Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 27th March 2014, 12:41   #241
Senior - BHPian
 
coolclouds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Garden City
Posts: 1,790
Thanked: 513 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

As every year, my family is visiting Bangalore for a week in their KL registered car during this vacation. So far, never stopped for a checking during our extensive city travel. This time, I'll take it in front of these RTOs to see how a genuine tourist treated
coolclouds is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 27th March 2014, 13:45   #242
Senior - BHPian
 
lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tura
Posts: 1,308
Thanked: 641 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
Did you see my second point? Create differential options for people visiting for upto a year.
But present options is netting more revenue for RTO and state of Karnatak. So why should they bother. Surely this is a far more softer solution and also gives an outlet for the natural envy of the sons-of-the-soil for those uppity Itvity outsiders. So many targets fallen with one arrow.

My solution to this issue would be for all outstation cars to roam around with the Karnataka/Kannada Rakshana Vedike badge as seen on a Pajero registered in Pondicherry.
lurker is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 27th March 2014, 14:11   #243
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,894
Thanked: 9,744 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker View Post
But present options is netting more revenue for RTO and state of Karnatak. So why should they bother. Surely this is a far more softer solution and also gives an outlet for the natural envy of the sons-of-the-soil for those uppity Itvity outsiders. So many targets fallen with one arrow.

My solution to this issue would be for all outstation cars to roam around with the Karnataka/Kannada Rakshana Vedike badge as seen on a Pajero registered in Pondicherry.
My idea was to create a system to track out of state cars and to clearly highlight a way to ensure visitors could be clearly defined by the system


Quote:
Originally Posted by aroonanand View Post
How different is it from the permits / entry tax that cabs or commercial vehicles pay for inter state travel?

Isnt this contradictory to the right of movement for personal vehicles across India (RTO's actions are also in the same direction though)?

IMHO, the best solution would be to link the systems of RTOs across the country (if we can have a centralized PAN / Aadhaar system, why not for RTO) and if there is a movement from a state to another, a pro-rata credit should be transferred from the state of registration (transferor state) to the transferee state and any difference to be collected or credited within 30 days of an application being made. So if one shifts from Chennai to Bangalore, one has to pay a difference of ~5-6% to the Karnataka RTO. On the contrary, if one were to move from Bangalore to Chennai, it would result in a refund as the tax rates in Chennai are lower. This becomes simpler if LTT rates are standardized across India as there would be no refund / collection but just a transfer between RTOs.


Till such time there is a seamless and integrated system, these issues will come up.
LTT is a valid system to compensate for the laziness and inefficiency in tracking car tax payments. If the RTO use technology and levy prohibitive fines, they could use automated number plate readers to track and stop non tax payers. But i am dreaming! This is what they do in the UK

The best solution would be to centralise the entire RTO and road tax collection system. I would do away with the whole state registration concept.
ajmat is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 27th March 2014, 14:19   #244
Senior - BHPian
 
lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tura
Posts: 1,308
Thanked: 641 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
My idea was to create a system to track out of state cars and to clearly highlight a way to ensure visitors could be clearly defined by the system
Your idea is very much appreciated, but I doubt the idea of the local RTOs are more in line with the pointers above.

Frankly a whip should be cracked to avoid regionalism and nip it in the bud. KA can get away with it because it is they who host a large floating population from other states and not vice-versa. A saving grace now due to the hard work of another son of karnataka viz Shri Nandan Nilekani is that we all have aadhar-linked bank accounts. Maybe a more pro-active Govt of India or Supreme Court could ask all the aggrieved to submit their Aadhar numbers along with a PIL and they could in turn cut funds from KAs central pool to the tune of the funds collected by RTO and disburse it directly into bank a/c's of the complainants. This would give respite to such blackmail. Ofcourse the local cops are still free to arrest/blackmail/tear apart toll receipts/levy fine which is due to them and a right risk that the uppity itvity out-of-stationers would have to bear for operating in that state.
lurker is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 27th March 2014, 14:24   #245
Senior - BHPian
 
srishiva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 3,580
Thanked: 823 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker View Post
But present options is netting more revenue for RTO and state of Karnatak. So why should they bother. Surely this is a far more softer solution and also gives an outlet for the natural envy of the sons-of-the-soil for those uppity Itvity outsiders. So many targets fallen with one arrow.

