They should probably look up the safety ratings of other cars in that segment before they jump to conclusions like that.
Maybe they thought the bigger the car is, the more safer it'll be?
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Old 6th August 2014, 11:25   #89
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Good move but cannot digest the fact that the price increase will be based on percentage terms. You fit the same system to a car for all its versions like the VXi, LXi, ZXi, GXi, PGTFXi or whatever Xi, but the cost of the system is same. Hence the price increase should be a flat rate, at least for the versions of the same car. Practically, part sharing over the same segment will further eliminate this problem. More than blaming manufacturers over this statement, I think it is an uninformed statement made by the officials. But Toyota Etios? Over all others? How & why?

I believe that when the plans take shape, price increase will not be up to the extent projected. After all, we will still be a price sensitive market.
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Old 6th August 2014, 12:00   #90
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Default Re: GOI to come up with BNVSA rating. Car prices may go up 15-20% from January-2015

Points to ponder -

-> More company drivers / auto (Ford EcoSport Toppled by Reviewer - Emergency Assist Dhamaka)journalists will total new cars rather than any Indian NCAP facilities.
-> Top end models' price should not increase - they have the safety kit already
-> For smaller cars, safety kit version was rarely sold - they'll have volumes of scale that were previously not there at all, thus bringing the cost down dramatically.
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