My solution to this issue would be for all outstation cars to roam around with the Karnataka/Kannada Rakshana Vedike badge as seen on a Pajero registered in Pondicherry.
Natural envy ? Its taking it a little too far. You might be suffering from some kind of superiority complex
srishiva is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 14:50   #246
Senior - BHPian
 
lurker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tura
Posts: 1,308
Thanked: 641 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Yes. Yes sir. I am a person of many faults and complexes, but thankfully all those complexes have not resulted me in penalizing out-of-station cars and confiscating cars and forcing owners to cough up huge sums of money as LTT. But the KA RTO has no faults and their eyes are right on the money.
lurker is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 14:52   #247
Senior - BHPian
 
shashank.nk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,520
Thanked: 732 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Is this move by KA RTO a first in the country or has it happened before too ? I vaguely remember reading somehwere that AP RTO were targeting all out-station cars too. Don't recollect when or where I read it.
shashank.nk is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 15:04   #248
Senior - BHPian
 
coolclouds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Garden City
Posts: 1,790
Thanked: 513 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by shashank.nk View Post
Is this move by KA RTO a first in the country or has it happened before too ? I vaguely remember reading somehwere that AP RTO were targeting all out-station cars too. Don't recollect when or where I read it.
KA RTO has this out of state vehicle check and tax collection from as early as 2002/2003 at least. Now the hunt is on a large scale may be due to year end pressure.
coolclouds is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 15:13   #249
Senior - BHPian
 
shashank.nk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,520
Thanked: 732 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolclouds View Post
Now the hunt is on a large scale may be due to year end pressure.
Yes. I see traffic police at every other corner these days. I thought its normal before Dasara,Diwali and Ugadi,3 of the biggest festivals here. Hopefully this will ease out after the financial year end.

Last edited by shashank.nk : 27th March 2014 at 15:15.
shashank.nk is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 15:13   #250
Senior - BHPian
 
suresh_gs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: KA-01 / TN-22
Posts: 1,935
Thanked: 1,159 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Hi all

Saw this article in the deccan herald. No wonder the state govt is going on a war footing to meet the target

Name:  motor.JPG
Views: 1159
Size:  130.4 KB
suresh_gs is online now  
Old 27th March 2014, 15:31   #251
BHPian
 
man_and_machine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 428
Thanked: 215 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

When ever you cross into KA from any state there is always a commercial check post for RTO commercial vehicles where they check for tax. Say near Penukonda and Hindupur for AP, Housr for KA similarly for KL etc. Would it not be possible to get some "govt" recepit at the check post indicating your car was allowed/seen/passed/chekced at this check post on the date you enter the state. Just a question, that way you have an RTO stamped document to prove when you crossed the RTO limits. The law can't be based on fuel bills, toll bills(what if there are not tolls). The law needs to be specific what can be done as an accepted document and the enforcing authority to issue it, like a birth certificate, or a train ticket. If its an offence to travel without a ticket, there needs to be an official authority to issue a valid ticket. In theory the traffic police need to prove that the vehicle is violating a rule, lack of proof otherwise does not make you an offender (again in theory). Like a breath analyzer to prove you are drunk while driving. Need to fidn out which is such a document that can be got and can be shown to avoid the harrassment. Anybody know someone in RTO?
man_and_machine is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 16:29   #252
Senior - BHPian
 
anujmishra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,271
Thanked: 338 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
How many KA registered cars head out to TN and KL every weekend or alternate weekend?
Well, this is entirely different issue. But the question is, which state he is staying? How many days car in which state. For short term anybody heading out of KA they will be called as tourists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by suresh_gs View Post
The basic problem here is the ridiculously high tax slab structure followed by pathetic infrastructure that is forcing people to violate.
I agree with you point about pathetic infrastructure. That is political issue. But this should not be reason to violate. I am not agreeing to this. Does this means if NE states have pathetic infrastructure they all residents should buy car from WB, OR or BR.

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolclouds View Post
A person known to me was using a KL registered Sokda way back in 2002/2003 in Bangalore. RTO guys kept an eye on this vehicle shuttling between kids school and Mantri apartment off Bannarghatta road for over a month and caught him with solid proof and directed him to pay tax.
This cannot be solution to put one person per car per month to catch the violation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdman View Post
If we were on an annual road tax cycle, then it would be fair to start paying tax to the correct State at renewal. But, the "life time road tax" is just criminal robbery. It just makes it easier for the States to fleece you over and over again.
There is urgent need to review our ancient rules and make them friendly for the people. Even if this is the case there will be violators.
You can easily find in news, how many people running without insurance on our road as we have to pay this money yearly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benbsb29 View Post
Anuj, as i said in my post, if a person can prove he has not been staying in Bangalore for an extended period of time at a stretch, he is not an offender.
Yes it was there before. But his job status and residence should be criteria to pay the tax in particular state. Not his tourist credentials.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benbsb29 View Post
Freedom of movement is guaranteed by the constitution, and it is not upto a state government to upturn that.
Well, Freedom is still there for person not for movable property or car. KA has not put tax for out of state persons staying in the state. Constitution is for person not for car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benbsb29 View Post
Lets take an example where you were on one of your driving trips to KL, and your Safari was confiscated despite you pleading you were on a tourist trip.
Well, that will be unfortunate incident. Atleast, I can say that I am working in KA not in KL. Usual proofs being grossly misused by violators and this will surely lead inconvenience to normal tourists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benbsb29 View Post
Give people a chance to pay for a yearly tax option, and you would see people gladly pay up. Despite this if they don't, then wield the stick.
I welcome such move if any by government.
anujmishra is offline  
Old 27th March 2014, 17:06   #253
BHPian
 
bdman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: BLR/COK/LAX
Posts: 120
Thanked: 47 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by anujmishra View Post
There is urgent need to review our ancient rules and make them friendly for the people. Even if this is the case there will be violators.
You can easily find in news, how many people running without insurance on our road as we have to pay this money yearly.
If people dont comply with a law, that means it is an enforcement issue. Does not mean the Govt should go and change the law to screw the people. People dont pay income tax either. Does that mean the govt should go create a "lifetime income tax" which is paid the moment a baby is born?
bdman is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 27th March 2014, 17:32   #254
Team-BHP Support
 
benbsb29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 8,025
Thanked: 3,483 Times
Default Re: Beware 'Out of State' cars: RTO (Bangalore) taxation amendment from 28th Feb, 201

Quote:
Originally Posted by anujmishra View Post
This cannot be solution to put one person per car per month to catch the violation.

Yes it was there before. But his job status and residence should be criteria to pay the tax in particular state. Not his tourist credentials.

Well, that will be unfortunate incident. Atleast, I can say that I am working in KA not in KL. Usual proofs being grossly misused by violators and this will surely lead inconvenience to normal tourists.
I am not sure if you are defending coz you believe this is right, or just to support your stance. However, i would put myself in the position of those who are genuinely affected and consider the hardship.

My retired parents who may possibly drive down to Bangalore to spend a month or more with us would not be able to prove they are working in a particular state. Last thing i would want is their car to be confiscated, and then asked to prove. This was just quoted as an example.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdman View Post
If people dont comply with a law, that means it is an enforcement issue. Does not mean the Govt should go and change the law to screw the people. People dont pay income tax either. Does that mean the govt should go create a "lifetime income tax" which is paid the moment a baby is born?
Well said!
benbsb29 is online now  
Old 27th March 2014, 18:20   #255
Distinguished - BHPian
 
CrAzY dRiVeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore / TVM
Posts: 8,974
Thanked: 16,772 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by anujmishra View Post
Well, this is entirely different issue. But the question is, which state he is staying? How many days car in which state. For short term anybody heading out of KA they will be called as tourists.
I am not paying road tax to work in Karnataka, I am paying tax to use my car on Karnataka roads.

So how do it matter where we work as long as the person has valid documents to prove his short term stay? And why is it morally and ethically wrong? Just because we 'work' here?

(I'm being specific to the 1 month rule. Not supporting people who don't pay up even after 11 months continuos stay)

Somehow sadly- I am getting a negative vibe that outsiders are not welcome to work here. And if they do, they need to 'pay up' for it. This even though- I have more friends here than even my home state. And your post, my friend, is filled with that attitude is what I feel.

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 27th March 2014 at 18:42.
CrAzY dRiVeR is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Buy car in state or out of state (Major price difference) autoenthusiast The Indian Car Scene 49 14th July 2017 01:21
Karnataka RTO - sms RTO to get Vehicle details 71Convertible The Indian Car Scene 83 8th October 2016 08:09
Where should I sell the car: State of Registration or Current State? m_upreti The Indian Car Scene 50 12th July 2016 17:38
RTO problems for transfering in own state vipinshetty The Indian Car Scene 5 20th February 2013 17:13


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 09:24.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks